PS Audio FR30 speakers

[amirm]

I'm happy to setup an online petition or GoFundMe for a Klippel NFS, since people feel so strongly about it . Feel free to add Comsol Multiphysics to the list too.

Word to the wise: on next job application, demand both of those as a condition of accepting the job. And oh, a signal processing/mechanical engineering PhD to run Comsol for you!

 

[jtwrace]

The studio is a passion project for Paul and something that he and Terri have wanted to do for many years. I hope that it succeeds for him but I don't have anything to do with it and can't comment further.

You did setup and tune the Fully Active FR30's though, right?

 

[Mart68]

You did setup and tune the Fully Active FR30's though, right?

The loudspeakers in the studio aren't active FR30s, they just share some common elements. That's explained by PM in the video.

 

[jtwrace]

The loudspeakers in the studio aren't active FR30s, they just share some common elements. That's explained by PM in the video.

Really? This sure looks like (2) Hypex Modules to me, one for the top and one for the bottom. Which Chris goes on to explain about digital eq and tuning them in.

 

[Mart68]

says it is 'Based on' the FR30, not that it's an active FR30. It's clearly a different loudspeaker.

 

[jtwrace]

says it is 'Based on' the FR30, not that it's an active FR30. It's clearly a different loudspeaker.

It's a prototype of the FR30...same drivers etc. If it's not as "accurate" as the FR30 then why the hell would they be using it for their studio? C'mon man.

 

[Mart68]

It's a prototype of the FR30...same drivers etc. If it's not as "accurate" as the FR30 then why the hell would they be using it for their studio? C'mon man.

same drivers yes but overall not the same, for a start the active has woofers in the top cabinet which the FR30 doesn't, watch from 50 seconds in:

 

[jtwrace]

same drivers yes but overall not the same, for a start the active has woofers in the top cabinet which the FR30 doesn't, watch from 50 seconds in:

OMG. The woofer is in a different location as Paul says

OK, lets make some sense of this:

• I own a large electronics company known as PS Audio​
• I own a recording / mastering studio and record label known as Octave​
• I hire speaker designer (@Chris Brunhaver) to design said speakers​
• I own a speaker company which I've dreamed about for many decades​
• I have an agreement for my speakers to be built in China to produce my FR30​
• I want to use my "most accurate" speakers in my recording studio to make critical decisions with and show off​
• I don't use my electronics on my speakers that are built as one offs and do not resemble the speakers that I've invested hundreds of thousands of dollars into.​

Yeah, makes total sense that they're not FR30's.

Reality...
They are prototype FR30's which will actually measure better than the FR30 since they're active with PEQ. Hence the reason they're in the critical location.

 

[jtwrace]

Since this site is full of data, lets look at some real data shall we?

Paul's words:

]

And of course the last that Paul says they're only using the Hypex for the bottom end.

 

[modulardesign]

Obviously mixing is an art and there is no right or wrong to that. My exception is that the whole thing is in a tight orbit around the FR30 per Paul's own words. And I did have the thought of artists needing support as well. But they have a somewhat lofi sound to them once he shifted towards using the FR30 and its active counterpart. The way they are mixed is not wrong at all. Art is art, and having everything nice and sparkly is not necessarily in good taste depending on the mood that is being conveyed. I think a folk sort of sound adds charm. But its very inconsistent with Paul's wants for things to be revealing, and Paul has said he won't make anything he doesn't want to own. That is different than willing to own. I just suspect customers will be forced to endure Paul's taste in speaker tonality.

I guess the last time I checked they had separated the recording company from the electronics company to minimize conflicts of interest. The recording company has stuff not developed by the electronics company. Depends on fitness of purpose. They did some interesting work with a rock band, check it out and let me know what you think. One of the basic studio monitors one can use is the Yamaha NS10. If it sounds good on it, it will sound good in most systems. Use of the FR30 is probably for internal self validation of product.

 

[Cars-N-Cans]

I guess the last time I checked they had separated the recording company from the electronics company to minimize conflicts of interest. The recording company has stuff not developed by the electronics company. Depends on fitness of purpose. They did some interesting work with a rock band, check it out and let me know what you think. One of the basic studio monitors one can use is the Yamaha NS10. If it sounds good on it, it will sound good in most systems. Use of the FR30 is probably for internal self validation of product.

While not perfect the NS10 has a reasonably neutral response from the available measurement data. Additionally since it has been around for quite some time mixing engineers will likely have a good feel for how what they are hearing will translate to the finished mix when using it (or at least we hope). A new studio like octave using the FR30 from start to finish removes all external references. If the speaker monitor is capable of output across the audio spectrum, then in theory any sort of response could be used and they would ”do what’s necessary” to make it sound right since they have the live sound as a reference as well, so it’s only natural to try and get that in the mix, too. I dont think it’s that dire in practice, but there is no real objective frame of reference from start to finish from what I can see. If they where willing to use SOTA monitors, then the finished mix could be compared on the FR30 to validate the design from a subjective standpoint. Obviously they will not have the same presence as a live band, but the sound shouldn’t be too dramatically different. In a much earlier video, Paul had alluded to this when standing next to a piano they purchased, but that seems to have never materialized. While it may not be proper objectively to directly compare speakers to the real thing, it would be an interesting exercise to do.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

I came across this YouTube review of the FR-30. He says the imaging wasn't as precise as he likes but likes the overall tonality. Not a rave review but not a terrible one either. You can skip well ahead in the review to where he gives his impressions. There's no data.

 

[Chris Brunhaver]

It's a prototype of the FR30...same drivers etc. If it's not as "accurate" as the FR30 then why the hell would they be using it for their studio? C'mon man.

Well, I wouldn't read too much into this.

Paul originally wanted to use a stock FR30 in there but they really not suitable as nearfield monitors Also, the control room is rather small and FR30 are very large and deep, as is a stack of our gear.

I had suggested that we use a 3rd party offering but the studio stuff is a hobby and passion for Paul and gives him new things to talk about on his youtube videos (where it takes us longer to do a long time to develop products). Paul also likes to "dogfood" things and use our own stuff wherever possible and is taking a rather non-traditional (from a pro audio production) approach to a lot of things.

The Hypex stuff is nice and their software worked well and was easy to use. I imported all of the measurements into VituixCAD to design the filters there.

I don't have anything against active speakers or DSP and it would be fun to do some for work in the future. A colleague of mine is doing some very interesting amplifier and DAC work that I'm very excited about the possibility of applying as building blocks to future active speaker applications.

 

[Chris Brunhaver]

I came across this YouTube review of the FR-30. He says the imaging wasn't as precise as he likes but likes the overall tonality. Not a rave review but not a terrible one either. You can skip well ahead in the review to where he gives his impressions. There's no data.

We're shipping out a lot of speakers around the end of the month and so you should start seeing more feedback from people. Until know, only a handful of pilot production units are out in the wild.

One pair of those early sets of speakers is in the hands of our distributors in australia and they showed them at a recent trade show (different than the one from the youtube review that you linked). It sounds like though, even though the room was quite small, they were more successful in setting them up this time and getting a great sound.

Unfortunately, this forum requires you to register to read more than a page or two, but it's pretty fast and easy. It's been fun to rear the comments from people.
https://www.stereonet.com/forums/topic/544706-2022-hi-fi-av-show-melbourne-impressions/

 

[jtwrace]

Well, I wouldn't read too much into this.

Paul originally wanted to use a stock FR30 in there but they really not suitable as nearfield monitors Also, the control room is rather small and FR30 are very large and deep, as is a stack of our gear.

I had suggested that we use a 3rd party offering but the studio stuff is a hobby and passion for Paul and gives him new things to talk about on his youtube videos (where it takes us longer to do a long time to develop products). Paul also likes to "dogfood" things and use our own stuff wherever possible and is taking a rather non-traditional (from a pro audio production) approach to a lot of things.

The Hypex stuff is nice and their software worked well and was easy to use. I imported all of the measurements into VituixCAD to design the filters there.

I don't have anything against active speakers or DSP and it would be fun to do some for work in the future. A colleague of mine is doing some very interesting amplifier and DAC work that I'm very excited about the possibility of applying as building blocks to future active speaker applications.

Eh, scroll down a bit to see what Paul says (yes, I know, you were there)...they're still FR30's. I'm still waiting for you to come on my channel to discuss but can't get a response anymore.

 

[DSJR]

While not perfect the NS10 has a reasonably neutral response from the available measurement data.

I'm sorry sir, but I have to respond -

The Yamaha NS10 Story

Love or hate the Yamaha NS10, this unassuming little speaker has found a place in the studios of many of the world's top producers. We trace its history, and investigate why a monitor whose sound has been described as "horrible" became an industry standard.

www.soundonsound.com

Bold North Audio MS10-W Introduces Direct Replacement Mid-Woofer for Yamaha NS10 Studio Monitors

MISCO recently unveiled a brand new version of a legendary driver. The new MS10-W, will be marketed under the new MISCO brand, Bold North Audio, and it is effectively a direct replacement for the famous white driver on Yamaha’s NS10 studio monitors! The MS10-W actually includes a lightweight...

audioxpress.com

As you were...

 

[Chris Brunhaver]

Eh, scroll down a bit to see what Paul says (yes, I know, you were there)...they're still FR30's. I'm still waiting for you to come on my channel to discuss but can't get a response anymore.

Things have finally calmed down a bit for me and we've officially launched this product so I'd be more than happy to speak with you. I'll reach out via email.

 

[CtheArgie]

Well, I wouldn't read too much into this.

Paul originally wanted to use a stock FR30 in there but they really not suitable as nearfield monitors Also, the control room is rather small and FR30 are very large and deep, as is a stack of our gear.

I had suggested that we use a 3rd party offering but the studio stuff is a hobby and passion for Paul and gives him new things to talk about on his youtube videos (where it takes us longer to do a long time to develop products). Paul also likes to "dogfood" things and use our own stuff wherever possible and is taking a rather non-traditional (from a pro audio production) approach to a lot of things.

The Hypex stuff is nice and their software worked well and was easy to use. I imported all of the measurements into VituixCAD to design the filters there.

I don't have anything against active speakers or DSP and it would be fun to do some for work in the future. A colleague of mine is doing some very interesting amplifier and DAC work that I'm very excited about the possibility of applying as building blocks to future active speaker applications.

Ah Chris!

When you give answers like this, my hope comes back that you can influence Paul to do things the modern and correct way. You will never get a Dynaudio Jupiter set up, or it appears a Klippel NFS, but it is only through measurements, testing, checking, validating and then retesting, that you make things better.

Many years ago, the company I was working needed to make a protein in "giant sizes" in order to be able to understand the behavior (receptor bindings, etc.). They couldn't make it on earth as gravity affected the development of the crystals. They made a deal with NASA to grow the crystals in space. Unfortunately, the experiment was done in the shuttle that was destroyed coming back to earth. A few months after the accident, they found the experiment set up in a marsh in Texas. Not only it had survived reentry and the crash, the crystals survived too and were useful for characterization. An absolute impossible miracle! This is a digression, but it shows that you have to really try and push the envelope. People think that their ears remain perfect forever but don't understand that most use eyeglasses to read these messages... Not you yet, I suppose.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

We're shipping out a lot of speakers around the end of the month and so you should start seeing more feedback from people. Until know, only a handful of pilot production units are out in the wild.

One pair of those early sets of speakers is in the hands of our distributors in australia and they showed them at a recent trade show (different than the one from the youtube review that you linked). It sounds like though, even though the room was quite small, they were more successful in setting them up this time and getting a great sound.

Unfortunately, this forum requires you to register to read more than a page or two, but it's pretty fast and easy. It's been fun to rear the comments from people.
https://www.stereonet.com/forums/topic/544706-2022-hi-fi-av-show-melbourne-impressions/

Are the speakers going to be at the Los Angeles Hi-Fi show this weekend? I'm going to be there on Saturday and I think it would be nice to hear them.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Are the speakers going to be at the Los Angeles Hi-Fi show this weekend? I'm going to be there on Saturday and I think it would be nice to hear them.

I just looked at the list of manufacturers who will be there, and PS Audio is not one of them. That's a shame; I think it's a missed opportunity given that this is a 'high end' audio show and these people are the target purchasers.