Quality Reputation: Topping vs. SMSL

[Henryk]

Hello!

I'm trying to make my mind up between two DAC's.
The new Topping DX5 II and the older SMSL DO400.

The Topping has the more powerful headphone output section and PEQ.
However, the SMSL has the 8-channel PRO chip - but at a 50% price premium.


So could someone who has experience with these units tell me:

Is the PRO chip in the SMSL worth the extra $? ...and...
Which of the two brands has a better reputation for quality?

 

[Berwhale]

Both units are way past the threshold of audibility where noise and distortion is concerned. The choice should come down to factors such as functionality, connectivity, reliability and aesthetics. Personally, I would rate the PEQ capability of the DX5 II over the supposedly better DAC IC in the SMSL.

I don't own any SMSL products (I have been close to purchasing some in the past), but I do own a Topping A50s/D50s/P50 stack, and EX5 and the DX5 II that arrived yesterday. I've had no issues with any of them (I appreciate that it's early days with the DX5 II!).

Gratuitous shot of my new DX5 II on my desk ...

 

[amper42]

I wouldn't recommend Topping gear to anyone. The company can't put out a decent remote after making 30+ different DAC models and if you ever have an issue with it no one in the USA fixes them. I had three Topping high end products. There was nothing extraordinary about them. My best day was when I sold them. Never again will I support that brand.

 

[Berwhale]

The company can't put out a decent remote after making 30+ different DAC models

The Topping RC-21 I purchased for £20 in 2020 begs to differ. I have never had any issues with it, although I admit it's been used at relatively close range for the last 5 years, rather than from a sofa across the room. Unfortunately the RC-21 is not compatible with my new DX5 II

 

[amper42]

The Topping RC-21 I purchased for £20 in 2020 begs to differ. I have never had any issues with it, although I admit it's been used at relatively close range for the last 5 years, rather than from a sofa across the room. Unfortunately the RC-21 is not compatible with my new DX5 II

View attachment 467941

I bought the $20 Topping RC-22 and it was joke. I was really hoping it was better. It didn't help with controlling the DAC from the sofa, weighed 4x more than the original as it was steel and you couldn't get into it to change the battery unless you had a tiny, tiny Torx wrench. It was the worst remote I ever owned. In fact, there are threads on ASR asking how to get into it to change the battery.

Nothing Topping makes is designed to last or be serviceable. It's all food for the landfill.

 

[Berwhale]

Hmmm, I had no issues changing the battery in the RC-21. You just remove 3 small allen bolts in the bottom to access the battery and i'm pretty sure the allen wrench was included with the remote. The RC-22 design is a little different because I think the battery is accessed via the top of the remote, so maybe that is more of a faff. Still, it's a bit of an over-generalization to claim that 'Nothing Topping makes is designed to last or be serviceable' based on your experience with their remote control.

FWIW, my RC-21 has been controlling both and Topping EX5 and my PC via a FLIRC IR receiver for almost 3 years...

'Controlling PEACE/eAPO on Windows with Topping DAC/Amp Remote (or any other IR remote)'

Aug 28, 2022

I have a Topping EX5 which I use as both a headphone amplifier for my Sennheiser HD660s and as a pre-amp for my iLoud MTM monitors.

I switch between the headphone and monitor outputs using the headphone and line out buttons on a Topping RC21 remote.

On my Windows 11 PC, I use eAPO with the PEACE front end to apply PEQ to both the headphones and monitors.

I have hotkeys assigned to the PEQ profiles in PEACE such that CTRL + ALT + 1 enables the HD660s profile and CTRL + ALT + 0 enable the MTM profile (I have other hot keys assigned to other profiles, but I use HD660s and MTM ones 95% of...

• Berwhale

• 

 

[Chr1]

Got three Topping DACs (D50, DX3 PRO, E50), and all have worked flawlessly. I can't fault them.

What's put me off SMSL DACs in the past, is their default display being sample rate, rather than volume. A deal breaker for me unfortunately. This may have changed however.

Having said that, I doubt I would buy an amplifier by either company personally, as I don't particularly like their thermal management design implementation. (Or lack of.)
My 2c.

 

[Bleib]

I wouldn't recommend Topping gear to anyone. The company can't put out a decent remote after making 30+ different DAC models and if you ever have an issue with it no one in the USA fixes them. I had three Topping high end products. There was nothing extraordinary about them. My best day was when I sold them. Never again will I support that brand.

re: remotes.. TP RA3 och DX5 II are both fine. I don't even have to point at the DAC with remote to make it react

 

[Yersinia Bestmate]

I've had several Topping products. D50 III, E30II and E30II Lite, L70 and A70 Pro. The latest is Dx5 II which I'm using as a dac/amp/preamp with my laptop, and I still have the A70 Pro as a preamp with E50 III in my no. 1 setup. I've been very pleased with the quality of Topping products - no faults so far whatsoever which has been a bit of a surprise considering they do have issues especially with software and have had major f****ups, like the case of L30 for example.

What comes to SMSL, I've had the DL200 (and still have it) and SU-1 dac. Zero problems. I've become very fond of the DL200, it is _very_ good for the price. Perhaps one of the best hifi purchases I've made.

I've stayed far away from Topping and SMSL amps due to the bad reputation and, quite frankly in case of SMSL I have no interest in Infineon chip amps which they use. I think the biggest problem with these companies is the constant stream of devices, QC issues and putting out products that have not been tested thoroughly. So I'd say the reputation is mixed all in all.

Edit: to add - If I were you, I'd definitely take the Topping Dx5 II instead of SMSL DO400.

 

[Henryk]

I've had several Topping products. D50 III, E30II and E30II Lite, L70 and A70 Pro. The latest is Dx5 II which I'm using as a dac/amp/preamp with my laptop, and I still have the A70 Pro as a preamp with E50 III in my no. 1 setup. I've been very pleased with the quality of Topping products - no faults so far whatsoever which has been a bit of a surprise considering they do have issues especially with software and have had major f****ups, like the case of L30 for example.

What comes to SMSL, I've had the DL200 (and still have it) and SU-1 dac. Zero problems. I've become very fond of the DL200, it is _very_ good for the price. Perhaps one of the best hifi purchases I've made.

I've stayed far away from Topping and SMSL amps due to the bad reputation and, quite frankly in case of SMSL I have no interest in Infineon chip amps which they use. I think the biggest problem with these companies is the constant stream of devices, QC issues and putting out products that have not been tested thoroughly. So I'd say the reputation is mixed all in all.

Edit: to add - If I were you, I'd definitely take the Topping Dx5 II instead of SMSL DO400.

Thank you very much for your input!
Any reason(s) specifically why you'd choose the DX5 II over the DO400?

 

[Henryk]

Got three Topping DACs (D50, DX3 PRO, E50), and all have worked flawlessly. I can't fault them.

What's put me off SMSL DACs in the past, is their default display being sample rate, rather than volume. A deal breaker for me unfortunately. This may have changed however.

Having said that, I doubt I would buy an amplifier by either company personally, as I don't particularly like their thermal management design implementation. (Or lack of.)
My 2c.

Thanks for that!
You're right - little things like that (default sample rate display) - can be incredibly annoying.

 

[Henryk]

Both units are way past the threshold of audibility where noise and distortion is concerned. The choice should come down to factors such as functionality, connectivity, reliability and aesthetics. Personally, I would rate the PEQ capability of the DX5 II over the supposedly better DAC IC in the SMSL.

I don't own any SMSL products (I have been close to purchasing some in the past), but I do own a Topping A50s/D50s/P50 stack, and EX5 and the DX5 II that arrived yesterday. I've had no issues with any of them (I appreciate that it's early days with the DX5 II!).

Gratuitous shot of my new DX5 II on my desk ...

View attachment 467937

From what I understand, the PEQ function only works with USB input though.
So if you're already using a computer as your source, what's the point of PEQ on the DAC?
Is it better to make EQ changes on the DAC instead of the PC source?

 

[Henryk]

I wouldn't recommend Topping gear to anyone. The company can't put out a decent remote after making 30+ different DAC models and if you ever have an issue with it no one in the USA fixes them. I had three Topping high end products. There was nothing extraordinary about them. My best day was when I sold them. Never again will I support that brand.

Any brands that you'd recommend me to check out?
I know RME is good, but the price is out of my budget unfortunately.

 

[Berwhale]

From what I understand, the PEQ function only works with USB input though.
So if you're already using a computer as your source, what's the point of PEQ on the DAC?
Is it better to make EQ changes on the DAC instead of the PC source?

No, on the DX5 II PEQ can be applied to all inputs and can even be switched automatically based on the input or output selected (so I can automatically switch between the filters for my monitors and headphones). However, there some software issues with the DX5 II which prevent me from recommending it at this time. I think these issues are likely to be fixed with firmware updates, but I wouldn't buy one before all the wrinkles have been ironed out.

 

[Roland68]

Thank you very much for your input!
Any reason(s) specifically why you'd choose the DX5 II over the DO400?

I'll be replacing my DO400 with the DX5 II in the next few weeks, primarily because of the slightly better and significantly more powerful HPA.
I had the DX5 II here for a few days and didn't notice any problems other than the PEQ function, which wasn't working properly at the time.

The DAC chip isn't really important here, as can be seen from various test reports on ASR.
The DO400 is identical to the Loxjie D40 Pro tested on ASR, and the DX5 II test was in the same range as the D50 III. The difference in SINAD in the range of 0.7 is of no interest to me personally.

SMSL often only implements the chip manufacturer's circuitry in DACs, with significant optimization of the measured values. As far as I know, the problem with the incorrectly labeled filters on the DO400 and other devices is still not resolved, which is absolutely ridiculous and an embarrassment for SMSL.
Topping has demonstrated a high level of in-house development for years, and in the last two years, they seem to have put more effort into customer satisfaction. While it's still far from perfect, it's at least an improvement.
Firmware handling also seems to have improved significantly.
In my opinion, the DX5 II is currently unbeatable in terms of price/performance. They're also working hard to fix all firmware issues.
PEQ is supported on all inputs, by the way.

 

[Roland68]

No, on the DX5 II PEQ can be applied to all inputs and can even be switched automatically based on the input or output selected (so I can automatically switch between the filters for my monitors and headphones). However, there some software issues with the DX5 II which prevent me from recommending it at this time. I think these issues are likely to be fixed with firmware updates, but I wouldn't buy one before all the wrinkles have been ironed out.

However, these issues relate exclusively to PEQ and have nothing to do with the device's other functions.
Since almost all other devices in this price range don't have PEQ, this doesn't pose any disadvantages.

 

[Berwhale]

However, these issues relate exclusively to PEQ and have nothing to do with the device's other functions.
Since almost all other devices in this price range don't have PEQ, this doesn't pose any disadvantages.

It is causing me some pain. With my EX5 I had automation setup to switch PEQ in Windows (EAPO/PEACE) with the output selection buttons on the Topping remote. This method worked perfectly for several years, but it will not work with the DX5 II because there are no dedicated output buttons on the remote. So I am stuck waiting for Topping to fix the issues with the DX5 II (Mine loses the stored PEQ settings and I have to push them from Topping.Tune again).

 

[Yersinia Bestmate]

Thank you very much for your input!
Any reason(s) specifically why you'd choose the DX5 II over the DO400?

Versatility, built in parametric equalisation for all inputs. And in my opinion the Dx5II looks better also.

 

[EJ3]

I bought the $20 Topping RC-22 and it was joke. I was really hoping it was better. It didn't help with controlling the DAC from the sofa, weighed 4x more than the original as it was steel and you couldn't get into it to change the battery unless you had a tiny, tiny Torx wrench. It was the worst remote I ever owned. In fact, there are threads on ASR asking how to get into it to change the battery.

Nothing Topping makes is designed to last or be serviceable. It's all food for the landfill.

I can't think of anything that I would expect quality for (except food & drink) if I only paid $20 for it ($30 or more, it would depend, but $20, not expecting quality for that amount).
I have, on occasion, been pleasantly surprised by something that in-expensive exceeding my expectations.

 

[mk05]

Hello!

I'm trying to make my mind up between two DAC's.
The new Topping DX5 II and the older SMSL DO400.

A long time ago, gosh like only 4 years but still, there were some differences in chips, some popping issues, etc. Nowadays, DACs are pretty much at peak tech and all the same. Go for features! I waited for the DX5ii's PEQ, and glad I did.