Review and Audio Measurement of LG G7 ThinQ Smartphone

[JohnnyR]

I have the lg g7 (European variant) and i found the volume pretty low even in high impedance mode. I tested it with a pair of Sennheiser hd 600 and one Sennheiser hd 660s. The 660s goes loud but i wouldn't say extremely loud and the 600 are not loud enough even at max volume. I was wondering this is a problem with limitted volume on Euopean variants? Becuase i read people saying they can't go to max volume because it gets too loud even with hd 800 (with quad dac off there are bassically whispers but i am not enough pleased with quad dac volume though). Is root going to help or other method, or I have to buy an US variant?

 

[bravomail]

I have the lg g7 (European variant) and i found the volume pretty low even in high impedance mode. I tested it with a pair of Sennheiser hd 600 and one Sennheiser hd 660s. The 660s goes loud but i wouldn't say extremely loud and the 600 are not loud enough even at max volume. I was wondering this is a problem with limitted volume on Euopean variants? Becuase i read people saying they can't go to max volume because it gets too loud even with hd 800 (with quad dac off there are bassically whispers but i am not enough pleased with quad dac volume though). Is root going to help or other method, or I have to buy an US variant?

u gotta root and then force high amplification.

 

[Cahudson42]

This is now a 15 page thread to wade thru, so it's easy to miss. But there is a workaround to get 'high impedance' 2v output w/o rooting. It's explained earlier, but here it is again:
1. Get one of these:
Josi Minea x 3 Pcs 3.5mm Audio Jack Extender Headphone Adapter with 4-Pole 3.5mm Connectors (3 Ring Jack) for Apple iPhone 6/6S/6+/5S/SE iPad Samsung Galaxy S7/S6 & Most Phones & Tablets [ 3 Pack ] https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MTND45R/

2. Then one of these:

FAAEAL Conductor Earphone Impedance Plug 80 220 ohm Noise Cancelling Adapter 3.5mm Jack Professional Reduce Noise Filter Plug (220 Ohm) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07FM8GJL4/

Plug the extender in. Plug the impedance plug in. Plug in your headphones. Turn on LG. It should switch to hi impedance. Remove impedance plug. Do not remove extension. Plug phones into extension. You now have hi impedance.

However , I recommend you do not use low efficiency low impedance phones direct. Instead, use a 3.5mm to rca, plugged into the #1 adapter and a HP amp - Atom, Heresy, etc. I use a Liquid Spark, plenty of output to run my HE400I in low gain..

You can also get it to switch to a 1V output simply by plugging a 3.5mm to RCA, connected to your Atom etc. directly into the LG (w/o any adapters/extension). When the LG 'sees' the Amp input impedance, it switches to 'line out,'/1v mode. Most HP amps will be fine with this.

 

[JohnnyR]

This is now a 15 page thread to wade thru, so it's easy to miss. But there is a workaround to get 'high impedance' 2v output w/o rooting. It's explained earlier, but here it is again:
1. Get one of these:
Josi Minea x 3 Pcs 3.5mm Audio Jack Extender Headphone Adapter with 4-Pole 3.5mm Connectors (3 Ring Jack) for Apple iPhone 6/6S/6+/5S/SE iPad Samsung Galaxy S7/S6 & Most Phones & Tablets [ 3 Pack ] https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MTND45R/

2. Then one of these:

FAAEAL Conductor Earphone Impedance Plug 80 220 ohm Noise Cancelling Adapter 3.5mm Jack Professional Reduce Noise Filter Plug (220 Ohm) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07FM8GJL4/

Plug the extender in. Plug the impedance plug in. Plug in your headphones. Turn on LG. It should switch to hi impedance. Remove impedance plug. Do not remove extension. Plug phones into extension. You now have hi impedance.

However , I recommend you do not use low efficiency low impedance phones direct. Instead, use a 3.5mm to rca, plugged into the #1 adapter and a HP amp - Atom, Heresy, etc. I use a Liquid Spark, plenty of output to run my HE400I in low gain..

You can also get it to switch to a 1V output simply by plugging a 3.5mm to RCA, connected to your Atom etc. directly into the LG (w/o any adapters/extension). When the LG 'sees' the Amp input impedance, it switches to 'line out,'/1v mode. Most HP amps will be fine with this.

I read about this, and as far as I understood this trick is for low impedance HP. My issue was that I tested it with high impedance headphones which trick the high impedance mode but the volume is not loud enough on some HP in high impedance mode. The amp seems limited because it's not loud in high impedance as a 2V amp should be. As an approximation, i guess is limited around 1.2-1.3 V. I have a 2V output sound card and is definitely louder than the g7 high impedance mode. I was curious if there is another method to solve except root but i don't think there is.

 

[d73b3e]

In preparing for these measurements, I assumed that LG was not thoughtful enough to have its media player bypassing the Android audio stack.
...
This shows that the Android audio pipeline is limited to 16 bits so best to avoid it if you can. Fortunately the LG player does that and therefore, there is no need to buy USB Audio Pro (unless you like its interface better).

Thanks for the detailed review. In fact, this is one big of factors that caused me to buy LG V40 (and USB Audio Player Pro)

One thing I'd like to find out more information is the whether the LG Player has escaped from Android Audio stack. In my test, the LG Player would give the same noise level as Spotify and Youtube. For example, the song Bubbles in the album Wandering at 0:14 there is a sibilance after the ball is dropped. If I use Poweramp (Hi-Res output) or UAPP (bit perfect) then they give a very lively sound of the ball dropping, it's like the entire surface where the ball hits vibrate. This very detail is lost on LG Player and Spotify.

So to me, on V40 the LG Player is stuck in Android Audio stack and has poor performance.

 

[Tks]

Thanks for the detailed review. In fact, this is one big of factors that caused me to buy LG V40 (and USB Audio Player Pro)

One thing I'd like to find out more information is the whether the LG Player has escaped from Android Audio stack. In my test, the LG Player would give the same noise level as Spotify and Youtube. For example, the song Bubbles in the album Wandering at 0:14 there is a sibilance after the ball is dropped. If I use Poweramp (Hi-Res output) or UAPP (bit perfect) then they give a very lively sound of the ball dropping, it's like the entire surface where the ball hits vibrate. This very detail is lost on LG Player and Spotify.

So to me, on V40 the LG Player is stuck in Android Audio stack and has poor performance.

Doesn't seem like the player has for V50 on the latest version of the app (it sure has not if you're using the phone as a source and piping out to an external DAC through USB, that's for sure). Not sure how Amir thought it did though. It maybe does if using headphones and turning on the Quad DAC function, though you'd have to measure the Analogue-out headphone jack performance to confirm.

 

[bobbooo]

@amirm the developer of the Qudelix 5K Bluetooth DAC amp (former developer of the Radsone Earstudio ES100) has asked this on the Qudelix forum about the measurements of the LG G7 and ES100:

Do you know why there's the difference in the frequency peak levels between two measurements.
The time-domain levels are around 1.0~1.1 VRMS.
But the frequency peak levels show almost 6dB difference, which represents 2x RMS voltage difference.
We're curious why there's a difference in the peaks.
Thank you!

 

[charleski]

There's a problem with LG's implementation of Android 10 that impacts playback of DSD files. Props go to @Tks for first noticing this issue, though he reports more general problems with high samplerates that I can't reproduce.

Both USBAPP and Neutron fail when asked to play a DSD file over DoP. USBAPP pops up a warning message saying it can only play it by coverting to PCM, whereas Neutron is less well behaved and will simply crash the phone if you enable the DoP setting and try to play DSD (only solution is to delete the file). I had no problems playing HiRes PCM in either app though.

 

[charleski]

@amirm the developer of the Qudelix 5K Bluetooth DAC amp (former developer of the Radsone Earstudio ES100) has asked this on the Qudelix forum about the measurements of the LG G7 and ES100:

Do you know why there's the difference in the frequency peak levels between two measurements.
The time-domain levels are around 1.0~1.1 VRMS.
But the frequency peak levels show almost 6dB difference, which represents 2x RMS voltage difference.
We're curious why there's a difference in the peaks.
Thank you!

The SINAD numbers are reported relative to the peak level. The differences in measured peaks are baked into the results.
G7 has a 2nd harmonic down around -115dB. -6 - (-115) = 109dB.
In comparison, the 2nd harmonic on the ES100 is at around -92dB.

 

[Jimbob54]

The SINAD numbers are reported relative to the peak level. The differences in measured peaks are baked into the results.
G7 has a 2nd harmonic down around -115dB. -6 - (-115) = 109dB.
In comparison, the 2nd harmonic on the ES100 is at around -92dB.

My ignorance, but isnt the question why the G7 1k tone wasnt at 0dB? Not how the SINAD is calculated?

 

[charleski]

My ignorance, but isnt the question why the G7 1k tone wasnt at 0dB? Not how the SINAD is calculated?

Well, I don't own an AP so I can't say for sure but I'm guessing this is just an issue with input sensitivity and Amir hadn't recalibrated it to accommodate the lower output he was getting from the G7 (which was because the impedance trigger had set it to line-out mode)

 

[Jimbob54]

Well, I don't own an AP so I can't say for sure but I'm guessing this is just an issue with input sensitivity and Amir hadn't recalibrated it to accommodate the lower output he was getting from the G7 (which was because the impedance trigger had set it to line-out mode)

You're more clued up that I am! I got the slight sense that the guy originating the query (not bobboo) was asking in case something about the testing methodology meant his device had somehow been tested in a way inconsistent with the G7 (and presumably others). But I know nothing!

 

[bobbooo]

Well, I don't own an AP so I can't say for sure but I'm guessing this is just an issue with input sensitivity and Amir hadn't recalibrated it to accommodate the lower output he was getting from the G7 (which was because the impedance trigger had set it to line-out mode)

I'm not sure I fully understand this. The levels for the G7 and ES100 are pretty much the same on the left side of the dashboard at 1-1.1 Vrms, so there is no significantly lower output from the G7 that needed to be 'accommodated'. If this was a miscalibration though, the question is whether that could have affected (decreased) the reported THD for the LG G7 relative to other devices like the ES100 which show a measured level of 0dB on the FFT plot, as opposed to the G7's -6dB. Just guessing here, but could that mean the G7's SINAD is actually 6dB lower (worse) than was reported here on the measurement dashboard?

 

[charleski]

I'm not sure I fully understand this. The levels for the G7 and ES100 are pretty much the same on the left side of the dashboard at 1-1.1 Vrms, so there is no significantly lower output from the G7 that needed to be 'accommodated'. If this was a miscalibration though, the question is whether that could have affected (decreased) the reported THD for the LG G7 relative to other devices like the ES100 which show a measured level of 0dB on the FFT plot, as opposed to the G7's -6dB. Just guessing here, but could that mean the G7's SINAD is actually 6dB lower than was reported on the dashboard?

I suspect the module that measures absolute voltage is separate from the preamp feeding the ADC that runs to the analyser, but I don't know the details of the internals here. But I'm pretty sure the Apx555 has a sufficiently high-quality preamp that 6dB of gain isn't going to change the results. If it did, the difference would be manifest in the noise floor rather than distortion products. It's reasonable to assume that AP uses high-quality well-engineered preamps that won't alter their distortion pattern unless pushed into overload.

So no, I don't think there's an issue here.

 

[Jimbob54]

I'm not sure I fully understand this. The levels for the G7 and ES100 are pretty much the same on the left side of the dashboard at 1-1.1 Vrms, so there is no significantly lower output from the G7 that needed to be 'accommodated'. If this was a miscalibration though, the question is whether that could have affected (decreased) the reported THD for the LG G7 relative to other devices like the ES100 which show a measured level of 0dB on the FFT plot, as opposed to the G7's -6dB. Just guessing here, but could that mean the G7's SINAD is actually 6dB lower (worse) than was reported here on the measurement dashboard?

This has me intrigued now. What does reassure me is that casting my eye down the other dongle/ mini amp type things, all seem to have had 0db for the 1khz tone (as one would expect). So the Radsone has not been treated differently to the rest of the pack (though IIRC amir had to reduce it by 4db not to clip- not great!). Doesnt explain why the G7 had that lower 1k reading though. Not clever enough to understand the implications for the G7 results though.

 

[bigx5murf]

There's a problem with LG's implementation of Android 10 that impacts playback of DSD files. Props go to @Tks for first noticing this issue, though he reports more general problems with high samplerates that I can't reproduce.

Both USBAPP and Neutron fail when asked to play a DSD file over DoP. USBAPP pops up a warning message saying it can only play it by coverting to PCM, whereas Neutron is less well behaved and will simply crash the phone if you enable the DoP setting and try to play DSD (only solution is to delete the file). I had no problems playing HiRes PCM in either app though.

Is this still an issue? I remember running into an issue with playing 88.2kHz sample rate files on my LG V10 years ago, it would cause the file to play at reduced speed.

 

[bobbooo]

This has me intrigued now. What does reassure me is that casting my eye down the other dongle/ mini amp type things, all seem to have had 0db for the 1khz tone (as one would expect). So the Radsone has not been treated differently to the rest of the pack (though IIRC amir had to reduce it by 4db not to clip- not great!). Doesnt explain why the G7 had that lower 1k reading though. Not clever enough to understand the implications for the G7 results though.

Yeah it's the LG G7 measurements that seem to be the odd one out here with the -6dB FFT peak level compared to other measured devices which have a 0dB peak. (The only other difference I can see is the G7's measurement dashboard shows the output as 8 channels, whereas others show 2 channels, but I don't think that's related.) Maybe @amirm can clear up this mini mystery for us?

 

[AllanDavidson]

Got my LG G8 back from RMA.

Does anyone found a way to use the phone as a PC DAC via the USB-C port?

 

[cheap mechanic]

any one know what's the difference between aux mode and high impedence mode? same sound quality? thanks

 

[Deleted member 5035]

any one know what's the difference between aux mode and high impedence mode? same sound quality? thanks

High impedance mode is for driving high impedance headphones, such as a pair of 300 ohm headphones - anything 50 ohms to 600 ohms. This mode puts out two volts RMS. Auxiliary mode is for driving the inputs of audio equipment, such as headphones amplifiers, and puts out one volt RMS. These inputs usually have an impedance in the tens of kilohms.