Revel F228Be Review (Speaker)

[Jimd]

Just came in to replace my f208's

Do they need a long burn in time ?
Also, where are the spikes ? I won't use them
but I didn't find them in the boxes

 

[ahofer]

Just came in to replace my f208's

Do they need a long burn in time ?
Also, where are the spikes ? I won't use them
but I didn't find them in the boxes

I recommend you use these to make them easy to move and protect the floor/bottom of the speaker

Threaded Stud Glider

Nifty glider replaces threaded spikes or cones for loudspeaker or rack isolation and mobility with superb lateral stability. (With an efficient decoupling approach, spikes are not really needed at all.) Fiberglass reinforced dBNeutralizer-filled vinyl base with smooth polymer bottom handles...

herbiesaudiolab.com

They require no burn-in at all, like most loudspeakers.


PS - in terms of screw/foot size, these worked on my F228be

 

[Jimd]

I recommend you use these to make them easy to move and protect the floor/bottom of the speaker

Threaded Stud Glider

Nifty glider replaces threaded spikes or cones for loudspeaker or rack isolation and mobility with superb lateral stability. (With an efficient decoupling approach, spikes are not really needed at all.) Fiberglass reinforced dBNeutralizer-filled vinyl base with smooth polymer bottom handles...

herbiesaudiolab.com

They require no burn-in at all, like most loudspeakers.

I use vibro fon with great results.

 

[Wardo]

Revel F228Be Review (Speaker)

To F228Be owners, are your mid drivers in a sealed enclosure, separate from the woofers? To verify, does your mid move (a few mm) when playing bass heavy songs? If you seal the port and push on your woofers, does your mid move?

audiosciencereview.com

After reading this and looking at the pic of the shoddy internal finishing, makes me want to pull a mid from each of the new 228's I received two weeks ago and take a look!

 

[Jeff M.]

Here you can see one of the walls of the mid chamber is not glued or sealed. That is an Amazon gift card that freely moves in the gap. I have a quarter for reference but it also moves freely. Two quarters may fit, the gap is so large.

Not bad for $11k/pair MSRP.
View attachment 421353

Wow that’s a lot of money for a mistake like that. Am glade you reached out to Revel and the dealer. This is why I have been building my own speakers for years now. Not to put any company down. I have the best quality control and am my worst customer.

I hope this wasn’t a new pair of speakers?

 

[drdansil]

Has anyone compared the Revel Performa 228 BE to the KEF LS60? Any one think one is much better than the other?

 

[sigbergaudio]

Has anyone compared the Revel Performa 228 BE to the KEF LS60? Any one think one is much better than the other?

I have only heard the LS60. The Revel will likely be able to play quite a bit louder.

If I were to give a qualified guess, I suspect the Revel might sound a bit better too, but that's speculation.

Judging from the measurements they're both tonally pleasant, the LS60 being tonally fuller out of the box, a bit on the warm side of neutral based on my listening tests. While the 228 BE looks to be pretty neutral.

 

[kyuu]

Yep, agree with the above mostly. The LS60 is really about as good as a speaker can get up to its limits, but if you're doing far-field listening at high SPLs it can start to compress in the bass region due to the built-in limiters. The F228Be shouldn't have this issue, assuming the attached amp can keep up of course. The LS60 also does have a pretty heavy down-tilt in the PIR that seems typical of KEF's higher-end speakers, which could result in the "warm" sound mentioned. However, this would be easy enough to correct with EQ, which the LS60 includes in its software.

The other main difference would probably be the dispersion: the LS60, typical of coaxials, is somewhat more narrow (or direct, if you prefer). The F228Be is wide and, typical of Revel designs, actually depends on side-wall reflections to get an optimal PIR. Which is better? That's a matter of debate/preference/specifics of the setup.

Hard to go wrong either way, ultimately.

 

[drdansil]

Yep, agree with the above mostly. The LS60 is really about as good as a speaker can get up to its limits, but if you're doing far-field listening at high SPLs it can start to compress in the bass region due to the built-in limiters. The F228Be shouldn't have this issue, assuming the attached amp can keep up of course. The LS60 also does have a pretty heavy down-tilt in the PIR that seems typical of KEF's higher-end speakers, which could result in the "warm" sound mentioned. However, this would be easy enough to correct with EQ, which the LS60 includes in its software.

The other main difference would probably be the dispersion: the LS60, typical of coaxials, is somewhat more narrow (or direct, if you prefer). The F228Be is wide and, typical of Revel designs, actually depends on side-wall reflections to get an optimal PIR. Which is better? That's a matter of debate/preference/specifics of the setup.

Hard to go wrong either way, ultimately.

Appreciate all the feedback. I'll update if/when I get to listen to either.

 

[sdo_riga]

For bi-amplification of F228Be with an active crossover, what should be a reasonable power rating for amplifiers driving low and high (medium and high drivers) on the speaker? The manual recommends 50-350W per channel with a single connection.

​

 

[amper42]

For bi-amplification of F228Be with an active crossover, what should be a reasonable power rating for amplifiers driving low and high (medium and high drivers) on the speaker? The manual recommends 50-350W per channel with a single connection.

​

To be honest, you won't gain anything from bi-amping the Revel F228Be. Just be sure to use the top speaker terminals with your amp for optimal performance. A single Purifi 1ET6525SA amp does a fabulous job with these speakers as well as the older Hypex NCx500. The F228Be speakers are crazy sensitive and will provide huge volumes with minimal power. I currently use a NCx500 with my Revel F228Be and they completely fill the room. I have a Boxem Purifi on the Revel F328Be and it also does a fabulous job. Paying double for amps won't result in your ears being any more delighted. In fact, it might actually sound worse in some cases. I know it's hard to believe that more complicated and expensive isn't always better? Have fun!

If you want superb sound control on your Revel F228Be speakers get an RME ADI-2 DAC FS and load the ADI-2 software on your computer. Now play your favorite tunes while adjusting the Loudness controls in the app just the way you want them. It's amazing the differences this tool can offer in real time. After hearing what it can do it's my absolute favorite accessory. Whether it's more impactful, hard thumping bass or treble with better clarity than you ever remember - its all possible.

 

[Laserjock]

For bi-amplification of F228Be with an active crossover, what should be a reasonable power rating for amplifiers driving low and high (medium and high drivers) on the speaker? The manual recommends 50-350W per channel with a single connection.

​

How would you bypass the passive crossover?

 

[sdo_riga]

How would you bypass the passive crossover?

The crossover would be not bypassed completely. The low filter for woofer and high filter for mid-range and twitter would not be connected at the terminals with a crossbar.

 

[Laserjock]

The crossover would be not bypassed completely. The low filter for woofer and high filter for mid-range and twitter would not be connected at the terminals with a crossbar.

Then @amper42 explanation applies here. There are a few people here that do what you want.
If it’s something you want to pursue. You could even ask in a general speaker thread as well.

 

[frodaddi]

To be honest, you won't gain anything from bi-amping the Revel F228Be. Just be sure to use the top speaker terminals with your amp for optimal performance.

You know, I saw this in the user manual but I can’t understand why it would make any difference. With the jumpers in place aren’t the upper and lower terminals electrically identical?

I have mine connected to the lower terminals, so this did catch my eye

 

[amper42]

You know, I saw this in the user manual but I can’t understand why it would make any difference. With the jumpers in place aren’t the upper and lower terminals electrically identical?

I have mine connected to the lower terminals, so this did catch my eye

Revel recommends using the upper (high-frequency) terminals on the F228Be for single-wire amplifier connections primarily for practical reasons related to signal path and crossover design. When connecting via a single speaker cable (with the factory-installed shorting straps in place), using the high-frequency terminals ensures the signal first travels through the high-frequency section of the crossover network. The low-frequency section is then fed via the shorting straps, resulting in optimal integration between drivers and potentially minimizing any losses or degradation that can occur if the signal travels in the opposite direction.

While the speaker will function properly if connected to either set of terminals, Revel’s advice to use the upper (high-frequency) terminals is intended to ensure the most direct and cleanest signal path for the sensitive high-frequency drivers - as they can be impacted by small losses or changes in signal quality.

I tried it both ways and decided Revel knew what they were talking about.

 

[Laserjock]

I figured the opposite and the low frequency signal could handle more power but then ran a double wire from both just in case. (Short double 12ga wire between the two).

Now that I think about it, maybe time to deoxit..

 

[sdo_riga]

To be honest, you won't gain anything from bi-amping the Revel F228Be. Just be sure to use the top speaker terminals with your amp for optimal performance. A single Purifi 1ET6525SA amp does a fabulous job with these speakers as well as the older Hypex NCx500. The F228Be speakers are crazy sensitive and will provide huge volumes with minimal power. I currently use a NCx500 with my Revel F228Be and they completely fill the room. I have a Boxem Purifi on the Revel F328Be and it also does a fabulous job. Paying double for amps won't result in your ears being any more delighted. In fact, it might actually sound worse in some cases. I know it's hard to believe that more complicated and expensive isn't always better? Have fun!

If you want superb sound control on your Revel F228Be speakers get an RME ADI-2 DAC FS and load the ADI-2 software on your computer. Now play your favorite tunes while adjusting the Loudness controls in the app just the way you want them. It's amazing the differences this tool can offer in real time. After hearing what it can do it's my absolute favorite accessory. Whether it's more impactful, hard thumping bass or treble with better clarity than you ever remember - its all possible.

Some subjective mental acrobatics for me to lean towards bi-amplification are as follows. Let me take a look at 50Hz and 5kHz notes reproduction as an example.

• A transient note for 50Hz (big drum hit!) will modulate 5kHz note.
  • As no power supply is perfect, voltage fluctuations at 50Hz rate due to a large current for the 'low' 50Hz will result is subtly pulses in volume for 5kHz note.
  • No power supply especially for a high current always has 0 (zero) voltage drop before the voltage recovery. Better ones have remote V sensing point and compensate for the wire's R and C. Quote from RME's DPS-2 "the output has sensor technology, which measures and adapts the output voltage directly at the DC connector of the supplied DC cable."
• As woofer requires a lot of current vs. twitter and mid-range, that 50Hz may push the output transistor into a non-linear output region (see typical MOSFET IRF9Z34NPBF charts attached). Furthermore, that large current for 50Hz note probably heats up that output transistor reducing that MOSFET's linear region even more.
• That woofer's coil return movement at 50Hz generates back EMF current, which goes to the amp for damping and through cross-over to other drivers as electric noise. Revel specifies total loop resistant <0.07Ohm for a reason as modern amps have very high low impedance (i.e.very high damping factor). Bi-wiring helps to get that current to the amp first for damping before hitting to the other driver...

Is above measurable? Perhaps by an SME.

Revel customer service responded very fast (!) that for bi-amping F228Be the guidelines is 200W per channel, i.e. equal between high and low frequence drivers on the speaker.

What's I do not consider is bi-amplification with 4 linear mono blocks. That's expensive... So options are so far

1. 2x 1ET9040BA monoblocs for each channel at 360W each into 8Ohm <-->RME ADI-2 DAC FS <--> MiniDSP SHD Studio.
2. 4x Topping B200 (200W for each band of each speaker) + active cross-over (Venu360) <--> RME ADI-2 DAC FS <--> MiniDSP SHD Studio
3. 4x Topping B200 (200W for each band of each speaker) + MiniDSP SHD as the pre-amp/cross-over.

Any thoughts?

 

[amper42]

Some subjective mental acrobatics for me to lean towards bi-amplification are as follows. Let me take a look at 50Hz and 5kHz notes reproduction as an example.

• A transient note for 50Hz (big drum hit!) will modulate 5kHz note.
  • As no power supply is perfect, voltage fluctuations at 50Hz rate due to a large current for the 'low' 50Hz will result is subtly pulses in volume for 5kHz note.
  • No power supply especially for a high current always has 0 (zero) voltage drop before the voltage recovery. Better ones have remote V sensing point and compensate for the wire's R and C). Quote from RME's DPS-2 "the output has sensor technology, which measures and adapts the output voltage directly at the DC connector of the supplied DC cable."
• As woofer requires a lot of current vs. twitter and mid-range, that 50Hz may push the output transistor into a non-linear output region (see typical MOSFET IRF9Z34NPBF charts attached). Furthermore, that large current for 50Hz note probably heats up that output transistor reducing that MOSFET's linear region even more.
• That woofer's coil return movement at 50Hz generates back EMF current, which goes to the amp for damping and through cross-over to other drivers as electric noise. Revel specifies total loop resistant <0.07Ohm for a reason as modern amps have very high low impedance (i.e.very high damping factor). Bi-wiring helps to get that current to the amp first for damping before hitting to the other driver...

Is above measurable? Perhaps by an SME.

What's I do not consider is bi-amplification with 4 linear mono blocks. That's expensive... So options are so far

1. 2x 1ET9040BA monoblocs for each channel at 360W each into 8Ohm <-->RME ADI-2 DAC FS <--> MiniDSP SHD Studio.
2. 4x Topping B200 (200W for each band of each speaker) + active cross-over (Venu360) <--> RME ADI-2 DAC FS <--> MiniDSP SHD Studio
3. 4x Topping B200 (200W for each band of each speaker) + MiniDSP SHD as the pre-amp/cross-over.

Any thoughts?

Here's my thoughts:
1. My F228Be are typically using 5-8W at 85dB which is loud for simply listening to music. You could save a bundle by using a standard Purifi or Hypex amp.
2. I connect: MacBook Pro/Audirvana -> Wifi -> RPi4/Moode/UPnP -> USB -> RME ADI-2 DAC FS -> Purifi -> F228Be (No need for MiniDSP)
3. I doubt you will hear a noticeable difference with biAmp while costs grow significantly and complication can easily lead to problems.

Everyone has their own path.

Have fun!

 

[Oddball]

I tried bi-amping C426 as have free channel on Bryston 4B SST2 stereo amp (2x500W into 4 ohm). Could not hear any difference so continued using just one channel. Amp runs a bit less hot with only one channel.