Review and Measurements of Gustard U12 USB to S/PDIF Converter

[Wombat]

Also of interest, albeit from another forum:

http://superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/ddc-warm-up-time-technical-measurements.4178/

I think the results are consistent with yours, Amir.

It all looks inaudible to me.

 

[Hemi-Demon]

All makes me wonder if I should invest in a Singxer SU-1, which, at $400, has galvanic isolation, the Amanero USB chip (purportedly superior to the XMOS chip), and, according to audiophiles interested in USB devices, better sound than the Gustard. Without Amir's measurements, it's unknown whether the Singxer has appropriate output levels.

Once I take delivery of the Dutch & Dutch 8Cs, I'll just need a way to get USB audio from a computer into the AES ports of the 8Cs. With DSP in the Dutch & Dutch 8Cs, I'm not sure that the Gustard's jitter spikes will be audible, and with reasonably short cable runs, the low output might not be problematic.

Just a heads up, Audio-GD devices use amanero chips in their devices. Make sure you check some of amirms reviews on those products Specifically the jitter information. I am not sure I would consider the amanero chip a "better" option versus the XMOS chips. Especially the newer 208 or 216. My subjective experiences have mirrored the data reported by amirm, in this particular case, or company.

 

[odessamarin]

Apart of measurement here, just from my experience, Gustard U12 is very very good converter. And serve me extremely well. It helps me a lot to hear different USB cables quality and how not optimal USB inputs of good DAC can be. I am sure nobody will regret if buy Gustard U12. very good product.

 

[Veri]

It helps me a lot to hear different USB cables quality and how not optimal USB inputs of good DAC can be. I am sure nobody will regret if buy Gustard U12. very good product.

USB cables are purely digital, they either leak noise into your dac or they don't. I really don't feel there is much room besides 'crap' or 'not crap' lol.

See for example https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ents-of-wireworld-starlight-7-usb-cable.6599/ there is no real effect on analogue output besides possibly noise problems, from the conclusion:

none of those mains components are remotely audible (or you would hear them with generic cables and we don't). And at any rate, no improvements were made whatsoever in actual distortion products. In the case of D50, we actually made things worse a bit.

 

[odessamarin]

@Veri

Well, i don't know nois.. not noise. I can hear how one (not good) cable sounds flat and smooth, and other one (good) sound deep sound stage and more clear. And I am not talking about super expensive cable. With Gustard I do here this difference very well. For me it means it is good equipment.
If you do not her this. Sad
btw.. amazon basic one that sound bad to me.. not by measurement.

 

[hollis]

@amirm

Just wondering if you have ever tested another device that takes USB to AES like this one does. I bought one, and am now itching to upgrade. Tried the U16 but I'm getting massive (100's of ms) latency so it doesnt work for streaming video or gaming.

I think your recommended RME ADI-2 Pro would be my next step up. That has both AES in and out, and a whole ton o other features.

I am trying to get stereo audio out of my desktop and into a Minidsp 88D.

 

[Veri]

@amirm

Just wondering if you have ever tested another device that takes USB to AES like this one does. I bought one, and am now itching to upgrade. Tried the U16 but I'm getting massive (100's of ms) latency so it doesnt work for streaming video or gaming.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...of-matrix-audio-x-spdif-2-usb-converter.6597/
does USB to AES over bus power. seems like a fine device if that's what you need.

 

[hollis]

That box sure does tick all the "boxes".

Thanks so much, I had not seen that one yet in my search of your reviews.

I wonder if it is a sonic upgrade from the U12. As far as ports go, it can run my mains rig (AES to minidsp 88d), headphone rig (SPIDIF to schiit Bifrost) and loudness meter (Optical - TC electronic clarity M).

 

[wwenze]

@amirm

Just wondering if you have ever tested another device that takes USB to AES like this one does. I bought one, and am now itching to upgrade. Tried the U16 but I'm getting massive (100's of ms) latency so it doesnt work for streaming video or gaming.

I think your recommended RME ADI-2 Pro would be my next step up. That has both AES in and out, and a whole ton o other features.

I am trying to get stereo audio out of my desktop and into a Minidsp 88D.

The bigger the buffer, the bigger the latency.

Try this:

In Windows I have better performance with the ASIO driver where I can set butter sizes using the Thesycon applet to change buffer size. Have to use ASIO driver in Windows which is not dedicated playback. But I get better operational performance with ASIO. Using WASAPI the dropouts at higher sampling rates return.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/gus...terface-featuring-ess-usb-chip.888947/page-90

 

[Veri]

That box sure does tick all the "boxes".

Thanks so much, I had not seen that one yet in my search of your reviews.

I wonder if it is a sonic upgrade from the U12.

That is doubtful, since 'bad' measuring digital converters tend to still work fine, generally the end device will clean up bad sources.
But, at least you can trust in Matrix. they make solid quality products.

 

[hollis]

The bigger the buffer, the bigger the latency.

Try this:


https://www.head-fi.org/threads/gus...terface-featuring-ess-usb-chip.888947/page-90

Wow, that is one epic U16 thread. Kinda hard to find the posts that are just talking about the internal clock with PCM content. There are some serious mods going on there.

Just did a quick readthrough and will check out those drivers. Have to read a little more on which ones to instal and how to get them working. Gotta be careful since right now I have both the U12 and the U16 connected, and I switch between them in windows10 depending on use case.

 

[hollis]

That is doubtful, since 'bad' measuring digital converters tend to still work fine, generally the end device will clean up bad sources.
But, at least you can trust in Matrix. they make solid quality products.

Good to know. With the Lynx Aurora 8 DAC's internal clock I (and three others) couldnt hear a change between the U12 and the U16. It was only when the Lynx was synced to the U16 wordclock output that the improvement was heard (and was crazy subtle at that). Maybe my upgrade path is keep a simpler USB transport and start looking at external clocks. Someone in the linked thread mentioned the C16. Going to google that next.

 

[Veri]

Maybe my upgrade path is keep a simpler USB transport and start looking at external clocks. Someone in the linked thread mentioned the C16. Going to google that next.

That U16 head-fi thread is balls to the walls insane with all their crazy tweaks. I would be careful spending money on external clock..
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/auralic-leo-gx-dac-clock-review.11001/

 

[hollis]

I fixed the delay!

Upon further playing around I got the delay down to just a frame or two. That could be due to Dirac, or cascaded digital boxes. Totally acceptable.

My solution was convoluted:
- install the Gustard U16 driver 1year ago (200-300ms delay)
- install the XMOS driver https://www.xmos.com/software/usb-audio/driver-support/ (dropouts, stuttering)
- reinstall the latest Gustard U16 driver Gustard_USBAudio_v1A_2018-10-15 (20-40ms total delay, no dropouts)

I have not started playing with external clocks yet. I did have positive results upgrading my Hosa BNC-59-103 75-Ohm Coax Cable, 3 Feet to a Apogee Wyde Eye 75Ω BNC Word Clock Cable ~ WE-BB (0.5m). Due to either the shorter length or better construction I am now no longer getting a loud pop in my Lynx DAC whenever playback stops. I call this an objective win.

The signal path is:
- Tower PC
- USB to U16 (wordclock out)
- 8ch AES out to Minidsp 88d
- 8ch AES out to Lynx Aurora (wordclock in)
- 7ch Outlaw amp + powered subs

I am using the clock syncing to "skip" the async minidsp unit. Sadly I cant find any non-invasive way to get a clock signal into that sucker.

 

[gino1961]

.... As we see here, there is no difference at all how you drive the S/PDIF input on the Exasound E32. It excellently cleans up whatever ills may be on S/PDIF and renders the same excellent output.
So if you have a high-quality DAC, there is no reason to anguish over how you are driving it... As usual, comments, questions, corrections are welcome

Hi ! sorry to ask. Is this performance due usually to some kind of reclocking going on inside the best dacs ? is there a way to understand if a dac reclocks the input signal or not ? i am very ignorant but my feeling is that all serious dacs should share this kind of approach.
Thank you very much indeed for your excellent review
Kind regards, gino