Revel 126be

[Paul7777x]

I really don’t see anywhere that a Beryllium tweeter is inherently harsh, sharp or anything of the kind.

Nor have the Revels anything but the finest rep and measurements.

So if you’re hearing anything like that it’s not your speakers.

As ever, any issues are almost certainly room and speaker positioning problems.

As mentioned above, the room is at least a bit hard and bare. The floor, and coffe table provide acres of reflective space.

And, also as above, you may well be making and HF worse by having the speakers out from the wall. It may be causing a bass or mid/bass cancellation that forces the sound to appear toppy.

Personally I’d get at least a good sized rug. As thick as is reasonably possible. And get rid of the coffee table (if that’s genuinely impossible, then replace it with one that has less surface area).

I’d also hardly continue without introducing some DSP room correction.

 

[Paul7777x]

If you’d like to put the whole thing to bed and get top class sound and forget about it, I’d sell the Arcam and the Bluesound and buy a Lyngdorf TDAi 1120.

A used one should be available for around £1300 or less.

The amp itself is exceptional and Room Perfect something else altogether.

 

[waynel]

1) treat that room. Get a large rug , some more soft furniture and perhaps a few gik or similar panels behind the speakers.
2) replace the blue sound node and the arcam with a Wiim ultra amp.

The arcam doesn’t allow for high pass filters for the main speakers so sub integration will be difficult/poor even with a miniDSP unit.

 

[Sde]

If you’d like to put the whole thing to bed and get top class sound and forget about it, I’d sell the Arcam and the Bluesound and buy a Lyngdorf TDAi 1120.

A used one should be available for around £1300 or less.

The amp itself is exceptional and Room Perfect something else altogether.

Why would that be better than the Arcam and Bluesound combined with MiniDSP on which you can run Dirac if needed?

 

[Sde]

1) treat that room. Get a large rug , some more soft furniture and perhaps a few gik or similar panels behind the speakers.
2) replace the blue sound node and the arcam with a Wiim ultra amp.

The arcam doesn’t allow for high pass filters for the main speakers so sub integration will be difficult/poor even with a miniDSP unit.

I don’t understand. Isn’t that exactly what the MiniDSP is good at, sending the filtered signal to Arcam and sub?

 

[waynel]

I don’t understand. Isn’t that exactly what the MiniDSP is good at, sending the filtered signal to Arcam and sub?

If you do that you won’t be able to use the volume control on your arcam. The Wiim amp ultra does everything in one box. It’s also much cheaper than the used value of your current arcam a plus blue sound (not to mention buying another box from minidsp)

 

[Sde]

If you do that you won’t be able to use the volume control on your arcam. The Wiim amp ultra does everything in one box. It’s also much cheaper than the used value of your current arcam a plus blue sound (not to mention buying another box from minidsp)

I can see some advantages to your approach - simplicity, pricing. Wiim has the filters, delay on board. MiniDSP has more EQ options. But is the Wiim basically as good as the Arcam… Controlling volume using the MiniDSP is possible, or are there disadvantages to this approach?

 

[Paul7777x]

Why would that be better than the Arcam and Bluesound combined with MiniDSP on which you can run Dirac if needed?

I used the Minidsp DDRC24 with Dirac for about four years with active speakers and passive.

It was very good indeed. I enjoyed everything it was able to do.

I also had the Arcam SR250. With Dirac.

And it was very good indeed too. Plenty of power and Dirac did it’s usual great stuff.

But neither is a patch on the quality of room correction that the Lyngdorf has.

The 1120 is a dac/ streamer/preamp/amp and stereo sub preamp.

Room Perfect is the simplest, most easy to use DSP I’ve ever come across.

Literally plug and mic and play.

I’ll never go back to no room correction, even for a hundred thousand pound pair of speakers (free), and out of all the ones I’ve used (RP, Dirac Live, ARC, Antimode) RP is simply the best DSP by a good margin.

 

[waynel]

I can see some advantages to your approach - simplicity, pricing. Wiim has the filters, delay on board. MiniDSP has more EQ options. But is the Wiim basically as good as the Arcam… Controlling volume using the MiniDSP is possible, or are there disadvantages to this approach?

What's the point of having an integrated amp if you can't use its controls?
The WIiM measures pretty well and will be better than your current combination. If you want more power you can use a different WIiM with an external amp.

 

[BobbyTimmons]

So I might have two issues. The beryllium which is what it is and can not be corrected. And the frequency response. Can I do something about that with a MiniDSP? Or should I just skip the effort and search for a different speaker….

Objectively the M126Be measures about as close to what this forum would call perfection as a passive speaker can get above 150hz. It's within 1.5 db of perfect all the way from 150hz to around 15,000hz. But it's possible that you dislike its perfect frequency response subjectively and would prefer a different frequency response. There will also be issues from your very reflective room although these effects will be more noticeable in the lower half of the range.

 

[kyuu]

But it's possible that you dislike its perfect frequency response subjectively and would prefer a different frequency response.

Unlikely.

There will also be issues from your very reflective room

More likely. The OP still might try speakers with narrower directivity and/or a more pronounced downward PIR tilt such as a decent pair of KEFs if a bit of "room treatment" (rug, furnishings) and playing with positioning doesn't alleviate the perceived issue.

 

[Beave]

A carpet on the floor would help

Yeah, a thick rug might help a lot.

To test that out before buying a rug (or any other speakers or electronics), get a couple (or a few) thick blankets/comforters/sleeping bags and place them on the floor between the speakers and the coffee table.

Also, try moving the table out of the area and see whether that makes a difference.

Free and easy things to try before spending any $$.

 

[Sde]

Yeah, a thick rug might help a lot.

To test that out before buying a rug (or any other speakers or electronics), get a couple (or a few) thick blankets/comforters/sleeping bags and place them on the floor between the speakers and the coffee table.

Also, try moving the table out of the area and see whether that makes a difference.

Free and easy things to try before spending any $$.

Thanks, and to all others as well. I will start with the purchase of a microphone, connect to laptop with REW. And then indeed play with free adjustments, moving tables, placing sleeping bags, adjusting speaker placement. Measuring difference before and after.

 

[CapMan]

Hard and harsh. 90% of your issue is likely there.

I imagine the reflective coffee table isn't helping, you will get reflections from it to your ears. Try putting a folded throw or similar on it.

 

[Sde]

I imagine the reflective coffee table isn't helping, you will get reflections from it to your ears. Try putting a folded throw or similar on it.

But then after all the tweets and measurements ….. convincing my counterpart

 

[Marc v E]

Thanks, and to all others as well. I will start with the purchase of a microphone, connect to laptop with REW. And then indeed play with free adjustments, moving tables, placing sleeping bags, adjusting speaker placement. Measuring difference before and after.

Good call. Keep us updated. It was a pleasure to help.
In my experience this is a good video to start:

 

[Marc v E]

But then after all the tweets and measurements ….. convincing my counterpart

Good sound and good interior design can go hand in hand. Ime often one improves the other if you know what to do.

A rug not only makes the speakers sound better, it often looks better.
Same with placing the speakers close to a wall, easy to eq the extra bass and often in line with what interior designers want.
Curtains reduce echo and often improve the living room visually too.
Placing a couch in the room instead of directly against the back wall improves sound considerably and improves the room too ime.
Conversations and speech on tv or music are easier to understand and more natural. This makes it a pleasant place to be.

There are a few designers on youtube who know what they're talking about. Learning from them makes the conversation regarding interior design something positive you can be involved in and build together. Take the conversation to her design interest and you may find a happy middle way.

 

[Sde]

Good call. Keep us updated. It was a pleasure to help.
In my experience this is a good video to start:

Quick look at the video. And already in the beginning during setup you need to select the output device. Can I do the measurements on an isolated laptop with the mic connected?

 

[Sde]

Good sound and good interior design can go hand in hand. Ime often one improves the other if you know what to do.

A rug not only makes the speakers sound better, it often looks better.
Same with placing the speakers close to a wall, easy to eq the extra bass and often in line with what interior designers want.
Curtains reduce echo and often improve the living room visually too.
Placing a couch in the room instead of directly against the back wall improves sound considerably and improves the room too ime.
Conversations and speech on tv or music are easier to understand and more natural. This makes it a pleasant place to be.

There are a few designers on youtube who know what they're talking about. Learning from them makes the conversation regarding interior design something positive you can be involved in and build together. Take the conversation to her design interest and you may find a happy middle way.

That video will be really helpful. Thanks for that. But there will need to be a coffee table

 

[Sde]

I imagine the reflective coffee table isn't helping, you will get reflections from it to your ears. Try putting a folded throw or similar on it.

Acoustic room improvement, step one . I also placed a matras upright behind listening position. Maybe small improvement, not sure yet. PS Do you all also find that Tracy Chapman her voice sounds metallic in Baby can I hold you?