Purchase advice for System Audio Pandion 2. Considering Hegel H80, but maybe its a bad idea?

[Gabr0718]

Hi everyone,

I’m quite new to Hi-Fi and could really use some help choosing my first “proper” amplifier. So I’m reaching out to you knowledgeable folks and hoping you can guide me!

I recently bought a pair of used System Audio (Pandion 2) speakers, and I’m now looking for a used or new amplifier to pair with them. My budget is around 6,500 DKK max (1k USD). I know that’s not huge (I’m a student at the moment), but I’m trying to get the best possible sound within those limits so I can still get the most out of the speakers. I have been considering something like the Hegel H80 + a cheap streamer, and maybe adding a streamer later on with a better DAC, when the budget allows it. Is that a good idea?

For reference, I grew up listening to my dad’s setup (System Audio SA2K with a Cyrus 8 and external PSX-R power supply), and I’ve always really liked that sound—warm, open, and very musical.

Right now I live in a small student apartment (single bedroom 37 m^2. (About 5x7.5x2.5)), so I’m also wondering whether room correction is something worth considering, or if it’s overkill at this stage. I am open to expanding the system later, so it doesn’t necessarily have to be an all-in-one solution from the start.

The most important things for me are:

A warm and open sound

Non-harsh treble

Ability to stream music (either built-in or via an external solution)

Possible connection to a TV. I don't know if i should by a DAC + a streamer?

It doesn’t have to be a single-box solution. I’m totally fine with a more modular setup if it offers better sound or flexibility within the budget. I’d love to hear your thoughts on that.

Hope some of you have good suggestions for amplifiers or setups that would make sense here. Used gear and new gear are both welcome as long.

Looking forward to your replies!

Kindest Regards

Gabriel

 

[staticV3]

Hi @Gabr0718! Welcome to ASR.

In your case, I'd strongly consider a WiiM Amp Pro or Amp Ultra.

It has fully transparent output, meaning that you will hear only your tracks, speakers, and listening environment.

No contribution/coloration/sound signature is added by the WiiM's streamer, DAC, or Amp.

In addition, the WiiM has built-in room correction, TV support via HDMI ARC, and subwoofer integration if you want to add one later on.

Using room correction is strongly recommended, no matter what speakers or Amp you use and no matter what your listening environments is like.

 

[Gabr0718]

Thanks for you reply @staticV3 , and excited to be a part of ASR. I have been looking into that option as well. What makes me a little nervous about it were some reviews talking about how the sound tends to sound a little “boring” and that it struggles with dynamic nuance. I’m worried about the fact that I’ve read that analogue amps do a better job at making the music more exciting through a tighter grip on the bass and so on, but then again…I am rather new to hifi so I’m not entirely sure that there even is anything to back these claims up(or that I even understand them well enough) though it is the only reason I haven’t jumped the gun on the wiim yet.

 

[DanielT]

I recently bought a pair of used System Audio (Pandion 2) speakers,

Interesting speakers with classic, good, woffer and tweeter from Scan-Speak's Revelator series:

15W/4531G00 – Scan-Speak A/S

www.scan-speak.dk

D2905/990000 – Scan-Speak A/S

www.scan-speak.dk

Crossover: 2000 Hz (24 dB/oct.). Good potential there.

Wireless speakers Archives - System Audio - Life-Changing Sound Begins Here

The Silverback series is a complete, active, and wireless music system. These wireless speakers work seamlessly with the Stereo Hub HT control unit.

system-audio.com

By the way, regarding your needs, I think that..

In your case, I'd strongly consider a WiiM Amp Pro or Amp Ultra.

...is an excellent alternative.

 

[DanielT]

Thanks for you reply @staticV3 , and excited to be a part of ASR. I have been looking into that option as well. What makes me a little nervous about it were some reviews talking about how the sound tends to sound a little “boring” and that it struggles with dynamic nuance. I’m worried about the fact that I’ve read that analogue amps do a better job at making the music more exciting through a tighter grip on the bass and so on, but then again…I am rather new to hifi so I’m not entirely sure that there even is anything to back these claims up(or that I even understand them well enough) though it is the only reason I haven’t jumped the gun on the wiim yet.

It's just an audiophile myth. A well-designed, class D (D doesn't stand for Digital by the way) amp vs. a well-designed "old school" class AB amp with your System Audio speakers. You wouldn't hear any difference between the amps (given they have the same amount of power).

Advantage class D. They are physically smaller, due to their efficiency, vs a class AB. Not to mention class A amps, which can be real sumo heavy amps with few watts.
(class A pre amps are the exception regarding size/weight).

Power amplifier classes - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Gabr0718]

Thank you @DanielT. Seems like the Wiim might just be the way to go. I’ve just been researching a little bit and I’ve come across options such as the Marantz m1 and the bluesound powernode and they bare both streamers with built in amps. I have been looking at the specifications and they all seem pretty much the same, yet the marantz m1 for an example seems to get a lot of praise. Are you familiar with these options or will the WiiM still reign superior?

 

[kemmler3D]

some reviews talking about how the sound tends to sound a little “boring” and that it struggles with dynamic nuance.

People talking about the "sound" of an amp without providing data to back it up are essentially participating in a decades long bamboozle. Amps aren't supposed to have a sound, and the vast majority of the time they actually don't.

analogue amps do a better job at making the music more exciting through a tighter grip on the bass and so on, but then again…I am rather new to hifi so I’m not entirely sure that there even is anything to back these claims up(or that I even understand them well enough)

All amps are analog... Speakers won't move if you read a list of numbers to them.

As far as whether there's anything to back up these claims... They would have shown you the evidence if there was any. This sounds harsh, but most of the hi-fi reviewer (and consumer) contingent simply refuses to believe that expectation bias / "placebo effect" causes them to hear differences that aren't coming from the equipment. The entire edifice of amp reviews is based on this simple refusal to acknowledge how hearing works in practice. People aren't microphones and how and what we hear is conditioned by the brain.

In the end, in blind testing, amps used as designed all sound the same. You can find plenty of people who assert that both blind testing and bench measurements are wrong, but we're about 50 years into the debate and the best they've got is still "I know what I heard, I trust my ears, so the science must be wrong".

Ok, polemic over, I would definitely suggest a unit with room correction, it's actually arguably more important in small rooms than large.

 

[Gabr0718]

Thank you for the suggestion and the information. I’m learning so much new stuff and I think that most of the assumptions that I have about hifi might be wrong. Appreciate all of your inputs and your knowledge!

 

[DanielT]

Thank you @DanielT. Seems like the Wiim might just be the way to go. I’ve just been researching a little bit and I’ve come across options such as the Marantz m1 and the bluesound powernode and they bare both streamers with built in amps. I have been looking at the specifications and they all seem pretty much the same, yet the marantz m1 for an example seems to get a lot of praise. Are you familiar with these options or will the WiiM still reign superior?

You can read about them, plus the ones @staticV3 mentioned, in the links below.

Think about what features you want, and compare the prices between them.
A WiiM plus UMIK-1 measurement microphone which is plug and play with WiiM (if, for example, your mobile or tablet supports the microphone) would be my choice.
I base it on my wishes for features and the price performance ratio that I want.

I agree with @kemmler3D who said in the post above Ok, polemic over, I would definitely suggest a unit with room correction, it's actually arguably more important in small rooms than large.

With WiiM you get a smooth automated room correction tool.

You can read about it here:

Optimizing Your Audio Experience: A Comprehensive Guide to RoomFit™ Room Correction

TABLE OF CONTENTS What's Room Correction The Benefits of Room Correction Room Correction vs. EQ Preparations for Room Correction Step-by-Step Guide to Room Correction Tips What's Room Correction Room correction is a process that inv...

faq.wiimhome.com

Marantz M1 Streaming Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Marantz M1 stereo streaming amplifier. It is on kind loan from a member and costs US $1000. I used the Heos app to control the M1. It instantly recognized the unit and offered to upgrade it. But boy, did it take forever to do that with multiple...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Bluesound Powernode Streaming Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Bluesound Powernode wifi and ethernet streaming amplifier with digital input. It is on kind loan from a member and costs US $949. The design is apple-like and gorgeous as usual. Alas, I miss some kind of informative display on what it is doing...

www.audiosciencereview.com

WiiM Amp Ultra Streaming Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the WiiM Amp Ultra stereo streaming amplifier. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $529. I was surprised how heavy and solid feeling the Ultra is for its size. I upgraded its firmware which went smoothly and rather fast. I was pleasantly...

www.audiosciencereview.com

WiiM Amp Pro Streaming Stereo Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the WiiM Amp Pro networked streaming stereo class D amplifier. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $379. The package is minimalistic in nature and matches the "non-pro" version of the amplifier. The volume indicator is that set of LEDs...

www.audiosciencereview.com