Review and Measurements of JDSLabs ODAC Rev. B Compared to Fiio E10K

[amirm]

The final step was to solder a cable to the ground of one of the DAC's RCA sockets, then insert the other end of the cable into the amp's ground plug.

That tells me that the Stax's input may be floating. I run into that all the time in my reviews/testing. The RCA inputs on my new Audio Precision analyzer are floating. About half the time, using an alligator wire between the ground terminal on my analyzer and an unused RCA jack substantially reduces mains hum. Sometimes it works better if I just ground things at the analyzer end. That is, just go from its ground lug to its own RCA outer shroud. Other times doing it as you show works better. In other cases, doing this causes much more noise so I don't do it.

Balanced interconnects don't have this issue and hence the reason they are my preference.

 

[Zoide]

That tells me that the Stax's input may be floating. I run into that all the time in my reviews/testing. The RCA inputs on my new Audio Precision analyzer are floating. About half the time, using an alligator wire between the ground terminal on my analyzer and an unused RCA jack substantially reduces mains hum. Sometimes it works better if I just ground things at the analyzer end. That is, just go from its ground lug to its own RCA outer shroud. Other times doing it as you show works better. In other cases, doing this causes much more noise so I don't do it.

Balanced interconnects don't have this issue and hence the reason they are my preference.

Given all the trouble that floating inputs give, what's the reason for expensive gear to use them?

Thanks

 

[amirm]

Given all the trouble that floating inputs give, what's the reason for expensive gear to use them?

Thanks

It gives you the choice to ground or not ground. As I mentioned, in some devices I test floating works a lot better.

 

[Zoide]

It gives you the choice to ground or not ground. As I mentioned, in some devices I test floating works a lot better.

Does this mean that if my noise issues are entirely due to the amp? (If I replace the ODAC by something more modern with its own power adapter, the noise will come back unless I mess with the amp's ground terminal again?)

Thanks

 

[yue]

Unfortunately he is using a narrow band analysis from 8 to 14 Khz versus my full bandwidth one. Both the jitter and spurious tone that I found is outside of his measurement range:

Probably you can test ODAC again in -5db and see if the problem goes away. JDS does not recommend use ODAC at 0db as it's not designed to be used at that volume.

 

[amirm]

Probably you can test ODAC again in -5db and see if the problem goes away. JDS does not recommend use ODAC at 0db as it's not designed to be used at that volume.

The content dictates the max dB and there, there is plenty of content that is at or near 0 dBFS. So user has no control over it.

 

[yue]

The content dictates the max dB and there, there is plenty of content that is at or near 0 dBFS. So user has no control over it.

I believe it's the interface chip (such as XU208 in topping's case, SA9023 in ODAC case) that does the multiplication of volume and data, and send the final result to the DAC chip (PCM5102A in this case, which cannot handle 0db). So user can avoid the 0db issue easily by always using a slightly lower volume (and that's what JDS recommends).

So even with max db content, it's still easy to avoid sending full amplitude to the chip.

 

[amirm]

Clipping can happen due to digital filters, or analog stage. Either way, there are a lot of DACs that handle 0 dBFS fine. One should not have to change things upstream of the DAC to make it work well when there are alternatives without that issue.

 

[Zoide]

Does anyone know how the ODAC's IMD compares to that of the Khadas ToneBoard and other DACs with the ESS hump?

Thanks

 

[yue]

Does anyone know how the ODAC's IMD compares to that of the Khadas ToneBoard and other DACs with the ESS hump?

Thanks

Odac performs worse, even if you take the ess hump into account.

 

[mykeldg]

Hi Amir, would you know if the SPDIF interface of the Fiio e10 transparent enough?

I plan to use it on a Schiit Muultibit DAC (coax input) which I've read from your past reviews benefit from COAX input from another USB source like the Topping D10.

Thanks very much in advance.

 

[Veri]

Hi Amir, would you know if the SPDIF interface of the Fiio e10 transparent enough?

I plan to use it on a Schiit Muultibit DAC (coax input) which I've read from your past reviews benefit from COAX input from another USB source like the Topping D10.

Thanks very much in advance.

If it works without drop-outs it should be fine, it's up to the receiving chipset from there. That's digital for you.

By all means try it, report back

 

[mykeldg]

I tried it, it works, no dropouts, sounds brighter (or leaner). is that a good indicator that I eliminated some of the usb noise amir measured previously on Modi via USB? I don't know which one is more "true" between the "warmer" sound i get via USB input or the sharper sounding COAX from the Fiio E10.

The reason im curious about using coax input is, schiitheads at SBAF seem to swear by using the Eitr on the modi multibit.

 

[Veri]

I tried it, it works, no dropouts, sounds brighter (or leaner). is that a good indicator that I eliminated some of the usb noise amir measured previously on Modi via USB? I don't know which one is more "true" between the "warmer" sound i get via USB input or the sharper sounding COAX from the Fiio E10.

The reason im curious about using coax input is, schiitheads at SBAF seem to swear by using the Eitr on the modi multibit.

I think USB and COAX should, theoretically sound the same. However if USB sounded 'warmer' to you and you like it I would just use USB.

Schiit Eitr is end of life and once supply runs out, they won't be made anymore. I think that says enough about how important it is to Schiit: not important, just another tweak that has run its course...

My advice would be if USB works and you enjoy USB, use it. If you prefer the sound via COAX from E10K, use that. Don't buy new gear for very little reason and don't listen to the eternal circlejerk that is SBAF.

 

[mykeldg]

thanks a lot. yeah, Im actually scratching my head over the difference I hear in coax (which SBAF claims to be night & day) --- it isn't and I could easily live with USB without the unnecessary complication.

 

[nhatlam96]

What would be the SINAD of the Fiio E10K?

 

[VintageFlanker]

What would be the SINAD of the Fiio E10K?

Probably around 80dB (what is its highest harmonic distortion, BTW).
That's on par with the specs (0.008% THD).

 

[nhatlam96]

Probably around 80dB (what is its highest harmonic distortion, BTW).
That's on par with the specs (0.008% THD).

Thank you, I understand how to do it now.
Fiio E10k has "THD+N:< 0.006% (1 kHz)" ( https://fiio-shop.de/en/dac-with-amp/553/fiio-e10k-olympus-2 )
The scale is:

• 80dB SINAD = 0.01% THD+N
• 100dB SINAD = 0.001% THD+N
• 120dB SINAD = 0.0001% THD+N

That means 0.006% would be equivalent to 88dB.

Edit: That's a bummer, 88dB does not meet 16-bit (CD) resolution.

 

[VintageFlanker]

Thank you, I understand how to do it now.
Fiio E10k has "THD+N:< 0.006% (1 kHz)" ( https://fiio-shop.de/en/dac-with-amp/553/fiio-e10k-olympus-2 )
The scale is:

• 80dB SINAD = 0.01% THD+N
• 100dB SINAD = 0.001% THD+N
• 120dB SINAD = 0.0001% THD+N

That means 0.006% would be equivalent to 88dB.

First, remember official specs and measured performance are not the same thing.
SINAD won't be 88dB with a second Harmonic Distortion at 80dB in @amirm measurements.

Also: http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-thd.htm

Edit: That's a bummer, 88dB does not meet 16-bit (CD) resolution

Sure, it does not.

 

[SDX-LV]

Hi,

I happen to own ODAC (Epiphany Acoustics E-DAC) from 2013 and would really love to see where it lands in terms of SINAD?
So far I only understand that it is worse than Topping D30 (with SINAD 104 dB). Is it possible to get a rough estimate from this data or does it have to be re-measured ?