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PSI's AVAA Bass trap review

amirm

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Thanks Michael. You saved me from chasing Nyal for this info when he mentioned it at dinner. :) Didn't he say there was a much larger improvement in time domain? I don't see it in the display you post although it is hard to see with the two similar colors. Can you by chance make one of them green or something?
 

dallasjustice

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Thanks Michael. You saved me from chasing Nyal for this info when he mentioned it at dinner. :) Didn't he say there was a much larger improvement in time domain? I don't see it in the display you post although it is hard to see with the two similar colors. Can you by chance make one of them green or something?
Can't please em'. :D I should get a "like" for this.
all spl.jpg
waterfall.jpg
 

Ethan Winer

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However, it seems to make alot of sense for the audiophile who fears DSP or doesn't want to load the room up with fiberglass panels or expensive modex plates. ;)
LOL, spending that same $4,000 on bass traps would help the bass response and ringing vastly more than this very modest improvement.
 

dallasjustice

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LOL, spending that same $4,000 on bass traps would help the bass response and ringing vastly more than this very modest improvement.
There's no doubt that. But i would also expect that many bass traps to also reduce midrange and high frequency decay time to an uncomfortable level for many folks.
 

Fitzcaraldo215

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There's no doubt that. But i would also expect that many bass traps to also reduce midrange and high frequency decay time to an uncomfortable level for many folks.

Possibly so. There is no free lunch. Toole once said he was not a fan of passive, absorbing treatments because he considered them a broadband solution to what is usually a narrow band problem in most rooms. Like anything, you gotta know what you are doing.
 

dallasjustice

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Possibly so. There is no free lunch. Toole once said he was not a fan of passive, absorbing treatments because he considered them a broadband solution to what is usually a narrow band problem in most rooms. Like anything, you gotta know what you are doing.
I agree. If you don't know what you are doing, you can end up with an attic full of fiberglass panels. :eek:

This is where spending a little money on an expert at the beginning can save a lot of time and money later on; assuming one listens to what they say. :(
 
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Ethan Winer

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Having enough bass traps to get an excellent LF response doesn't necessarily mean the mids and highs are over absorbed. It depends on the design of the traps. I have 44 panels in my 25x16 foot living room, and it is absolutely not too dead sounding. IMO, the notion of expecting pleasing ambience from reflections in a typical home-size room is flawed. Such reflections usually make music sound smaller, not larger, as explained in this article:

Early Reflections

To be clear, good bass traps absorb broadband at low frequencies, and absorb less generally at higher frequencies. Room bass problems can occur at many frequencies, not just those related to the room dimensions, so narrow band traps are rarely the best solution as explained in this recent article from AudioXpress magazine:

Bass Trap Myths

--Ethan
 
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Purité Audio

Purité Audio

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Got any traps that offer effective absorbtion at 30Hz?
Keith
 

Hmast

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The last few paragraphs sum it up for me. It'll never be possible to just listen to music with such a system - there'll always be something to tweak.

If the aim is to 'remove the room', would simply sitting closer to smaller speakers do the trick?
LOL, yes. :eek:
Sadly, no, it is not that simple.

Being close to the speaker does not stop reverb to reach you. It will stop weak frequencies to reach you, yes (mids and trebles), but bass will require you to listen in a very large room if you wish low bass bouncing to stay away from you. Trebles and mids are also very directive so they'll end up splitting very quickly away in the room. Bass is not directive, every bounce will get to you.

In a regular room, any bass below ~50hz will certainly bounce on walls for a while and imply a "drag". In a very small room it's nearly impossible to hear a good bass and EQing won't solve the drag issue. Low bass require big rooms... or bass traps. But bass traps for fq below 50hz are huge, so it is often impossible to set them up in a small room.

N.B. not sure about the drag term but I'm sure you'll get the idea (not English native speaker).

edit : oops, very old thread, sorry.

While I'm at it I also found this nice review about the AVAAs: https://www.jochenschulz.me/en/blog/active-vs-passive-absorbers-psi-avaa-c20-review
 

DJBonoBobo

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Sadly, no, it is not that simple.

Being close to the speaker does not stop reverb to reach you. It will stop weak frequencies to reach you, yes (mids and trebles), but bass will require you to listen in a very large room if you wish low bass bouncing to stay away from you. Trebles and mids are also very directive so they'll end up splitting very quickly away in the room. Bass is not directive, every bounce will get to you.

In a regular room, any bass below ~50hz will certainly bounce on walls for a while and imply a "drag". In a very small room it's nearly impossible to hear a good bass and EQing won't solve the drag issue. Low bass require big rooms... or bass traps. But bass traps for fq below 50hz are huge, so it is often impossible to set them up in a small room.

N.B. not sure about the drag term but I'm sure you'll get the idea (not English native speaker).

edit : oops, very old thread, sorry.

While I'm at it I also found this nice review about the AVAAs: https://www.jochenschulz.me/en/blog/active-vs-passive-absorbers-psi-avaa-c20-review
Another review with measurements is here, if you are interested: https://www.soundandrecording.de/equipment/psi-avaa-c20-aktiver-bass-absorber-im-test/

And my own experiences with measurements: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...n-a-small-room-subs-ma1-absorbers-avaa.27288/
 
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