Rega Aethos - some basic measurements here... and help

[Jake Cushing]

Hi all, I'm a complete n00b, with no electronics knowledge. However I couldn't be more impressed with this site, what a blessed relief from all the absurd posturing of hi-fi 'review' sites out there...

I'm considering a Rega Aethos integrated amp, to replace a Denon AVR x3700H (which can then go to a different room). It would be driving a pair of Studio Electric FSX floor-standers (rated 4 ohms). Here is the only measured performance I can find of the Aethos:

It's from HiFi World. I'm wondering what you might make of these measurements, and how it might stack up against the Denon 3700H. Would it be likely to make any difference in sound quality at loud levels, over the Denon? The speakers are in a large space (6x10m) and are for movies and also hi-fi audio listening.

Here is Amir's review of the Denon:

Denon AVR-X3700H AVR Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of Denon AVR-X3700H 9.2 channel 8K Home Theater AV Receiver (AVR). It is kindly loaned to me by a local member and costs US $1,199. Visually, if you have seen one AVR, you have seen the look of the AVR-X3700H: The input selector is plastic and...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Thanks and my apologies if this is not an appropriate thread. I am guessing it would be a nice introduction to equipment estimation in the absence of a full ASR review.

 

[pozz]

Assuming the measurements are accurate, the Rega has a little more output.

No reason to replace the Denon. You could consiser getting a dedicated separate power amp with double or triple the power and connect to the Denon preouts if you're looking for more oomph.

Or get a sub or two. Most of the power is going towards bass anyway.

 

[Jake Cushing]

Assuming the measurements are accurate, the Rega has a little more output.

No reason to replace the Denon. You could consiser getting a dedicated separate power amp with double or triple the power and connect to the Denon preouts if you're looking for more oomph.

Or get a sub or two. Most of the power is going towards bass anyway.

Thanks so much.

Any sense of whether a big room (10m x 6m) with these floorstanders (sensitivity 91db):

Studio Electric FSX

- would see a shortfall in power from the Rega? Is clipping the main fear, or is THD+N (is that the same is SINAD?) the likely issue? I'm thinking about peaks in science fiction films, or music. I like the sound during film playback to be pretty darn loud.

 

[Jake Cushing]

Oh, the reason for the interest in the Rega is that it would allow me to use the Denon in a different, smaller space (bedroom). And the Rega is made in the UK which is a nice thing to support I think.

It's that vexed question about to what extent power output and amp distortion is noticeable...

 

[pozz]

Thanks so much.

Any sense of whether a big room (10m x 6m) with these floorstanders (sensitivity 91db):

Studio Electric FSX

- would see a shortfall in power from the Rega? Is clipping the main fear, or is THD+N (is that the same is SINAD?) the likely issue? I'm thinking about peaks in science fiction films, or music. I like the sound during film playback to be pretty darn loud.

So a good rule to keep in mind is that, if all else is the same, when doubling the amp power, you will get 3dB more output. The Rega provides 80W or so more over the Denon's 160W at 4 ohms, or about 1.8dB gain. Really nothing to get excited about.

THD+N is the same as SINAD. The main thing to consider is clipping from the power amp. Do you find your system loud enough right now?

You can use this calculator to help you figure out requirements: https://geoffthegreygeek.com/calculator-amp-speaker-spl/ Just note that the final power requirement is going to be less than the calculator suggests since it does not include reinforcement by reverb, which decreases the amount of SPL lost over distance. And also add 3dB to the final SPL because you're playing two speakers. There are other considerations which will increase or decrease these numbers, but I think that's a reasonable approach.

I also think it would also be pretty reasonable to expect a good speaker amp to have 80dB SINAD before clipping. You can look up measurements here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?pages/Audio_Equipment_Reviews/ For example, here's a filtered list of integrated amps I posted recently in another thread:

The metric on the far right is max power before clipping at 4 ohms, and gives the corresponding SINAD. If you look up dedicated power amps they will have more output.

 

[JeffS7444]

It's from HiFi World. I'm wondering what you might make of these measurements, and how it might stack up against the Denon 3700H. Would it be likely to make any difference in sound quality at loud levels, over the Denon? The speakers are in a large space (6x10m) and are for movies and also hi-fi audio listening.

That Rega sells for 4800 USD. The information you've posted suggests that it'll sound like pretty much like any other reasonably well-designed amplifier, but ouch, it seems like a mediocre performer given it's price.

 

[Jake Cushing]

Amazing - @pozz You sir are a gentleman and a scholar!

 

[Jake Cushing]

That Rega sells for 4800 USD. The information you've posted suggests that it'll sound like pretty much like any other reasonably well-designed amplifier, but ouch, it seems like a mediocre performer given it's price.

Thanks - curious as to where you see its mediocrity as an integrated - power output, or distortion+noise?

Here is the full review from Hifi World. A lot of it is subjective dross, but there are bits of other information:

https://www.rega.co.uk/pdf/Rega_Aethos_HFW_Nov20.pdf

 

[Jake Cushing]

Oh, keep in mind that the Rega is made in the UK.
Picking one example, the NAD M33 whilst a lot more powerful, is made in China.

The premium price at least does mean I can support UK manufacturing and sleep a bit easier on that... ?

 

[MaxBuck]

If you have the wherewithal to spend 5 times as much as necessary in order to buy a mediocre product that is "made in the UK," this seems a rational place to put your money. Otherwise not so much.

 

[Jake Cushing]

Well that's awesome @MaxBuck

But even more awesome would be something like "The Rega might be assembled in the UK, but all the parts are from China. I base this on this information or source here..."

Or

"Here is why it looks 'mediocre' based on the info you've supplied, or some other knowledge I have".

 

[JeffS7444]

Thanks - curious as to where you see its mediocrity as an integrated - power output, or distortion+noise?

Yes to all of the above, compare to @JohnYang1997's latest creation which has got a lot of people very excited:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/topping-pa5-review-amplifier.28512/
It's a very basic thing with just two analog inputs and no remote control, but the measured performance looks remarkable. While it's not made in the UK, you'd have lots of money left over to purchase things which are, such as a whole lot of Marmite.

 

[Koeitje]

Well that's awesome @MaxBuck

But even more awesome would be something like "The Rega might be assembled in the UK, but all the parts are from China. I base this on this information or source here..."

Or

"Here is why it looks 'mediocre' based on the info you've supplied, or some other knowledge I have".

I can guarantee you that most of the parts in the Rega are not from the UK.

 

[DSJR]

OK. By the standards of this place I'm a Rega fanboy BUT.......

No offence to HiFi World or owner/editor/tester Noel Keyward, their idea of a top performer is, by ASR standards, a rather mediocre one, so please allow that aspect when reading replies here and reviews there!

I've used an Aethos and again, in the market it's sold into, it IS a good amp, with good build and in the UK, fantastic service should it be needed (I think it's £2999 here retail). For what it is (a dealer bought well made amp), it's very good indeed and obviously more profitable than a Brio R (we'll draw a hopefully kindly veil over the Io, shall we?). It's a solid, neat looking amp which doesn't look like 'Mission Control' as vintage gear used to do.

BUT pt 2...

The advent of some stonkingly good and totally transparent bang up to date amps coming onto the scene in recent times (mostly not via a conventional dealer chain though) means that increasingly, traditional 'HiFi stores' and especially high end 'Salons,' are beginning to look decidedly behind the times and increasingly off the pace of what's currently achievable. The more 'subjective' these places are, the worse they appear to be as regards ignoring objective evidence in my current opinion. Sure, some of these places are now looking to streaming options - always expensive ones I believe - but the subjective evermore expensive upgrade ladder is always first and foremost I think.

You need to look at exactly what you want the amp to do. Do you need plenty of analogue inputs? Power is always important and 100WPC could nowadays be a reasonable minimum today I feel with 50WPC reserved for desktop or very small room systems. If you only have a digital source, a suitable high quality dac (RME?) into a powerful Class D amp able to drive 4 ohms without blinking may well be the best way to go (they run cool too generally, so component life shouldn't be an issue here hopefully).

P.S. Back when I was selling this stuff, the hierarchy I now realise was as much visual as it was technical or 'sound quality' driven. A NAD amp (C320 and upwards) could do the job brilliantly but the drab appearance could dampen enthusiasm, despite these amps being superb 'tools' to do the job. I'd suggest Rotel's better efforts were much the same (probably why they once did the 'Michi' system to offer a posher look at a premium). Arcam did the same back then, the original FMJ models a solidly built and finished update on the plastic tinny feeling top Alpha models (it was a success so lower models got similar treatment).

I wish you luck here. I'm coming out of a subjective-only transition myself really (lasting decades rather than months) and still 'see the point' of amps like the Aethos and (yikes!!!) the Hegel which has been slaughtered in another thread. What you have is obviously doing the job at least to an acceptable standard, so take it easy, work out exactly what the replacement needs to do and PLEASE don't think (now you're here ) that more expensive means 'better' 'cos these days it obviously doesn't unless casework and styling is important

 

[Katji]

Oh, keep in mind that the Rega is made in the UK.
Picking one example, the NAD M33 whilst a lot more powerful, is made in China.

The premium price at least does mean I can support UK manufacturing and sleep a bit easier on that... ?

Investigate the after-sales service, what it involves to get repairs done.

 

[Doodski]

(they run cool too generally, so component life shouldn't be an issue here hopefully).

The class D amp square waveforms hammer the capacitors and that's rough on them.

 

[MaxBuck]

"Here is why it looks 'mediocre' based on the info you've supplied, or some other knowledge I have".

Noise is high, per specs. Distortion is high, per specs. Power is very modest given its purchase price.

Apologies; I thought this was self-evident from the spec sheet.

 

[Jake Cushing]

@DSJR What a glorious answer, has so much the ring of truth about it. Thank you, much for me to chew on now.
And thanks to all the others who have replied to this thread, much appreciated!

 

[Jake Cushing]

Yes to all of the above, compare to @JohnYang1997's latest creation which has got a lot of people very excited:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/topping-pa5-review-amplifier.28512/
It's a very basic thing with just two analog inputs and no remote control, but the measured performance looks remarkable. While it's not made in the UK, you'd have lots of money left over to purchase things which are, such as a whole lot of Marmite.

That does seem ridiculously good value. However - might you have an alternative suggestion to the Rega, that is not made in China, that is similar or more highly powered, and has lower SINAD etc by which the Rega would look mediocre in comparison?

 

[Jake Cushing]

You know, I'm going to go out on a limb here: I suspect the Rega measurements cited at the start of this thread, if true, would mean that no-one on this site would be able to tell the difference between the Rega and a Benchmark in a double-blind test.

This is not to say a Benchmark is not a superlative piece of engineering, nor is it not worth owning - it sure is, despite the above.

Happy to be wrong.

My point here is that a Benchmark AHB2 plus a Benchmark LA4 pre-amp will cost 50% more together, than the Rega. And would produce a similar useable power output (unless I'm mistaken)... I don't think the Benchmark is expensive at all, given it is clearly so much better than the Krells or what-not of this world. But is the Rega really that expensive?