Review and Measurements of Benchmark AHB2 Amp

[Cortes]

Do you think a "AHB2 ($3k) +some near field speakers ( one to two meters listenning distance, which model?) + Dirac Live room correction " is able to perform at the level of a Genelec 8331?.

I ask because I just sold my valve amps and I was sure to go active with Genelec. However I've realized that selling in 5-8 years a DSP speaker that will be outdated by then can be much harder than selling separates (less money per unit, broader market).

 

[JohnYang1997]

Do you think a "AHB2 ($3k) +some near field speakers ( one to two meters listenning distance, which model?) + Dirac Live room correction " is able to perform at the level of a Genelec 8331?.

I ask because I just sold my valve amps and I was sure to go active with Genelec. However I've realized that selling in 5-8 years a DSP speaker that will be outdated by then can be much harder than selling separates (less money per unit, broader market).

First of all 8331 isn't even that good.
But spending 3000 dollars on just an amp isn't very economic. Sure it's a great amp, superb even. But in your situation it's really not worth it.
My suggestion, go to your local pro audio store or local studios to ask for some advice. And spend 1k to 2k on a pair of active monitors then spend the rest on room treatments from professionals. DSP is very effective in correcting transducer linear distortion (frequency response of speaker itself), but room is very difficult to do. Sure it's effective but you will get way better result with real treatments and a pair of ok speakers.
For suggestions on speakers, my pick is eve sc207. But you should listen for yourself. Also if you already have great acoustic treatment, please ignore all above.....

 

[Cortes]

First of all 8331 isn't even that good.
But spending 3000 dollars on just an amp isn't very economic. Sure it's a great amp, superb even. But in your situation it's really not worth it.
My suggestion, go to your local pro audio store or local studios to ask for some advice. And spend 1k to 2k on a pair of active monitors then spend the rest on room treatments from professionals. DSP is very effective in correcting transducer linear distortion (frequency response of speaker itself), but room is very difficult to do. Sure it's effective but you will get way better result with real treatments and a pair of ok speakers.
For suggestions on speakers, my pick is eve sc207. But you should listen for yourself. Also if you already have great acoustic treatment, please ignore all above.....

I thought they are as the 8341/8351 with less SPL. I have an old Genelec 8020 and is pretty ok.

Yes, I agree that room is king, but in my case I can't do much about that, maybe put some panels, but that's all.
In addition I listen very close to the speakers (they are 1.5m behind me) so probably I can't do much more that tame some first reflections.
So the only area to improve is DSP+better speakers/amp.

 

[digitalfrost]

Do you think a "AHB2 ($3k) +some near field speakers ( one to two meters listenning distance, which model?) + Dirac Live room correction " is able to perform at the level of a Genelec 8331?.

Hard to say. I would not put that much money into an amplifier, when it comes to price/performance. You can get plenty good amps for way less.

The Gelenec 8331 are 3 way active speakers, which is a technical feat in of itself. To compare it with passive speakers, let alone non-coax ones doesn't make a whole lot of sense. A good amp will always be a good amp. I love power amps from the late 80s, they are still awesome today. So if that matters to you, buying an excellent amp today is probably a good idea, especiall a power amp at that, because preamps can always be switched out with new technologies.

But comparing state of the art active speakers to such a setup? Who knows? At the end of they day - as someone who owns the AHB2 - I'm happy with KEF LS50 and dedicated subwoofers, or with DIY speakers that cost 600$ a pair. I would always advocate to put most (80%) of your money into to speakers (yeah I broke my own rule), but there are diminishing returns.

The biggest improvement for me has been DRC. Whether what ends up being Dirac, Acourate or another solution, it will hugely improve whatever you have, and also take away a bit of the guess work if speaker X will work in your room. Actually, if you have a working setup now, I would get the DRC of your choice first, and then decide on what to buy later.

 

[JohnYang1997]

Hard to say. I would not put that much money into an amplifier, when it comes to price/performance. You can get plenty good amps for way less.

The Gelenec 8331 are 3 way active speakers, which is a technical feat in of itself. To compare it with passive speakers, let alone non-coax ones doesn't make a whole lot of sense. A good amp will always be a good amp. I love power amps from the late 80s, they are still awesome today. So if that matters to you, buying an excellent amp today is probably a good idea, especiall a power amp at that, because preamps can always be switched out with new technologies.

But comparing state of the art active speakers to such a setup? Who knows? At the end of they day - as someone who owns the AHB2 - I'm happy with KEF LS50 and dedicated subwoofers, or with DIY speakers that cost 600$ a pair. I would always advocate to put most (80%) of your money into to speakers (yeah I broke my own rule), but there are diminishing returns.

The biggest improvement for me has been DRC. Whether what ends up being Dirac, Acourate or another solution, it will hugely improve whatever you have, and also take away a bit of the guess work if speaker X will work in your room. Actually, if you have a working setup now, I would get the DRC of your choice first, and then decide on what to buy later.

In room response is often time receiving and can be very different from perception. There are tons of space information that's interpreted by human brain and will not contribute to the tonal balance. The correction works best on bass. But still measurements can be deceiving. Better use tone generator to use ear to eq region under 500hz.
Room treatment is much better solution if there is money to spend.
People love DRC because it's cheap and can make a big "difference". However in many ways it also screws up sound especially in the higher range.
So we get into a paradox: high frequency should be the range that actually takes eq well but we can't measure properly, low frequency we can easily use our ear to eq the room but the reverb time can't be improved. So best way is still doing all the proper acoustic treatments.

 

[digitalfrost]

Well I have to confess, I'm a cheap ass and have only ever used DRC-FIR. It comes with a couple of default templates and after that you can tweak if you want to. Like Acourate. I don't know much about other DRCs, but if you tweak it until you like it - with more correction in the bass region, especially below Schröder frequency and less above - it's a win-win situation is it not? I'm all for room treatment, I have some basotect mats on the first side reflection zones and it made a noticeable improvement.

But that still doesn't change my opinion that room correction was the single biggest improvement ever in my system, and I haven't paid a dime. Already when I was just using REW EQ, it was much better than before.

 

[RichB]

In room response is often time receiving and can be very different from perception. There are tons of space information that's interpreted by human brain and will not contribute to the tonal balance. The correction works best on bass. But still measurements can be deceiving. Better use tone generator to use ear to eq region under 500hz.
Room treatment is much better solution if there is money to spend.
People love DRC because it's cheap and can make a big "difference". However in many ways it also screws up sound especially in the higher range.
So we get into a paradox: high frequency should be the range that actually takes eq well but we can't measure properly, low frequency we can easily use our ear to eq the room but the reverb time can't be improved. So best way is still doing all the proper acoustic treatments.

I agree that microphones measurements are not a good approximation of human perception and prefer limiting correction to below Schroeder. A low-cost mic and REW (free) are better tools taming room modes than by ear.

- Rich

 

[laidick]

Not sure if anyone mentioned already, this old post has very bad experience on AHB2:

https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/benchmark-ahb2-impressions-vs-vidar.5131/

 

[tw99]

Not sure if anyone mentioned already, this old post has very bad experience on AHB2:

https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/benchmark-ahb2-impressions-vs-vidar.5131/

It falls apart in the Plankton?????

But anyway some random person's subjective musings are not really relevant here.

 

[PaulD]

I'd suggest that the review has absolutely zero credibility - the language gives it away completely. Was the review properly conducted to eliminate cognitive biases, double blind with matched levels etc etc? If it was not (& it doesn't look like it), then it is invalid. The language is also full of the usual hifi reviewer gobbledygook, it's nonsensical. It looks like the reviewer simply confirmed their biases...

 

[anmpr1]

Not sure if anyone mentioned already, this old post has very bad experience on AHB2:

https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/benchmark-ahb2-impressions-vs-vidar.5131/

Where the AHB2 totally falls apart is in the plankton, layering, texture, microdynamics, soundstage, and immediacy department. Upon a switch back to the AHB2 for the Vidar, my 9 year old son was like "that other one [Schiit] was WAY better!"

These sorts of 'reviews' are lunacy. I don't want to call the people writing them lunatics. But who can take this sort of idiocy seriously? Plankton? I've never heard about plankton as an amplifier attribute. But, hey, the Schitt amp was 'like way better'..., so what would I know? Super Best Audio Friends? Can anyone say that line in an unironic, non-smirking way?

 

[anmpr1]

I'd suggest that the review has absolutely zero credibility - the language gives it away completely. Was the review properly conducted to eliminate cognitive biases, double blind with matched levels etc etc? If it was not (& it doesn't look like it), then it is invalid. The language is also full of the usual hifi reviewer gobbledygook, it's nonsensical. It looks like the reviewer simply confirmed their biases...

Given the way that a lot of Schiit gear is designed and built, and measures, I cannot out of hand discount the fact that the Schiit amp was dumping enough distortion into the signal to make it sound different than the exceptionally clean Benchmark. But my guess is that the 'reviewer' was just fooling himself, and wanted to write something idiotic as he thought that would make him look like a maven in the eyes of his Super Best Audio friends. Good grief!

 

[Thomas savage]

Not sure if anyone mentioned already, this old post has very bad experience on AHB2:

https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/benchmark-ahb2-impressions-vs-vidar.5131/

Bunch of meaningless drivel .

 

[THW]

>sees a review from SBAF

yeah no, i already know how that one is going to play out without even reading it; lots of barely defined audiophile terms, hyping up the reinvention of the wheel (multibit), etc...

 

[THW]

Where the AHB2 totally falls apart is in the plankton, layering, texture, microdynamics, soundstage, and immediacy department. Upon a switch back to the AHB2 for the Vidar, my 9 year old son was like "that other one [Schiit] was WAY better!"

another variation of the classic "even my wife..." phrase... truly original.

 

[DonH56]

Hmmm... I couldn't begin to comment. There's a few seconds reading I'll never get back. But dissing NOS DACs will probably get the poor guy in trouble.

"Where the AHB2 totally falls apart is in the plankton, layering, texture, microdynamics, soundstage, and immediacy department. Upon a switch back to the AHB2 for the Vidar, my 9 year old son was like "that other one (Vidar) was WAY better!" The difference to me was immediately apparent (like in two seconds) on the initial and first switch to the Vidar.

The stage and the music along with it just got sucked in to 2D plane, much like a how an NOS DAC would do it. "

 

[Laserjock]

If a plankter falls on a glass slide, does anyone hear it?

 

[RichB]

Hmmm... I couldn't begin to comment. There's a few seconds reading I'll never get back. But dissing NOS DACs will probably get the poor guy in trouble.

"Where the AHB2 totally falls apart is in the plankton, layering, texture, microdynamics, soundstage, and immediacy department. Upon a switch back to the AHB2 for the Vidar, my 9 year old son was like "that other one (Vidar) was WAY better!" The difference to me was immediately apparent (like in two seconds) on the initial and first switch to the Vidar.

The stage and the music along with it just got sucked in to 2D plane, much like a how an NOS DAC would do it. "

Oh yeah, my wife was in the other room and the AHB2 blew the Vidar away when it came to pace a rhythm.

- Rich

 

[anmpr1]

another variation of the classic "even my wife..." phrase... truly original.

Very funny, and true. There's a guy that writes for Stereophile who always brings up his wife, Kathleen. The one with exquisite ears who can hear 'front to back depth' and 'mid range graininess' from the kitchen. It's a running joke among Stereophilers. But the sad thing here is a father who should be teaching his son the real 'facts of electronic life', but is instead leading him down the path of audio perdition. Dad...you gotta stop feeding your kid the blue pill.

 

[direstraitsfan98]

You guys are making yourselves and to an extent, the whole ASR community look bad when you make posts like this. Yes, SBAF also mocks people here and they are guilty of the same thing. It doesn't mean you have to stoop to the same level. I post here much more often then I post there because this site feels like far less of an echo chamber circle jerk. But when people get emotional and start devolving into immature name calling and bashing of other people I feel bad for wanting to be a part of the community. Same goes for them, too.

Why can't people enjoy the music? That's the only thing you should be getting emotional about.