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Revel M80XC Review (Outdoor Speaker)

Tks

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I don't know how but I got talked into now taking 4 SPL and distortion measurements:

Especially since one of them is 66dB

What's anyone going to do with that?
 

tecnogadget

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Hi @amirm could you (or any member) expand on the tech/principle of action of the plastic cap/ring in front of the tweeter?

I just assume it’s a phase plug, but I’ve always been intrigued as how most manufacturers use different designs.

So maybe some conclusions could be drawn by analyzing the specific shape/morphology.
 

YSC

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No but seriously... what is the point of a distortion measurement this low in level???? Lol.
same feel here... 75db I understand as that as about right for low level background music, but 66...
 

Helicopter

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Thanks Amir. Great to see this performance in the category. Price is a little steep, but not bad considering what less money gets in putdoor speakers. Sensitivity is excellent, which is nice for my outdoor system, where I have a transformer based distributor that sends two amp channels to four pairs of speakers.
 

Dj7675

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Seeing as these are outdoor speakers where the grill would most probably stay in place and never be removed for listening, don’t you think it would have made more sense to conduct the measurements with the grill on? That potentially could have reduced the brightness a bit.
A lot of people are using the M55XC and the M80XC indoors (in particular in atmos setups) in either on wall or on ceiling. I sent in this particular one and was more interested with the grill off. I did a measurement of the M55XC with grill on vs grill off posted here. If I get time I will do a measurement of the M80xc with grill on/off as well. But if someone was planning on using them with the grill on it would be better for the grill on. But ... Amir only has so much time and it would obviously would be unreasonable to do both due to the length of time/effort it takes to do one of these reviews when he has so many products to do.
 

Dj7675

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Since this speaker is designed for on wall use, simulating that use is interesting to see if it would be bright in that situation. For example, many JBL speakers that are desgined for on wall installs show both on wall and free space measurements. The one below is from the JBL 29AV-1 but pretty much all of their contractor series show on wall and free space measurements. At 100hz for example it looks to be around a 5-6 boost. It would seem quite plausible that mounted on wall that their tonal balance might be quite good. When they arrive from Amir I will try to put them on wall and see if the measurments match that kind of boost.

jblFR_Example.png
 

DonH56

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I am using four of these for overheads in my system. I wanted to keep the crossover at 80 Hz so managed to squeeze them in rather than the smaller M55XC. They sound OK to me, but I have never listened to them alone. Used to have time for all sorts of things, maybe when I retire... And of course my AVP will adjust their response to the Harman target curve so they aren't too "bright" for me.
 

mash

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I use these outdoors in my backyard and have been really pleased with the sound. I was hoping that they'd get reviewed so that I could get some EQ settings to work with. Looking forward to some extended play time!
 

Maiky76

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This is a review and detailed measurements of the Revel M80XC outdoor speaker. It was kindly purchased by a member and drop shipped to me for testing. It costs US $900 a pair.

Note: our company, Madrona Digital is a custom integration company and is a dealer for Harman brands such as Revel. So feel free to read what you want into my subjective remarks (objective tests use the same protocol as any other speaker).

As outdoor speakers go, the M80XC is on the larger size but attractively finished:

View attachment 155606

Owner wanted it tested without the grill and this is how it looks:


View attachment 155607

As you see a waveguide is used to better control the directivity (how wide the beam is) as woofer transitions to tweeter. There are no ports as you see in the back:


View attachment 155608

Variable impedance is provided so you can drive it at much higher voltages (to compensate for long runs of speaker wire). And of course plenty of mounting options.

Measurements that you are about to see were performed using the Klippel Near-field Scanner (NFS). This is a robotic measurement system that analyzes the speaker all around and is able (using advanced mathematics and dual scan) to subtract room reflections (so where I measure it doesn't matter). It also measures the speaker at close distance ("near-field") which sharply reduces the impact of room noise. Using computational acoustics, far-field response is computed and that is what I present. Both of these factors enable testing in ordinary rooms yet results that can be more accurate than an anechoic chamber.

I performed over 1000 measurement which resulted in error rate of about 1%. Clean high frequency response is responsible for ease of measurement in this regard.

Reference axis is approximately the center of the tweeter. Grill was not used.

Revel M80XC Measurements
Acoustic measurements can be grouped in a way that can be perceptually analyzed to determine how good a speaker is and how it can be used in a room. This so called spinorama shows us just about everything we need to know about the speaker with respect to tonality and some flaws:

View attachment 155609

On axis response is marred by drooping of the bass response and a couple of resonances. Directivity is good though as we will confirm later. We can see the cause of the resonances in driver response:

View attachment 155610

Our off-axis response is actually better than on-axis:

View attachment 155611

Overall though, there is insufficient bass for the amount of treble we have:

View attachment 155612

Impedance and phase graph show one of the resonances:

View attachment 155613

As noted, directivity is excellent:

View attachment 155614

View attachment 155615\

This is almost studio monitor class directivity control! This should make it produce wider response with similar frequency response and show less sensitivity to its environment. Here is our 3-D baloon during the crossover transition showing good response:

View attachment 155621
Vertically we have the usual issue with 2-way non-coaxial response so aim the speaker to where people's heads are:

View attachment 155616

I don't know how but I got talked into now taking 4 SPL and distortion measurements:

View attachment 155617

At 66 dBSPL distortion is actually below noise floor of the room in low frequencies. And falls off the chart at higher frequencies. As we increase the level, we see mainly the woofer distortion sticking out:

View attachment 155619

Without a port, woofer is staying in control and not going above 100% THD.

Here are the relative distortions for the last two levels:

View attachment 155620

Revel M80XC Listening Tests
I can't simulate outdoor listening indoor so I tested the M80 just like any other hifi speaker. Out of the box, the sound is clear with highs accentuated. Power handling is superb allowing me to get to ear bleeding levels with no hint of bottoming out.

To get rid of the brightness, I used some EQ:

View attachment 155622

The dialed in filters are quick and dirty but were enough to give the speaker more substantial bass and tamed the brightness. The narrow resonance fix had a very subtle effect. Once there, I could enjoy these speakers as if there were truly hi-fi speakers with no reservations. Indeed they would beat many bookshelf speakers out there!

Conclusions
There is definitely care in design of the Revel M80XC for a market that usually doesn't consider such. Cost, looks and dealer margins rule there. If the tuning had more bass and/or less highs, this would be a fantastic speaker regardless of application. As is, it needs a bit of EQ to make it less bright and bring the bass more forward. Once there, it is a very competent design, one that I would be happy to use in a hifi system.

I am going to recommend the Revel M80XC.

-----------
As always, questions, comments, recommendations, etc. are welcome.

Any donations are much appreciated using: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/how-to-support-audio-science-review.8150/

Hi,

Here is my take on the EQ.


These EQ are anechoic EQ to get the speaker right before room integration. If you able to implement these EQs you must add EQ at LF for room integration, that usually not optional… see hints there: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...helf-speaker-review.11144/page-26#post-800725


The raw data with corrected ER and PIR:

Score no EQ: 3.6
With Sub: 6.4

Spinorama with no EQ:
  • Great Directivity
  • Bass light
  • Could be smoother
Revel M80XC No EQ Spinorama.png

Directivity:

Better stay at tweeter height or just under
Horizontally, better toe-in the speakers by 10/20deg and have the axis crossing in front of the listening location, might help dosing the upper range.
Revel M80XC LW better data.png

Revel M80XC 2D surface Directivity Contour Only Data.png

EQ design:

I have generated two EQs. The APO config files are attached.
  • The first one, labelled, LW is targeted at making the LW flat
  • The second, labelled Score, starts with the first one and adds the score as an optimization variable.
  • The EQs are designed in the context of regular stereo use i.e. domestic environment, no warranty is provided for a near field use in a studio environment although the LW might be better suited for this purpose.
  • Score EQ Filter 7: ON PK Fc 7582.10, -1.36, 1.20; 7582.10, -2.00, 0.50 can be adjusted to have a stepper slope in the PIR to get 5.3

Score EQ LW: 4.5
with sub: 7.1

Score EQ Score: 4.7 little to no compromise to the ON/LW
with sub: 7.4


Revel M80XC APO EQ LW 96000Hz September272021-102204 Preamp: -3 dB Filter 1: ON HPQ Fc 53.20, 0.00, 1.20 Filter 2: ON PK Fc 112.03, -1.21, 3.26 Filter 3: ON PK Fc 256.31, 1.65, 1.70 Filter 4: ON PK Fc 1019.47, -1.54, 3.78 Filter 5: ON PK Fc 1178.17, 2.40, 3.95 Filter 6: ON PK Fc 1963.96, -2.82, 3.30 Filter 7: ON PK Fc 15853.64, 2.96, 2.59 Revel M80XC APO EQ Score 96000Hz September272021-101147 Preamp: -2.7 dB Filter 1: ON HPQ Fc 53.25, 0.00, 1.19 Filter 2: ON PK Fc 112.34, -1.26, 3.89 Filter 3: ON PK Fc 251.49, 1.62, 2.21 Filter 4: ON PK Fc 986.26, -1.56, 3.81 Filter 5: ON PK Fc 1187.22, 1.84, 3.87 Filter 6: ON PK Fc 2002.07, -3.20, 2.97 Filter 7: ON PK Fc 7582.10, -1.36, 1.20 Filter 8: ON PK Fc 15819.70, 2.94, 2.45
Revel M80XC EQ Design.png


Spinorama EQ LW
Revel M80XC LW EQ Spinorama.png


Spinorama EQ Score
Revel M80XC Regression.png


Zoom PIR-LW-ON
Revel M80XC Zoom.png


Regression - Tonal
Revel M80XC Regression - Tonal.png

Radar no EQ vs EQ score
small improvements
Revel M80XC Radar.png


The rest of the plots is attached.

Bonus:
Amirm EQ spinorama

Score EQ Amirm: 4.7
with sub: 7.4

Revel M80XC Amirm EQ Spinorama.png
 

Attachments

  • Revel M80XC Horizontal 3D Directivity data.png
    Revel M80XC Horizontal 3D Directivity data.png
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  • Revel M80XC Normalized Directivity data.png
    Revel M80XC Normalized Directivity data.png
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  • Revel M80XC Raw Directivity data.png
    Revel M80XC Raw Directivity data.png
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  • Revel M80XC Reflexion data.png
    Revel M80XC Reflexion data.png
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  • Revel M80XC LW data.png
    Revel M80XC LW data.png
    140.3 KB · Views: 44
  • Revel M80XC 2D surface Directivity Contour Data.png
    Revel M80XC 2D surface Directivity Contour Data.png
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  • Revel M80XC 3D surface Horizontal Directivity Data.png
    Revel M80XC 3D surface Horizontal Directivity Data.png
    437.1 KB · Views: 68
  • Revel M80XC 3D surface Vertical Directivity Data.png
    Revel M80XC 3D surface Vertical Directivity Data.png
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  • Revel M80XC Vertical 3D Directivity data.png
    Revel M80XC Vertical 3D Directivity data.png
    416.9 KB · Views: 60
  • Revel M80XC Amirm EQ Spinorama.png
    Revel M80XC Amirm EQ Spinorama.png
    171.4 KB · Views: 68
  • Revel M80XC APO EQ LW 96000Hz.txt
    385 bytes · Views: 46
  • Revel M80XC Score EQ Spinorama.png
    Revel M80XC Score EQ Spinorama.png
    162.3 KB · Views: 75
  • Revel M80XC APO EQ Score 96000Hz.txt
    435 bytes · Views: 43

gags11

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Amir, thank you for reviewing these speakers!

I have these Revel M80XC speakers in my back yard, which have replaced B&Ws. I love them! Subjectively, they sound smoother than the B&Ws and handle more power before distorting.

Also, love the installation and the center mounted screw. The speaker can be tilted in vertical and horizontal directions as you please.

675359AD-9F76-45B6-BB12-97AC57D8B947.jpeg


169829CE-E867-4A5B-B773-EFECA4DC62F8.jpeg
 

seedragon

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Great review @amirm ! I run 4x M80XC as overheads and they work great. The combination of sound quality and mounting flexibility is really what sets them apart. It's helpful to see that they have some vertical dispersion issues so I'll need to repoint them at the MLP. Thanks!
 

Dj7675

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Great review @amirm ! I run 4x M80XC as overheads and they work great. The combination of sound quality and mounting flexibility is really what sets them apart. It's helpful to see that they have some vertical dispersion issues so I'll need to repoint them at the MLP. Thanks!
Did you mount your M80XC's on ceiling or on wall?
 

stevenswall

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Coaxial outdoor speakers would be nice but I've never seen one. Less worrying about putting them at head height vs seating height vs raising them and pointing down, and getting them far enough away that nobody is in an irregular response area while then worrying about having them louder due to the distance, which then makes them even louder for those they are closest to, etc.
 

f1shb0n3

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Coaxial outdoor speakers would be nice but I've never seen one. Less worrying about putting them at head height vs seating height vs raising them and pointing down, and getting them far enough away that nobody is in an irregular response area while then worrying about having them louder due to the distance, which then makes them even louder for those they are closest to, etc.
It might be impossible to create coaxial sealed outdoor speaker due to the gap between tweeter and midrange.
 

stevenswall

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It might be impossible to create coaxial sealed outdoor speaker due to the gap between tweeter and midrange.

That gap isn't an inherent requirement of coaxial designs. That was solved over a decade ago and published for all to see by Genelec with their 8260 whitepaper which seems to be totally ignored by all other speaker companies that make coaxial drivers.
 

JEarle

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Coaxial outdoor speakers would be nice but I've never seen one. Less worrying about putting them at head height vs seating height vs raising them and pointing down, and getting them far enough away that nobody is in an irregular response area while then worrying about having them louder due to the distance, which then makes them even louder for those they are closest to, etc.
I have some Tannoy DVS6’s and 4’s that I’m using for outdoor speakers. They are fine for the task.
 

jhaider

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Coaxial outdoor speakers would be nice but I've never seen one.

Tannoy has made outdoor speakers (5”-8”) with their signature Dual Concentric coax for decades. Their AMS series of outdoor speakers are, like Revel 55/80, popular as height channels. Some of the newer ones also have EQ presets in lab.gruppen amps.
 

f1shb0n3

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Trying to figure out the minimum, ideal and maximum listening distance based on the vertical dispersion width and the angle the speaker is tilted down. Measured at the maximum downwards tilt as mounted speaker bottom to wall as 62.2 degrees, but it seemed to me the speaker front is not at right angle with speaker bottom. Could not measure that as my angle measurement tool is too long, assuming it's at least 5 degrees. I'd appreciate if someone can measure it precisely and post it here so I can update my calculations.

Using the following given measurements:
Tweeter height: 9 ft
Tweeter axis to wall angle: 69.2 degrees (62.2 + 5)
Maximum downwards angle from tweeter axis for even dispersion: 16 degrees (lenient reddish area from Amir's measurements)
Maximum upwards angle from tweeter axis for even dispersion: 16 degrees (lenient reddish area from Amir's measurements)
Standing ear-to-ground distance: 5 ft
Sitting ear-to-ground distance: 40 inches

Here's how the diagram looks like and the calculated minimum/ideal/maximum sitting/standing distance in feet:

Revel M80XC listening range diagram.png
This seems useful, probably there's a website that does that calculation, but could not find one.
Attaching the Autodesk Fusion 360 file if anyone wants to play with it (remove .txt extension before opening).
 

Attachments

  • Revel M80XC Speaker Dispersion Calculator.f3d.txt
    55.3 KB · Views: 66
Last edited:
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