Review and Measurements of Paradigm PW-Link Streamer/DAC

[batfunk]

Hi ! Does anyone notice unusual audio cuts during playback with Spotify connect since Last play-fi patch (7. 0.0.1227)? I use cabled connection.
Thanks !

 

[musicguy]

Just an update after using the ML Unison for a week or so:

I figured out I can use the digital record out on my Denon and then set the recording source to my actual source and the regular source to the ML Unison, this way I'm using it through the digital in and out. There seems to be a definite improvement in sound, it's a bit less harsh, very nice and smooth, almost sounds "slower." I did not have a chance to run ARC again with this digital setup.

Another thing I noticed, when using play-fi it defaults to analog mode. Bummer. I don't have to use play-fi but I had kinda gotten use to it. It would be nice to cut out all the extra loops when I'm just casting from Tidal.

 

[Rebelhifi]

Just an update after using the ML Unison for a week or so:

I figured out I can use the digital record out on my Denon and then set the recording source to my actual source and the regular source to the ML Unison, this way I'm using it through the digital in and out. There seems to be a definite improvement in sound, it's a bit less harsh, very nice and smooth, almost sounds "slower." I did not have a chance to run ARC again with this digital setup.

Another thing I noticed, when using play-fi it defaults to analog mode. Bummer. I don't have to use play-fi but I had kinda gotten use to it. It would be nice to cut out all the extra loops when I'm just casting from Tidal.

As Amir tested on the all digital, the best performance is to keep a couple of clicks below max volume on the PW link.

 

[musicguy]

As Amir tested on the all digital, the best performance is to keep a couple of clicks below max volume on the PW link.

Yes, I read the review, I'm 2 to 4 clicks below max, depending on the source. Thanks.

I did a bit more testing today, I was wrong about play-fi, it does work in this configuration, I just have done something wrong yesterday. Also, I am still using the analog input, my Denon doesn't up-convert so I need it for the Phono stage. The Unison switches automatically between the two, I can't seem to find a way to do it manually, apparently the button on the front only switches between streaming inputs and the rear panel inputs. And I'm having issues with Airplay, I was only able to get it to work once, itunes doesn't see it as an available device now, I'm not sure why.

I ran ARC using today in the new configuration, I had the volume slightly lower so I'm not sure if the differences were due to that or the outputs but there were slight differences in the measurements. I also changed the parameters a bit on the correction. On the image below, the left is my original setup with analog in/out and the right is with digital in/out.

I think I'm going to sign off of this thread for now, this has been a fun experiment. Thanks for all the tips.

 

[ripmixburn]

Do any PW Link owners have the equipment to measure the TOSLINK output of the unit? I’m using TOSLINK in and out and there seems to be some serious dynamic range compression happening at 90% volume. Would love to know exactly how many ticks from top I need to attenuate, or if it's unavoidable. Paradigm said that at max volume all component distort (but preamps?). I'm sending audio into it via a Squeezebox Box Touch TOSLINK.

 

[TonyRancid]

If I use Qobuz through play-fi, is it limited to 44.1mHz MP3?
Is there any information about the sample rate used in the ARC part?
Thanks!

 

[batfunk]

Hi ! Pw link accept files up to 24 bits 192 khz but downsample them automatically to 48 khz. If you don't want a gap of 5 s beetween tracks(downsampling), only use 44hz tracks

 

[Actungz]

For those who have experience with the PW amp/Forte, can you confirm that the amplifier splits the high frequency to the speakers, and low frequencies to the subwoofer when using sub out?

I was gonna purchase a Forte, but I was under the assumption that ARC does proper bass management by high passing the signal that goes to the speakers.

Thanks!

 

[TonyRancid]

It does, although the subwoofer is mono, which might not be a problem.

 

[TonyRancid]

Back to Qobuz, through play-fi. Qobuz reports it's playing "MP3 16 bits / 44100Hz".
Not a big problem, the Qobuz app in Play-fi is a bit slow and painful. I can use a CCA and DAC to the phono in, or just use Spottify, not convinced I can tell the difference anyway!

 

[batfunk]

Back to Qobuz, through play-fi. Qobuz reports it's playing "MP3 16 bits / 44100Hz".
Not a big problem, the Qobuz app in Play-fi is a bit slow and painful. I can use a CCA and DAC to the phono in, or just use Spottify, not convinced I can tell the difference anyway!

Agreed. I'm very satisfied with Spotify connect(premium), works flawlessly with Pw Link(no gap). Mp3 320 kbps is enough for me, the most important is the quality of recording.

 

[hpp8140]

For those who have experience with the PW amp/Forte, can you confirm that the amplifier splits the high frequency to the speakers, and low frequencies to the subwoofer when using sub out?

I was gonna purchase a Forte, but I was under the assumption that ARC does proper bass management by high passing the signal that goes to the speakers.

Thanks!

I can confirm...ARC works great...just a bit of noise seeping through from the PlayFI Wifi card.

From the manual:
Upon connecting an external subwoofer, your Paradigm product will automatically detect its presence and redirect low frequency content from the speakers to the subwoofer. If your subwoofer has an adjustment for bandwidth (BW), set it to 100 Hz (recommended setting) if you will not be running ARC. If you will be running ARC set it to maximum bandwidth (or bypass). If you ran ARC before connecting a subwoofer, you will need to run it again

 

[aerochrome2]

Does anyone else have an issue since the latest update where when powering the unit on (I turn it off before I go to bed), the volume resets to an extraordinarily low level, so that I have to bump it up significantly on startup?

 

[Jmudrick]

Does anyone else have an issue since the latest update where when powering the unit on (I turn it off before I go to bed), the volume resets to an extraordinarily low level, so that I have to bump it up significantly on startup?

I don't think that's new, I've usually had to reset volume after updating. Feature not a problem

 

[aerochrome2]

I don't think that's new, I've usually had to reset volume after updating. Feature not a problem

I guess the new part is me turning it off each night!

 

[cwatt]

With the current fire sale prices on the Paradigm and ML preamps and amps I am looking to combine the ML Unison and Forte into an inexpensive 2.1 system with room correction for about CAD600. I am not opposed to purchasing a different amp, however the cost of the Forte is hard to pass up. The other inexpensive option I am entertaining is if I can utilize my RPi4 as a simple to use preamp/audio switcher with room correction.

Looking for guidance and feedback on the following use case.

The manuals do not talk about using the Forte Amp with the Unison Preamp, however I expect this should be possible.

• In this case would I use the ARC features in the preamp on all the source inputs?

Setup

• TV with HDMI in from 1) BDP, 2) ATV, 3) RPI4.
  • Toslink out from TV into Toslink In on ML Unison.
• Connecting a subwoofer to the preamp.
  • Do I need both L & R RCA out from ML Unison to Sub or just Mono (ie R RCA out)?
  • I take it I need a Y cable to split the Sub out and RCA L & R outputs to the ML Forte/Amp?
    
    • Any issues with inserting a Y cable into the chain?
    • Would it be better to add the subwoofer connection to the Forte Amp?
      
      • I take it ARC would have to be operating on the Forte in this case?
• RPI4 to RCA inputs of Unison
• Connecting the Forte and Unison
  • RCA L&R output from Unison to L&R input of Amp

 

[rgruber]

I read through this entire thread in the wee hours of the night last night. Was wondering what are you suggestions to add the PW Link for the DSP and avoid the problems with noise Play Fi.

Current Setup
Source
Technics turntable and Raspberry Pi 3B+ with Hifi Berry Dac Hat running Volumio with Spotify Connect and connected to exernal hardrive with music files (both RCA out)
Switcher
Emotiva Stealth passive switch with phono premap
Preamp
FX-Audio Tube01
Amp
XTZ Edge A-300

Option 1
Use PW Link to replace Raspberry Pi entirely, run turntable into RCA in, control music with Spotify connect over phone (not sure how to switch to turntable or external hardrive) and go analog out to pre amp.

Option 2
Replace DAC HAT with HAT with digital out and go pure digital in to PW LInk
Add external DAC (looking at DynaFrips Aires II) and go digital out to new DAC and analog out to preamp
In this I guess turntable would run to the PW link analog in?

Option 3
Add Zen Phono Pre amp with balanced out
Add HAT with digital out
Add Digital Switch
Run both Phono Pre and Raspberry PI to Digital Switch to PW Link digital in
Add External DAC
PW Link to external DAC
External DAC to Pre

What makes most sense?

 

[nathan]

If your goal is just to add ARC to your system, I'd keep everything you have EXCEPT the FX-Audio Tube01.

I would replace the FX-Audio Tube01 with the PWLINK.

I'd leave the PWLINK on analog in all the time.

 

[sfdoddsy]

Having owned a PW Link, one of the nicest things about it is the flexibility having digital and analog ins and outs gives you.

Plus, as Amir makes clear, the benefits of ARC swamp any negatives from noise. Although Playfi does suck.

So I'd just buy a PW Link and try it out in various positions and see if you hear any issues.

Personally, I'm for making things as simple as possible. I couldn't hear any issues with the DAC, and the convolution of multiple ins and outs probably hides anything anyway.

So I'd just go turntable into analog on the PW, digital into digital on the PW, and analog out to your amp.

 

[rgruber]

Having owned a PW Link, one of the nicest things about it is the flexibility having digital and analog ins and outs gives you.

Plus, as Amir makes clear, the benefits of ARC swamp any negatives from noise. Although Playfi does suck.

So I'd just buy a PW Link and try it out in various positions and see if you hear any issues.

Personally, I'm for making things as simple as possible. I couldn't hear any issues with the DAC, and the convolution of multiple ins and outs probably hides anything anyway.

So I'd just go turntable into analog on the PW, digital into digital on the PW, and analog out to your amp.

Thanks, 3 question:

1) If I'm using Spotify Connect exclusively for my streaming, do I need to mess with Play Fi at all if I take the raspberry pi out of the loop? That is can I just go from Spotify on my phone and choose PlayFi running Spotify Connect as the output and stay in the Spotify app?

2) How do you switch to the analog turntable input? Is this using the Play Fi app?

3) What happens to music that was hanging off the Raspberry Pi on a usb connected drive I was accessing through Volumio if I take Raspberry Pi out of the loop?

Seems like the suggestion to get one and play with the various scenarios is a good one, given the flexibility of analog and digital inputs.