JDS labs Headphone amp/pre and separate JDS DAC?
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but the JDS atom line doesn't have power amplifiers, so I wouldn't be able to find anything that matches visually... but that's a fairly minor issue, I realize.
SMSL 500 mk II. Half your budget. If it lasts 7.5 years, shouldn't that be good enough? One box to do it all again. More attractive plus XLR out as an option.
This is a review and detailed measurements of the SMSL M500 MKII DAC and Headphone Amplifier. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $440. I really like the look of the new SMSL UI. It is more modern and nicer to look at. I am surprised though that they still show the input data type in...
www.audiosciencereview.com
Hahah that's a cute little box.
And yeah, in theory, from a purely economic basis, your concept of "half the budget for half the lifespan is the same thing" works out, but there's other considerations. I don't
want to financially support brands that pump out unreliable electronics, I don't want to contribute to the mounting global E-waste problem, etc. I'd much rather pay double for double the lifespan, if such a product exists.
i think most of us have been around long enough and spent enough to see thru a lot of this
eg. i bought a top of the line marantz made in japan amp that was amazingly well built
like copper sheet chassis, copper screws, they pulled out all the stops
thing broke down twice, local guys couldnt work on it so i had to get the stereotypical elderly asian e.eng who didnt speak much english to fix it... twice
but i'm broken enough in the head to still love marantz
i've also bought chinese class a/b gear that has been faultess... going onto year 5 now... in fact its older than my last kid
but i still wouldnt buy topping
i feel that some of the more not well known chinese companies do A/B quite well but some companies are still screwing up digital amps and dacs which kind of blows my mind
trad class a/b with EL or toroidals used the be the big relibailtiy worries but doesnt seem to be with these new companies screwing up digital stuff
Haha, see, your comment is exactly what I'm getting at. Lots of people feel the same way, "Oh, Chi-Fi isn't as bad as people make it out to be, oh you don't have to worry that much.............. but still,
don't buy Topping."
There's always that "but still" with topping. I'm wondering where that's coming from, and if it's statistically valid, or if it's just a remnant of bad quality-control on some of their older lines that has forever tainted public perception.
It's funny that you say toroidals used to be a reliability concern. Nowadays, I only see toroidals on amps that are supposedly
better-built than the rest.
Of the various brands I listed: Topping, Singxer, SMSL, RME, Schiit, which do you think I should avoid, and which do you think would be more than fine, with a 10+ year lifespan?
Conspiracy theory #3278: in 13 years, Schiit buys Topping, SMSL, Singxer, etc.
Conspiracy theory #5723: in 14 years, China invades and annexes “the West”.
So, the answer to your question is an absolute ‘yes’…???
Reliability/durability is mostly defined as a function of usage (hours), number of cycles, and things like power spikes, ambient temperature—none of these you define—not ‘years’. What if you leave it in its box unused for 14 years?
I apologize if it sounds aggressive but, are you really expecting an objective answer here?
You forgot Conspiracy theory #4779, in 13.5 years, Schiit, JDS, RME, and all other audio firms are purchased by Apple, and are forced to only sell Apple Dongles.
And of course what you say is true, but in the same way that there are many confounding variables, there are many potential datapoints out there in the world -- many users of these products. The sheer number of them helps to offset the number of factors. "It all evens out in the wash", as they say.
Sure, one user might use their stuff for 8 hours a day while another uses it for only one hour, but multiplied across 10,000 users, you get a pretty decent average, and can start to form fairly reliable conclusions,
if there are in fact any major differences in reliability between the brands.
51 years with Mcintosh now. I did manage to blow up an MC275 with a direct cable drop onto an NC500oem MB by Nord. The Nord was fine the Mac blew
a KT88 GL, and a transformer. I have well over 50 pieces of Mac Gear and owned over 125 through the years. I play with other brands but Krell and Mac in
my home have 30+ year old DACs. Actually one of my favorite preamps is an old HT51 Krell. The remote was CnCed from a solid aluminum billet that still
works perfect. It's hands down the best remote I've EVER used. It makes all thing Mac/remote seem cheep.
The issue I have was somewhat mitigated by the "SUB" on the remote it had a volume control in 2 channel LS mode. No tone controls BUT a wonderfully
transparent product considering. How old is that Krell DAC? Mac is the same as far as being transparent, just leave the tone controls alone. The newer Mac
doesn't have the old Mac house flavor like say a C3X. From a C2200-2700 transparent as can be. All the SS from C45 up are the same until you hit the
50 series and of course they are transparent.
C100-1100. MX120-170 VERY transparent. Their DACs are as good as any out there, you will never be able to tell the difference in a AB or ABX, BUT 50 years
from now there is a good chance they will be working. I might have a doubt or two on the MX series (AVP) complex piles for sure.
The question is 15 years good enough and who gets your stuff when you kick the bucket? Do you want to leave something you have to throw away
or sell for a nice chunk of change to someone if they don't like your gear?
I KNOW the reputation and the track record of Mcintosh valve and SS personally. Cary valve gear isn't any slouch either. I wouldn't trade my SLP-05/V12Rs
for anything. They been boiling along for 15+ years.
Oh, I'm listening to an MX110z and a MC225 right now. The MC225 lost ONE 12AX7 Tellie 8 -10 years ago. Neither have ever been touched except with
wax and oil. Pins and pockets are serviced every 5 years or so. 60 years old! Toot Toot! I know I can, I know I can.. lol
Happy hunting
Regards
Yeah, see, I know that at the end of the day, brands like McIntosh and Valve are pretty much
the answer to my question -- they are the industry standards, the professional solution. Unfortunately, they are MILES outside of my budget, and will forever be, even when looking at the used market.
See how it goes...for most of us, these kind of items are not a fortune. You pays your money and you takes your chances.
If it worries you...spend more and buy items you can send into a designated service center for repairs.
I'm now at the point where a lot of my equipment will outlast me, so my worries of this nature have, uh, diminished...
Yeah, for me, these items are definitely expensive. Definitely something I don't want to be buying more than once, but at the same time, something I'm happy to spend the money on
if I'm getting something that will last a reasonable lifespan.
Your point on service centers is important, though, and that's why I'm leaning towards Schiit, as they're the only brand in my price range that I know of that is US based, and which I could ostensibly ship my products to for repair (I'm in Canada). However, I don't know where Schiit falls in terms of reliability and build quality in the first place.
Yes everything is in some way made in china anyway .
Even if it says made in us or germany on the tin . Boards may be done in Chinese factories or if not that components may very well be.
So a good brand has built up a service organisation and local reps you can contact when it breaks ( not if ) some of the new Chinese brands has not reached that stage in maturity yet , so your asked to ship it back to china…
If in Europe you can buy from a local reseller like audiophonics so that they can be the middleman if warranty problems arise ?
Another good point, like Joe Smith's comment.
I live in Canada, and shipping to China is very expensive. Like, to the point where it's about half the cost of the amp itself.
Per my reply to Joe Smith, above, this is why I'm leaning towards Schiit, as they are US based, and I could ostensibly ship my stuff to them for repair if needed. However, I don't know where Schiit falls in terms of reliability and build quality in the first place. There's also the issue that schiit's products are often described as much warmer, much less detailed, and with a much smaller soundspace than some of the Chi-Fi products, but I don't know if I'll hear those differences...
The way I see it it's not where it's made but under what standards.
I have seen VERY high quality PCBs from eastern countries but there was something like 5 times the price of normal ones.
It's what each company asks for really.
Western certifications is a nice hint though,specially when it comes to safety.
Yet another good point, thank you. I'm not familiar with any of the certifications in the audio electronics space, though. Do you, by chance, know of whether any of the brands I've listed are particularly well-known for adhering to strict certifications? Schiit, Topping, Singxer, SMSL, RME, etc.?
I think that the presumed lifespan of the owner has to enter this equation. It seems presumptuous to think that one will be alive in 20 years. As objectivists, a check of the actuarial tables of how long we statistically have left, against the price difference between the pieces of gear being considered, seems prudent. We can do the math and come up with a few enlightening cost vs benefit data points. Otherwise... who cares if we've saved $500 if we're dead and our gear lives on?
Can I obtain a better return-on-investment if I just kill myself before my electronics die?
But no, for real, I'm only 29, and I take good care of all the electronics and tools in my life, and have many that are 15+ years old and still in regular use. I've also seen the absolutely ridiculous decline in quality in all aspects of consumer goods, as I have several pieces of antique woodworking equipment that I have restored, because they VASTLY exceed the quality of anything manufactured today for less than $20,000. This has coloured my outlook on all things, and I am very staunchly against fast-fashion-electronics, and the disposability-mindset we manufacture under these days. There is absolutely no justification for why a solid-state electronic shouldn't last as long as its electrolytic capacitors do. Any lifespan shorter than that
IS an engineering and manufacturing failure, without question.