Quality of Raspberry Pi4 USB For Streaming

[JakeK]

Note that I used an independent power supply to drive the Topping E30 II. The RPi/Rooextender was powered using a random 1 amp USB-C adapter I had sitting around (I was also able to power it from my computer's USB hub).

Is it possible to power the RPi from the DAC via the same USB connection as the signal? In my imagination this would make no difference to the sound and be a much neater installation. Not as simple as using a DAC HAT on the RPi and I'm sure a good DAC HAT should sound exactly the same as a good DAC but there can be other reasons to use an external DAC.

And the attractive hardware that his partner is producing. Put a smile on my face as soon as I saw it, and experienced its performance.

Apart from nice looks what I want from my streamer is a touch screen for that sort of money. Without a screen I'm going to hide it away which is what I do with my existing pi based streamers and this makes the looks irrelevant. TBH for £300 I want a decent built in DAC as well as a screen!

Nice test though to prove you don't need to spend 1000s to get perfect sound from a streamer.

 

[DrCWO]

Here I am to hopefully clean up the mess

rooExtend (not RoonExtend) is primary a SD-Card image for the Raspberry Pi. At the beginning I made it for DIY users to build a Raspberry Pi solution that offers a lot of Roon Extensions (see http://diy.rooextend.com). For each of those Roon Extensions the user can buy License key to make them run. rooExtend also offers the chance to use the Raspberry Pi as a USB streamer. Using the Roon Bridge with rooExtend is for free.

In the photo @amirm posted the Raspberry is in a FLIC case with a customized metal lid I also sell. This is the left device in the Foto. The right device is the so called "rooExtend-Box". It also has a ARMv8 CPU but has a hardware different from the Pi. I made this for users not willing to DIY. It is a Plug & Play solution for audiophiles and is sold my my sales partner ART Audio Trade (https://rooextend.com). The image shipped with the rooExtend-Box offers a 60 days trial license for all of my Roon Extensions. After 60days the customer can decide which (or nons) of my Roon Extensions he likes to use and buy a License Key for it.

As far as I can see @amirm did his measurements with the Raspberry Pi in the FLIRC case.

Hope this helps.
Best DrCWO

 

[DrCWO]

It would be interesting to see a measurement when an USB isolator is used in the USB case. So the cases would be:

- RoonExtend (misspelled in many places in the article) on Pi4-> E30 II
- Pi4 USB -> E30 II
- Pi4 USB -> USB isolator -> E30 II

Is the RoonExtend on Pi4 cleaner than a Pi4 using a USB isolator?

//

The USB isolator only helps if you streamer runs with a grounded power supply. If you use a Raspberry Pi power supply without ground an isolator has no effect at all.

 

[DrCWO]

I have two Pis with ROPIEE, which is more than a Roon Bridge (SharePlay, LMS). The whole thing costs less than half of this.

Sure, but rooExtend offers all my Roon Extensions. If you don't use them you also can go the ROPIEE way.

 

[DrCWO]

Apart from nice looks what I want from my streamer is a touch screen for that sort of money.

I currently work on that
Hopefully I can show a first prototype at the HighEnd Show in Munich mid of May

 

[Billy Budapest]

Sure, but rooExtend offers all my Roon Extensions. If you don't use them you also can go the ROPIEE way.

What are your Roon Extensions? Can you post a link to a description of them? Thanks!

 

[DrCWO]

What are your Roon Extensions? Can you post a link to a description of them? Thanks!

I already did in my post above but here again:

http://diy.rooExtend.com

Best DrCWO

 

[Martin]

I've used Raspberry Pis to stream local content via WiFi from my NAS server for years, first using Volumio and now piCorePlayer. Fantastically configurable and reliable streamer. I love it.

Martin

 

[mash]

As DrCWO mentioned.....the reason you look at his software is not for the singular Roon endpoint function (Ropieee is a better option) but for the various extensions he offers. I have used RooPlay (a RooExtend extension) for several years now and absolutely love it. RooPlay gives me the ability to use my turntable as a whole house Roon streaming source with fairly high audio quality (i.e., optical feed out of my puffin Phono pre into an optical/USB converter into a Pi running RooExtend/RooPlay). Next up will be leveraging RooSpot (new feature coming soon) which should allow me to stream Spotify directly into Roon as a source. In addition to these functions, there are several other extensions that he offers that provide various Roon capabilities. As mentioned, his RooExtend home page talks about several of these extensions...https://rooextend.com/index_en.html

For the record, I've always used his software with my own home build Pi4 boxes. Great that he offers fully loaded/configured hardware but taking a DIY approach saves money. I have a fair amount of experience building/configuring Pis (including Moode, Volumio, and RoPieee). Each OS offers something differant. The trick is matching what you are trying to accomplish with the correct OS.

 

[SlowLife]

It looks like NanoPi R2S.

 

[obsessive9119]

This seems quite cool, but in terms of value... surely a WiiM mini has it beat hands down? It's in the same ballpark as a rpi and doesn't require a roon subscription or licensing fees.

 

[BrooklynNick]

Seems like a nice solution, but worth noting that FiiO SR11 is $105 and will sound identical.

Edit: Note that the price in the US will likely double when they run out of inventory already in the US.

 

[Ajax]

FWIW I use a 12 year old Sonos Connect (May 2013) as a streamer, which is hard wired with ethernet input and optical out to either a Benchmark DAC2 or an SMSL S8 DAC. I bought 3 of them for US$50 each from a hifi store "dumping" old trade ins. They all work flawlessly using the free Sonos S1 App, which Amir was critical of but I like.

Review and Measurements of SONOS Connect Streamer

This is a review and detailed measurements of the SONOS Connect Audio/Multi-room streamer. It is on kind loan from a member and costs $349 on Amazon including Prime shipping. The Connect has the look of earlier SONOS products which is attractive: Functionality takes a backseat to looks...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Chris Connaker from Audiostyle found that if you leave the volume "fixed" the original Sonos connect is bit perfect up to 16/44.1, which is fine for me as I use Tidal connect as my primary source and I don't require hi res. Without creating a storm there is plenty of evidence to suggest that hi-res offers no real benefit for playback if your material is correctly recorded and mastered at 24/96 and then dithered with noise shaping to 16/44.1, especially on old ears like mine. However, it is important to note the new Sonos Port is not bit perfect.

The Sonos Port Isn't Bit Perfect

As the title says, the Sonos Port isn't bit perfect. What's the big deal? For many Sonos users this is a non-issue because they are streaming from very lossy services such as Apple Music or Pandora. However, for people who care about sound quality, this is a big deal because the music sent though...

audiophilestyle.com

I now have a front end that is SOTA for under US$300, to which I connect a Buckeye NC252 power amp and a pair of B&W AM 01 speakers with a 2nd hand Velodyne sub. Total system cost is about US$1500 and IMO the sound is superb, especially when you take into account the added convencience of the Sonos ecosystem.

All this was put together from what I have leant from this site - thank you Amir.

 

[JeremyFife]

Thanks for an interesting, if slightly confusing (perhaps it's just me!) review

I *think* the review shows that any Raspberry Pi4 is (or can be if the software isn't messed up) a high quality, inexpensive streaming transport. (Edit: specifically over USB, which is handy). That's great to know.

I also think that the Pi4 you chose to test came in that nice box, but that's irrelevant to the review. In addition, there are third party options for Pi4 (like the RooExtend) that may also be interesting - but are not relevant to the review, and come at a cost. All that will be worth it to some people.

I'm happy with my WiiM Mini, but I appreciate that Pi devices open up a whole DIY/tinkering world that some people really like. It's good to know that there is no sound quality penalty.

Let me know if I've misunderstood (gently!)

 

[kyllwtr]

I'm using Rpi 3+ with Volumio (my primary system with a TOPPING D70) and Moode (my office system with a TOPPING E30II) achieving high quality streaming from a NAS storage (standard 24 bit/96kHz FLAC, but also DSD).
RPi 3+ had a reported issue due sharing ETHERNET interrupt with USB. I don't know how this actually impact reproduction since I overcomed the problem using Wi-Fi connection (not far from the Wi-Fi router or reapeater).
Moode and Volumio are free (if I well remember Volumio has also payed options).
Moode comes with prametric equalizer.

 

[JDS]

Excellent performance but maybe you would want to include its price of 400€ on the review as its quite higher than of a normal Pi, guess a big part due to the Roon licence?

rooExtend® EXTENSION BOX FÜR ROON

Extend roon with things you love. rooExtend erweitert den Musikserver Roon in den Bereichen Zuspielung, Steuerung und Wiedergabe um vielerlei Funktionen.

shop.rooextend.com

Indeed. I am running RoPieee Roon endpoint software (free) on a generic RaspberryPi 4 sitting in a cheap plastic enclosure. Total cost (less generic USB power supply): less than $50 today.

 

[Barrelhouse Solly]

I've been using Raspberry Pis for about 10 years for audio. My subjective opinion is it's all the audio source I need for audio files and streaming sources. My favorite software is Moode Audio. Aside from offering geeky features that I like, it's free and open source. Development is ongoing. The support forum is active and the chief developer participates daily. Volumio is a bit easier to configure. The free version is capable but it's really a freemium model. Chances are you'll need one or more paid features. I also use LMS with PiCore Player. It's more hands on but has a browser client that can do most everything you need. I used to use DAC HATs but since the Pi 4 separated USB from ethernet I've used USB to a DAC. Standalone DACs are more expensive than many HATs but offer multiple inputs. You can also use a USB switch (not a hub) to connect multiple Pis to a single DAC. A mind bogglingly cheap Pi solution is a 41331 based dongle connected to the USB port. I'm glad to see that measurements confirm what my elderly ears have concluded. If you prefer an appliance WIIM solutions start at less than $100 and are pretty darned good through the optical out.

 

[Apesbrain]

If you prefer an appliance WIIM solutions start at less than $100 and are pretty darned good through the optical out.

If you want native LMS/Roon support, you need at least the WiiM Pro at $149. The less costly WiiM Mini is limited to DLNA.

 

[Barrelhouse Solly]

If you want native LMS/Roon support, you need at least the WiiM Pro at $149. The less costly WiiM Mini is limited to DLNA.

The mini also supports various on line streaming sources and has a parametric equalizer.

 

[ale76]

This seems quite cool, but in terms of value... surely a WiiM mini has it beat hands down? It's in the same ballpark as a rpi and doesn't require a roon subscription or licensing fees.

I think this review focus on USB connection to external DAC, something you don't get with the basic Wiim models until the Ultra.
Personally I will stick to Roopiee which is free of charge and work flawlessly on my RPIs , don't see the need to spend 400 bucks to get the same level of performance.