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Proposal

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smowry

smowry

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@amirm

I propose that the thread category Speaker Reviews, Measurements and Discussion be changed and/or segmented.

1. A speaker is one that speaks, whereas a loudspeaker is a system that converts an electrical signal into sound pressure.

2. A transducer is a device that converts energy from one form to another.

Then my proposal is to segment "Speaker Reviews, Measurements and Discussion" into Loudspeakers and Transducers. Loudspeakers could then have the subtopics of Passive and Active along with Transducers (drivers, microphones and sensors) as a separate category.
 
FWIW, I concur that a system (drivers, enclosure(s), crossover(s)/EQ) is better called a loudspeaker -- as I usually do.
The colloquial term speaker for a single driver is so deeply entrenched that I think that ship has sailed, so to speak. ;)

I will also mention, somewhat glibly*, that Western Electric, which essentially perfected loudspeaker design** in the 1920s and 30s in the service of the motion picture industry, was so wedded to seeing the world through a telephone filter that their preferred term of art was receiver.

1768086837457.png

A gorgeous pair of WE 555 "Receivers" -- we'd call 'em compression drivers.

1768087013870.png

A WE loudspeaker :)

... then again, this, too, was called a loudspeaker by WE. :)

1768087178617.png


The ad scans above are from the blog of my good friend (and designer of my "daily driver" amplifier), Joseph Esmilla.

JE Labs

jelabs.blogspot.com jelabs.blogspot.com
______________
* me?! inconceivable. ;)
** well, not just WE/ERPI -- RCA and some others ex-US were in the mix, too, of course. :)
 
smowry said:
@amirm

I propose that the thread category Speaker Reviews, Measurements and Discussion be changed and/or segmented.

1. A speaker is one that speaks, whereas a loudspeaker is a system that converts an electrical signal into sound pressure.

2. A transducer is a device that converts energy from one form to another.

Then my proposal is to segment "Speaker Reviews, Measurements and Discussion" into Loudspeakers and Transducers. Loudspeakers could then have the subtopics of Passive and Active along with Transducers (drivers, microphones and sensors) as a separate category.
Click to expand...

Do you think anyone is confused, and clicks through the Speaker Reviews threads expecting reviews of TED Talks or the like?
 
Philbo King said:
From the Pedantic Division of the Department of Redundancy Department...
Just kidding
Click to expand...
;)
Actually, I believe the source may have been the Tautology Wing of the Pedantic Division of the...

Zgrado1970 said:
Do you think anyone is confused, and clicks through the Speaker Reviews threads expecting reviews of TED Talks or the like?
Click to expand...
Well, as a fan of fairly vintage loudspeakers from a Massachusetts company called Analog and Digital Systems (ads), I can tell you that searching the web, or eBAY, for ads speakers (or ads loudspeakers, for that matter) is an exercise in frustration. ;)

In fairness, most ads products were more or less identical (license-built?) versions of Braun products -- which was a very good thing!

 
Philbo King said:
From the Pedantic Division of the Department of Redundancy Department...
Just kidding
Click to expand...

What is the most significant component of an audio system?

I claim it is the transducer(s), We don't even list Transducers as a topic. Most if not all significant loudspeaker related companies have a Transducer R&D Group. Needless to say Transducer Engineering is a specialized discipline, yet only a very few universities offer that course of study.
 
The whole system is (still) pretty darned important, I'd opine.
Most transducers in free space don't sound great.
There are exceptions, though.
 
Zgrado1970 said:
Do you think anyone is confused, and clicks through the Speaker Reviews threads expecting reviews of TED Talks or the like?
Click to expand...

With regards to transducers and speakers, I claim that confusion is common; however, with regards to loudspeakers and speakers, my answer is no. But is that important? My objective is encourage ASR to maintain the highest standards. As we know, terminology is an important aspect of engineering and science.

A doctor or a nurse would refer to the male sex organ as a *****, whereas one who is not related to healthcare might refer to a dick. Is anyone confused?

Ouch P E N I S is censored but dick is not.
 
Last edited:
I'm "casual". ;) I don't know of anybody who goes shopping for "loudspeakers".

If I was writing a technical paper I'd probably say "loudspeaker". This is Audio Science Review but I feel there are more important things to be picky about.

Just for kicks, I took a quick look at the product indexes for Crutchfield and Parts Express and I didn't see "loudspeakers".

If I search both websites I get hits for both terms. On both sites I got a different number of hits with the different terms but both brought-up drivers and speaker systems. More hits for "speaker" on both websites.

Parts Express says "loudspeaker" in some of the descriptions. I didn't see that on the Crutchfield website but I didn't look at everything that popped-in in a search for "loudspeaker".

It might be sort-of a Shibboleth and if you say "loudspeaker" you're an audio outsider trying to "fake it". :P
 
mhardy6647 said:
The whole system is (still) pretty darned important, I'd opine.
Most transducers in free space don't sound great.
There are exceptions, though.
Click to expand...

I believe that you miss my point and yes I agree that the whole system is important. However, I can use an automobile as an example. Then I claim that the engine or motor is the most significant component.
 
smowry said:
With regards to transducers and speakers, I claim that confusion is common; however, with regards to loudspeakers and speakers, my answer is no. But is that important? My objective is encourage ASR to maintain the highest standards. As we know terminology is an important aspect of engineering and science.

A doctor or a nurse would refer to the male sex organ as a *****, whereas one who is not related to healthcare might refer to a dick. Is anyone confused?

Ouch P E N I S is censored by dick is not.
Click to expand...
Agreed terminology is important.

I would not want to adopt a terminology that makes it harder for the large audience of non-members to consider the information posted at ASR.

I type in the term 'loudspeaker' instead of speaker because I wonder if the translation from English to another language is more precise - but I do not know.

Amir has explained elsewhere why he prefers the term 'differential' to 'balanced' and seems to be at peace using the term 'balanced' in describing relevant gear.
 
mhardy6647 said:
;)
Actually, I believe the source may have been the Tautology Wing of the Pedantic Division of the...


Well, as a fan of fairly vintage loudspeakers from a Massachusetts company called Analog and Digital Systems (ads), I can tell you that searching the web, or eBAY, for ads speakers (or ads loudspeakers, for that matter) is an exercise in frustration. ;)

In fairness, most ads products were more or less identical (license-built?) versions of Braun products -- which was a very good thing!

Click to expand...

I had the pleasure of working with Dr. Godehard Guenther and his assistant Jeffery in Malaysia in 1999 at Hymnario and EAW (now Eastech). Dr. Guenther used the terminology of Loudspeakers and Transducers.
 
Even Danny Richie uses the term loudspeakers, where ASR uses speakers (https://gr-research.com/diy-loudspeaker-kits/). However, he does not use the term transducer. He uses the term driver.

A driver is a person who drives a vehicle.

At Bose we had TRES, Transducer Research Group. I know of no Driver Research Groups.
 
Last edited:
smowry said:
1. A speaker is one that speaks, whereas a loudspeaker is a system that converts an electrical signal into sound pressure.
Click to expand...
That is just one meaning. From Oxford dictionary:

speak·er
/ˈspēkər/

noun
noun: speaker; plural noun: speakers; noun: Speaker; plural noun: Speakers
  1. a person who speaks.
    "language communication involves the interrelation between speaker and hearer"
    • a person who delivers a speech or lecture.
      "our guest speaker will give an audiovisual presentation"

    • a person who speaks a specified language.
      "he is a fluent English and French speaker"
  2. the presiding officer in a legislative assembly, especially the House of Representatives.

  3. an apparatus that converts electrical impulses into sound, as part of audio equipment.
    "a set of stereo speakers"
 
smowry said:
2. A transducer is a device that converts energy from one form to another.
Click to expand...
Which includes microphones which I do NOT test, nor do we generally discuss in the forum.
 
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