I would assume most DACs outperform phono
Hahaha. What I meant was in its "ranking", in that the DAC was in the top tiers and the phono was worse than an Art DJ Pre II or the Klipsch Powergate...
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Pro-ject Pre Box DS2 DAC & Pre-amp Review
- Thread starter amirm
- Start date
Hahaha. What I meant was in its "ranking", in that the DAC was in the top tiers and the phono was worse than an Art DJ Pre II or the Klipsch Powergate...
AudioSceptic
Major Contributor
Yes, indeed. <https://www.project-audio.com/en/product/pre-box-ds2-digital/> I think this is a nice option, allowing it to fit in with gear from different eras. The clean design reminds me of the classic Yamaha stuff.
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AudioSceptic
Major Contributor
Can I be the only one who thinks that Pro-Ject makes too many similar products? <https://www.henleyaudio.co.uk/shop/product?Search=pro-ject&Submit=Search>. For example, why <https://www.henleyaudio.co.uk/products/Pre-Box-S2-Digital> and <https://www.henleyaudio.co.uk/products/Head-Box-S2-Digital>?
It is a bit repetitive for sure. It does look like 1980's Yamaha gear as a nick said before in this thread or somewhere I can't find. It's timeless perhaps.
Haskil
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Dear Amirm, can you test phono with the MC and MM and also with subsonic filter for the SNR ? Thank you one more time for your work so important for audio community.
I also think this doesn't deserve the golfing panther.
Phono is so-so and low impedance phones short...
Relax panther and recommendation, I agree, but golfing used to be harder to get.
But that's your panther, for sure.
Phono is so-so and low impedance phones short...
Relax panther and recommendation, I agree, but golfing used to be harder to get.
But that's your panther, for sure.
We need to send more Panthers to Amir. As it is, we are a couple accidents away from everything getting a broken panther.
Why not get the minidsp shd which has a good dac as well, but can also do xover,dsp and dirac, not to mention streaming via volumio. The price is a bit higher but the features are worth it in the minidsp imho
somebodyelse
Master Contributor
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Because it's twice the price and doesn't have multiple analog inputs or a phono headamp? You're talking about two products with very different feature sets and price levels.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #52
Sorry I shipped it back already. I am very behind in testing these days....
OP
- Thread Starter
- #53
The phono ranking it not what it seems. Normally SINAD has a good mix of distortion+noise. So in one number, it gives you two major factor in electronic audio device performance. With phono stages at the input level I am using, SINAD is essentially measuring noise. Distortion as I showed is at -100 dB which is hugely better than the SINAD of 68 dB.
On noise, as I stated in the review, that is highly dependent on grounding and setup. I managed to get 10 dB improvement by just adding another grounding wire.
With grove noise of LP being so high, the measured noise/SINAD level should be plenty good.
When I first started, I used higher input voltages (to get 2 volts output) and that reduced the impact of SINAD being noise limited. Alas, people complained that the input voltage I used was too high for typical MM cartridge so I knocked it down to 5 mv with resulting issues above.
Thanks for the explanation.
Noise for low level signal, especially with RIAA compensation, is not easy to manage, indeed.
(But this compensation also lowers the distortion, which is what we see here. Without the compensation, it would have been higher).
Noise for low level signal, especially with RIAA compensation, is not easy to manage, indeed.
(But this compensation also lowers the distortion, which is what we see here. Without the compensation, it would have been higher).
List price for shd is $1200 vs list price for DUT is 950-1050, not double. And the SHD has balanced and unbalanced analog in. The only thing missing is phono, which personally I dont care for.
somebodyelse
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Transatlantic pricing differences - 849 € vs. 1 659,00 € both including tax. I read the SHD spec sheet as being a single input with both connector types - being switchable would be good. And I miscounted the analog inputs on the Project, so the inputs are a better match than I thought.
AudioSceptic
Major Contributor
Do you mean the S2 or DS2? They are different ranges, the DS2 being much larger.
The S2, the small one.
AudioSceptic
Major Contributor
Our main system is NAS > Raspberry Pi running Volumio > Pre Box S2 Digital > Linn Kolektor > Linn Klout > Linn Isobariks. We could use the Pre Box direct into the Klout but the Linn remote is so much nicer to use and the Kolektor simplifies usage with other sources. The matching Pro-Ject Amp Box S2 might be suitable for some efficient speakers but the specs don't seem too impressive.
I went with the Pre Box because it also has the headphone output and I like to buy UK or European if I can without spending crazy money.
I don't see why the E30 wouldn't work with any amp, as long as you have volume control.
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