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R2R vs Delta Sigma DACs - same results?
- Thread starter ohmywatt
- Start date
I wonder if it was even relevant then....
oleg87
Addicted to Fun and Learning
As a comparative overview of Burr-Brown's audio DAC lineup at the time, perhaps.I wonder if it was even relevant then....
Not a particularly good overview of the fundamentals.
Maybe
Jimster480
Major Contributor
Probably wasn't, although when I got into the audio world 10 years ago; there were lots of really bad DAC's that weren't at all transparent.I wonder if it was even relevant then....
Were there? Really good, affordable DACs arrived in the late 90s.
The only difference is the emotional state of brain connected to the ears involved.
Dacs were competent before that, tho
danadam
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Also keep in mind what's in the top right corner through the whole video:
Werbung = advertisement
Roland68
Major Contributor
As early as the beginning of the 1990s, Cambridge Audio released the DACMAGIC 1, a truly good and affordable DAC.
John Westlake's design left many dealers and reviewers struggling to explain its superiority over DACs that cost many times more.
This DAC is still one of the most frequently used components in my system.
Poorly performing DACs have always existed, regardless of price, as we've seen often enough on ASR.
But I remember that about 10 years ago (from 2013/14 onwards), the really good Geek Pulse DACs from LH Labs, with their XMOS USB and TPA6120a-based HPA, were very popular, for $399 if I remember correctly.
Disagree - it might be measurably dogwater trash - but for the vast majority of people it is dogwater trash that they can't come close to hearing (based on Klippel listening test results) - especially if it is distortion limited. Even if noise audible with sensitive speakers, it is going to be easily masked while music is playing.
OP
ohmywatt
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- Thread Starter
- #113
Maybe your turntable was set up poorly Keith
A rabbit hole we can step right over. I often compare a track streamed vs played from vinyl. I have a Benchmark LA4 preamp in my arsenal which makes it easy to level match and switch between DAC and phono-amp on the fly. I've come to the conclusion that there are to many variables, especially on the turntable. How good is the turntable and cartridge and is it set up for optimal VTA, stylus pressure etc. etc. etc? Having to get up and flip a vinyl record when I'm comfortable annoys me... but there are moments when nostalgia wins me over. I have thousands of CDs packed up in boxes. Care to recommend a CD player to a guy like me?
‘Poorly set-up’ yes that’s what it must have been, not the inherent flaws of the medium.
Keith
Keith
What do you mean? It's perfect and infinite resolution and therefore much better than digital. You're just unable to adjust your cartridge! Do it right, you get 20dB channel seperation, hooray! No puny DAC can beat that.
Sometimes I simply forget that it has infinite resolution, I do remember every yellow duster/ new cantilever incident.
Keith
Keith
Jimster480
Major Contributor
Depends on what you consider to be affordable. Most of the DAC's available had SINAD under 90 when I got started.
To me $399 is still quite an expensive price for a DAC only. XMOS AFAIK only really became a thing in like 2015/2016.
EliseX
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I am currently using a portable R2R CD player from DUNU, and when I compare it to my small desktop DAC, I notice slightly more mid-high frequencies on the portable unit. I suspect the difference might be due to the manufacturer's built-in EQ, or perhaps some brands intentionally introduce even-order harmonic distortion for tuning purposes.
Vintageadict
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Interesting that you bring this unit up since I have one that I borrowed from a friend. He has a myriad of fairly high end CD/SACD players and is convinced this sounds better than just about all but his most resolving SACD player. I tried it in my less than high end system vs a somewhat pedestrian Yamaha CD s-303 expecting no difference. Well, after toggling back and forth myself and then having my wife as a guinea pig we both agree it trumps my Yamaha fairly significantly. The Yamaha tests well here as a transport. The DAC is average at best. Is it the DAC in the SMSL PL200 that is making the difference? FYI, I used the same cables and volume matched the best I could with my preamp. Nothing scientific but the best I could do.Sorry to burst your bobble (i was in the same bobble until recently):
SMSL PL200 Review (CD Player)
At least as a CD player, the OPPO was reproducing the digital content of the CDA nearly unchanged, when measured from analog outputs, and that was a first in my tests. As of now, only the SMSL PL200 did as good. So yes, an ESS or AK seem to be required to get there. Of course remains all other...
Basically a CD player with a kick ass DAC. Why do we not measure better values? See the comments.
Roland68
Major Contributor
The CD-S303 is unfortunately a very basic player with a cheap DAC chip. In @NTTY's test, this player also didn't receive very good results regarding the DAC/analog output, but this shouldn't be clearly audible. However, there can be some variation, and of course, it also depends on the music and the sound system. As a simple transport, the S303 performed well.
Significantly better DACs are available for as little as €79, for example, the SMSL D1, SU-1, or the C100, which also comes with Bluetooth, a remote control, and a display.
Personally, I would get a well-reviewed CD player or upgrade it to a transport with an external DAC.
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