Review and Measurements of Klipsch PowerGate DAC & Amp

[daftcombo]

@amirm , would it be possible to have the THD+N vs frequency graph?
Cheers!

 

[daftcombo]

@amirm : At least 5 products appear twice in this graph (see Denon, FX-Audio, Topping, Nuforce/Nufroce, Behringer).

 

[confucius_zero]

@amirm : At least 5 products appear twice in this graph (see Denon, FX-Audio, Topping, Nuforce/Nufroce, Behringer).

it's also missing the Onkyo power amp

 

[daftcombo]

it's also missing the Onkyo power amp

True. I'm also wondering what would be the best buy, between the Powergate and the Onkyo M282?

 

[confucius_zero]

between the Powergate and the Onkyo M282?

both seem to be an "amazon abuse" away from the answer. The m282 got replaced by the m5010 (https://www.amazon.com/Onkyo-M-5010...kyo+m5010&qid=1556120838&s=electronics&sr=1-1 )

 

[estuardo4]

True. I'm also wondering what would be the best buy, between the Powergate and the Onkyo M282?

It seems the Onkyo is an A/B design, based on specs and size. The Powergate is a Class D amp (we don't know the chip used yet) with more amenities than the Onkyo. And based on power output, the Powergate seems to have more tested power. I went for the Powergate because of all that.

 

[amirm]

@amirm : At least 5 products appear twice in this graph (see Denon, FX-Audio, Topping, Nuforce/Nufroce, Behringer).

Wow, that is really strange. Thanks for catching that. I will review and fix.....

 

[JohnBooty]

Does anybody know if the speaker outputs are high-passed when a subwoofer is connected?

I'm guessing "no", as the manual makes no mention of it. That's a shame, because it's a pretty easy win IMO when it comes to subwoofer integration.

Vanatoo's powered speakers are some of the only devices I know of that do this.

 

[GGroch]

True. I'm also wondering what would be the best buy, between the Powergate and the Onkyo M282?

The Onkyo and the Powergate are so different in features and construction I think it would make much more sense to pick the one that fits your purpose best rather than deciding based on small differences in specifications or measurements. They are VERY different, despite the similar power output.

The Onkyo is a pure power amp....if you already have a control preamp to switch sources, volume, and the like, my guess is that because it is so simple and is a classic big iron class a/b design (and because it is from a very established amp manufacturer with a track record) it would be the best choice.

If you want an amp that has a pretty sophisticated remote controlled preamp in it, and adds streaming capabilities through Play-Fi, the Klipsch makes sense. Note that Klipsch does not have a long history of making amplifiers, and the owner reviews have been varied. A significant number of owners say it just stopped working...which is more likely to be an issue when you put so much sophisticated electronics, and power in a tiny box.
Plus, the Klipsch is much more complicated to set up...(updating the firmware requires 2 different apps and is not well documented).

I do not think the measured differences in performance will be noticed assuming they work both work. I just got the Klipsch in because I always do what amir suggests. The firmware udate went well, but, if I had not had a lot of previous experience with Play-fi devices I would have been very confused.

 

[amirm]

@amirm , would it be possible to have the THD+N vs frequency graph?
Cheers!

There is severe noise shaping above audio band which screws up that measurement.

 

[GGroch]

Does anybody know if the speaker outputs are high-passed when a subwoofer is connected?
I'm guessing "no", as the manual makes no mention of it. That's a shame, because it's a pretty easy win IMO when it comes to subwoofer integration.

The Paradigm PW-Amp, which I understand amir will measure shortly, does this. From the Manual: Upon connecting an external subwoofer, your Paradigm product will automatically detect its presence and redirect low frequency content from the speakers to the subwoofer. If your subwoofer has an adjustment for bandwidth (BW), set it to 100 Hz (recommended setting) if you will not be running ARC. If you will be running ARC set it to maximum bandwidth (or bypass). If you ran ARC before connecting a subwoofer, you will need to run it again.

I mention this because several above comments are from people who are looking primarily for a power amp. The PW-Amp is more like that, having a much less sophisticated front end, just a single analog input and no included remote. It adds ARC room equalization plus Play-Fi. So, if it measures well (always an advanture with these class D amps). it would be a good choice if you already have the control you need.

 

[amirm]

Corrected Amp SINAD bar graph.

 

[estuardo4]

The Onkyo and the Powergate are so different in features and construction I think it would make much more sense to pick the one that fits your purpose best rather than deciding based on small differences in specifications or measurements. They are VERY different, despite the similar power output.

The Onkyo is a pure power amp....if you already have a control preamp to switch sources, volume, and the like, my guess is that because it is so simple and is a classic big iron class a/b design (and because it is from a very established amp manufacturer with a track record) it would be the best choice.

If you want an amp that has a pretty sophisticated remote controlled preamp in it, and adds streaming capabilities through Play-Fi, the Klipsch makes sense. Note that Klipsch does not have a long history of making amplifiers, and the owner reviews have been varied. A significant number of owners say it just stopped working...which is more likely to be an issue when you put so much sophisticated electronics, and power in a tiny box.
Plus, the Klipsch is much more complicated to set up...(updating the firmware requires 2 different apps and is not well documented).

I do not think the measured differences in performance will be noticed assuming they work both work. I just got the Klipsch in because I always do what amir suggests. The firmware udate went well, but, if I had not had a lot of previous experience with Play-fi devices I would have been very confused.

I don't disagree with you, each amp is different topology, but based on the review from Amir for the Powergate, I think it should be noted that the Powergate, as a power amp, is well worth it and well measured. I ordered one, you ordered one. I'm waiting for your first impressions. I have to wait to receive mine because I'm out of the US. But for $200 USD ($50 shipping to my country), what do you have to lose?

 

[estuardo4]

The Paradigm PW-Amp, which I understand amir will measure shortly, does this. From the Manual: Upon connecting an external subwoofer, your Paradigm product will automatically detect its presence and redirect low frequency content from the speakers to the subwoofer. If your subwoofer has an adjustment for bandwidth (BW), set it to 100 Hz (recommended setting) if you will not be running ARC. If you will be running ARC set it to maximum bandwidth (or bypass). If you ran ARC before connecting a subwoofer, you will need to run it again.

I mention this because several above comments are from people who are looking primarily for a power amp. The PW-Amp is more like that, having a much less sophisticated front end, just a single analog input and no included remote. It adds ARC room equalization plus Play-Fi. So, if it measures well (always an advanture with these class D amps). it would be a good choice if you already have the control you need.

And as soon as Amir test it, I'll order one too. I want to try ARC on my room. But I won't order it if the amp is junk.

What I like about this site and Amir's work, is that he's doing a service not only to their American friends, or well developed countries. He's doing a service to all of us under developed countries where buying a $40,000 USD amp is an affair for just a very few people. Amir is making buying affordable products, well measured and engineered, a reality for us. And for him I raise my glass.

 

[nuxv]

Thanks. No reviews left specific temps (hate when that happens) so am only going by what i've read. I do have a couple IR thermometer's, so will be able to give some specifics once the item ships.

Well, I've got unit. After streaming audio thru USB for 2 hours, temps are at 115-125 degrees (bottom, vs top) -- this is using an IR thermometer and a 75 degree ambient temperature.

 

[daftcombo]

Corrected Amp SINAD bar graph.

Great. Onkyo still missing though?

 

[restorer-john]

temps are at 115-125 degrees (bottom, vs top)

That's warm, but not too hot.

Doesn't bode well for long term reliability in an enclosed case with little ventilation however. Are there open grilles on the sides and a fan?

 

[estuardo4]

That's warm, but not too hot.

Doesn't bode well for long term reliability in an enclosed case with little ventilation however. Are there open grilles on the sides and a fan?

One user on another forum bought a silent fan from Amazon for $13. He put it underneath where the power supply is located, outside the unit. He said that the temperature lowered to room temperature.

I bought the same silent fan from Amazon too. Whisper quiet. At the lower speed the noise is rated at 19dB. I can't hear it unless I put it near my ear. And even there, I have to focus to even hear it.

 

[amirm]

Great. Onkyo still missing though?

I did not run the dashboard then as that was one of the early reviews. It would be around 83 dB from the power graph.

 

[amirm]

I bought the same silent fan from Amazon too. Whisper quiet. At the lower speed the noise is rated at 19dB. I can't hear it unless I put it near my ear. And even there, I have to focus to even hear it.

Is there a link for it?