Request: Budget in-wall LCR testing

[Pooraphile]

There is not a whole lot of objective testing for in-wall speakers... and I can't be the only one with a SO that wants discrete speakers as a compromise to me spending more than $50 on something like a sound bar (she would be satisfied with just the tv speakers!).

Seeing the review of the Monoprice THX-365IW gave me hope that there are affordable options that don't suck! But, there is little to no actual testing of options just below that price point. And I can't even find the Monolith speakers in-stock at Monoprice - are they no longer manufacturing them?

While I would really appreciate some formal testing, I am also willing to take subjective recommendations (or warnings) at this point, too! I should mention these are not going in a dedicated theater room, but into a large, non-uniformly shaped, open concept living room. LCR mounted at as close to head height while surrounding a flat screen TV. I am not looking for some unicorn speaker that beats a $3000 THX speaker at 1/10th the price. I am just looking for quality sound and good value.

Here are the following speakers that I am seeing in my budget (<$200/speaker):

• Klipsch R-5650-S II
• Klipsch R-5502-W
• Klipsch R-5800-W II
• Polk Audio 265-RT
• Polk Audio 265-LS
• Polk Audio 65-RT
• Monoprice Amber 8in
• Monoprice Amber 5.25in 3-way
• Monoprice Amber 6.5in 3-way
• Monoprice Alpha 8in
• Yamaha NS-IW470
• Yamaha NS-IW660
• JBL Stage 260W
• JBL Professional Control 128W

I am still on the Amazon "nice list" and could probably get away with buying all of these, setting them up on the proper sized MDF, testing them in some sort of whirlwind round up with amirm, and then returning the ones that don't make the cut. Although I have no idea how long it actually takes to test each speaker, so that could be unrealistic. The thought crossed my mind that I do that anyways with just my subjective ear and doing A-B testing.

Thanks in advance for any advice or solidarity with non-audio minded SOs

 

[Timcognito]

Worth a view if new to In Walls.

 

[-Matt-]

Have you also considered on-wall speakers?

I'm thinking that the Kef Q4 Metas might end up being comparable in price after you have factored in bashing holes in the walls, plastering and painting.

Q4 Meta

Discover the Q4 Meta HiFi Speaker from KEF. With a 5.25” Uni-Q driver with MAT™, this 2-way on-wall speaker delivers precise, high-fidelity sound.

uk.kef.com

Measurements in the white paper...

KEF Q Series with MAT Whitepaper

Hi everyone, I’m happy to share the much-awaited Q Series with MAT whitepaper. Thank you all for your patience, and I hope you enjoy reading it! Please note that due to the upload limit on ASR, I had to compress the document before attaching it. The high-resolution PDF should be available on...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[kyuu]

I almost sent in the Klipsch 5502-W for testing... but then I saw how well the Revel W553L measured and just returned the Klipsch and got a few of those instead. Erin's video is a good overview (and he measures the W553L as well), though I'm pretty sure all of those are well outside your price range. Keep in mind that Revel and JBL can often be acquired through a dealer for well under MSRP (what I did for mine). The JBL Stage 250WL and JBL Studio 2 55IW can both almost certainly be sourced from a dealer for around the $200 mark.

But yeah, I'd love to have more measurements of in-walls myself, being an in-wall booster (they have more advantages than just being visually unobstrusive). So if you want to buy some of those (along with the Klipsch 5502-W, which I'm guessing will have a typical budget Klipsch response, I'd love to see the Polk 265-RT get measured as that port is pretty unusual for an in-wall design) and send them to Amir, please do!3

Edit: In response to above, you shouldn't have to plaster or paint unless you really mess up your install (should probably cut the hole, for starters, not bash it) or are building out the wall from scratch.

 

[-Matt-]

Edit: In response to above, you shouldn't have to plaster or paint unless you really mess up your install (should probably cut the hole, for starters, not bash it) or are building out the wall from scratch.

Walls (in the UK) are typically brick or breeze block so cutting a hole is probably a bit of a bigger job!

 

[kyuu]

Walls (in the UK) are typically brick or breeze block so cutting a hole is probably a bit of a bigger job!

That's fair. I live in the western U.S. where walls are typically drywall/gypsum, which is definitely easier to modify than brick!

 

[amirm]

In-wall speakers require me to build a custom baffle for each one to test. In other words, pain in the neck especially when it is cold and wet outside. My woodshop is in shambles so I have to use potable tools which makes for more of a hassle.

Still, I just tested a high-end in-wall speaker. And have a budget one that has been waiting for months.

 

[Timcognito]

In-wall speakers require me to build a custom baffle for each one to test. In other words, pain in the neck especially when it is cold and wet outside. My woodshop is in shambles so I have to use potable tools which makes for more of a hassle.

Still, I just tested a high-end in-wall speaker. And have a budget one that has been waiting for months.

Thanks for still working on them a lot of us have an interest (dream) of using them. There are many advantages such the 2pi response efficiency, lack of baffle step, removal of front wall short delay reflection and WAF, among others. There is little information on accurate design compared to boxes, so the work is much appreciated. I wish I lived closer to help out.

 

[Pooraphile]

Worth a view if new to In Walls.

I watched the video, but those are all well out of my price range. I did appreciate Erin's insights though.

 

[Pooraphile]

Have you also considered on-wall speakers?

I'm thinking that the Kef Q4 Metas might end up being comparable in price after you have factored in bashing holes in the walls, plastering and painting.

Q4 Meta

Discover the Q4 Meta HiFi Speaker from KEF. With a 5.25” Uni-Q driver with MAT™, this 2-way on-wall speaker delivers precise, high-fidelity sound.

uk.kef.com

Measurements in the white paper...

KEF Q Series with MAT Whitepaper

Hi everyone, I’m happy to share the much-awaited Q Series with MAT whitepaper. Thank you all for your patience, and I hope you enjoy reading it! Please note that due to the upload limit on ASR, I had to compress the document before attaching it. The high-resolution PDF should be available on...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Like kyuu referenced, I am in the PNW and have easily modified drywall walls. So the labor is free So that still puts the Kef Q4 out of my price range.

I have 10' walls on that side which offers plenty of volume. So, I am pretty set on in-walls at my price, sound quality, and SO restrictions

 

[Pooraphile]

In-wall speakers require me to build a custom baffle for each one to test. In other words, pain in the neck especially when it is cold and wet outside. My woodshop is in shambles so I have to use potable tools which makes for more of a hassle.

Still, I just tested a high-end in-wall speaker. And have a budget one that has been waiting for months.

Are you building a custom volume enclosure based on the manufacturers recommendations? Could you just build a "standard" size 2 or 3 cubic foot backside enclosure to replicate a stud wall and then have a middle panel on the front replaceable based on speaker size with the surrounding, extending edges being permanent (and consistent across testing)? I would be happy to build it out after my move, I have scrap 2x4s, drywall, and finished plywood just sitting here.

And thanks for all the reviews you have already done!

 

[kyuu]

Are you building a custom volume enclosure based on the manufacturers recommendations? Could you just build a "standard" size 2 or 3 cubic foot backside enclosure to replicate a stud wall and then have a middle panel on the front replaceable based on speaker size with the surrounding, extending edges being permanent (and consistent across testing)? I would be happy to build it out after my move, I have scrap 2x4s, drywall, and finished plywood just sitting here.

And thanks for all the reviews you have already done!

I'm pretty sure Amir just builds a baffle large enough to simulate an "infinite" baffle, and the back of the speaker is open (no enclosure). This works for Klippel testing (although I believe the results aren't necessarily accurate for the bass response as it would be in a real installation), but is also why he doesn't do listening tests as it's not actually installed in a wall cavity. You couldn't just use a really small wall cavity, as Erin's testing showed with those speakers that use back boxes: too small of a volume for the enclosure has detrimental effects on the frequency response. And using a properly sized wall cavity would pose practical problems for the Klippel machine.

 

[Pooraphile]

I'm pretty sure Amir just builds a baffle large enough to simulate an "infinite" baffle, and the back of the speaker is open (no enclosure). This works for Klippel testing (although I believe the results aren't necessarily accurate for the bass response as it would be in a real installation), but is also why he doesn't do listening tests as it's not actually installed in a wall cavity. You couldn't just use a really small wall cavity, as Erin's testing showed with those speakers that use back boxes: too small of a volume for the enclosure has detrimental effects on the frequency response. And using a properly sized wall cavity would pose practical problems for the Klippel machine.

I saw the issues with back boxes. How big is too big for the Klippel machine? A 2x6 studwall that is 3.25ft high is 2 cubic feet. Which is the minimum for a lot of these style speakers. The height of the wall is similar to the height of a lot of tower speakers, so I have to imagine the struggle would be the width when trying to simulate a wall surface.