Power amplifier tests with respect to FTC: 16 CFR Part 432 (July 5, 2024) requirements on output power claims

[KSTR]

Who the f... soldered this???

To me this looks like the original machine soldering. What you see is a bit of thermal paste which was applied in excess on the heatsink. A non-issue.

 

[RickS]

To me this looks like the original machine soldering. What you see is a bit of thermal paste which was applied in excess on the heatsink. A non-issue.

Maybe, but thought it was pretty OT anyway. Matters less I guess after 700+ posts.

 

[Esprit]

Idle power consumption of the Hypex NC252MP module (amp + SMPS) is 17W, measured

So in violation of European regulations?
However the question was referring to amplifiers from the 80's.

 

[antcollinet]

So in violation of European regulations?
However the question was referring to amplifiers from the 80's.

A module doesn't have to comply with that regulation. A finished product does.

I don't know how many amps that use that module implement a low power standby mode. But the module does have a standby PSU, whose no load power draw is less than 0.2W, that will allow them to do so.

 

[Esprit]

Thank you.
I will measure my Adam (250 watt IcePower + 250 watt IcePower + 50 watt AB)

 

[vicenzo_del_paris]

So in violation of European regulations?
However the question was referring to amplifiers from the 80

I thought EU regulations were about standby mode... Not idling.
And by the way, NC252MP supports standby (<0.5watts). Integrator must handle it.

 

[Esprit]

Thank you.
I will measure my Adam (250 watt IcePower + 250 watt IcePower + 50 watt AB)

4 watts in stand-by with the front button, 20 watts “on” in the absence of signal, 20-22 watts with the volume that hurts my ears.
Consumption of a single speaker.

 

[RickS]

A module doesn't have to comply with that regulation. A finished product does.

Good to have this more astute distinction highlighted! All too often, a module supplier (like Hypex) gets blamed as if they were supplying a finished product.

I don't know how many amps that use that module implement a low power standby mode. But the module does have a standby PSU, whose no load power draw is less than 0.2W, that will allow them to do so.

The NCxxxMP standby interface is simple and easy for the amp manufacturer to implement. If the amp has a trigger input or auto power feature, it will likely use the interface. The other telltale sign is if it has a soft power switch (likely on the front panel). Other Hypex SMPSes have different interfaces. Nilai's interface has individual inputs for a power switches, and its trigger input.

 

[antcollinet]

Good to have this more astute distinction highlighted! All too often, a module supplier (like Hypex) gets blamed as if they were supplying a finished product.



The NCxxxMP standby interface is simple and easy for the amp manufacturer to implement. If the amp has a trigger input or auto power feature, it will likely use the interface. The other telltale sign is if it has a soft power switch (likely on the front panel). Other Hypex SMPSes have different interfaces. Nilai's interface has individual inputs for a power switches, and its trigger input.

The regs (as I understand them) require the device to go into standby automatically after a period of non use. I don't think working from a trigger input meets that requirement, but auto power off can if compliant with the required timings.

 

[gnarly]

Quick question re ASR amp testing for Amir, or any who know for sure...
What is the duration of the sweeps used for the Power Versus Distortion @ (4 or 8 Ohm) Both Channels Driven ?
Like in this snip of the Buckeye amp...
Thx.

 

[amirm]

I answered that a couple of pages back.

 

[gnarly]

I answered that a couple of pages back.

I searched your posts thru 10 pages back without finding...
Closest was #704, but with no actual times given.
Sorry if I've missed it...would it be too hard to simply repeat the length of the sweeps you're using?

 

[antcollinet]

Closest was #704, but with no actual times given.

That is because it is not deterministic. The test system increases power, checks distortion, increases power, until the distortion reaches a threshold. If it goes to far, it might have to back up a bit and try again. If it goes too high and causes the amp to trip, then I'm guessing the test might start again.

Amir said a few seconds at maximum power after the amp has ramped up to that point, but the exact time will vary from test to test depending on the behaviour of the amp.

 

[kyuu]

I believe Amir was thinking of this post from page 20. The thread has moved pretty quickly.

 

[gnarly]

I believe Amir was thinking of this post from page 20. The thread has moved pretty quickly.

Thank you.
And thx @antcollinet

 

[Berwhale]

...i've run out of popcorn, please don't post any more whilst I pop out and restock.

 

[Sokel]

To me this looks like the original machine soldering. What you see is a bit of thermal paste which was applied in excess on the heatsink. A non-issue.

I certainly hope so.

 

[amirm]

I certainly hope so.

Definitely looks like paste to me.

 

[amirm]

Tell those consumers who are using 40-50 year old amplifiers still operating perfectly because they were built properly in the first place.

None of those amplifiers were subjected to the new, 5 minute rule of FTC. Any number of them could have overheated, gone into protection or damaged.

Having repaired a lot of those when they were less than 5 years old, they were no bastion of reliability either.

 

[amirm]

But they happily delivered their rated power (and considerably more on the ones I tested) according to the 1974 amplifier rule FTC standards at the time. (160wpc, 20-20k, <0.05%- IMD <0.01%) No help needed. No excuses.

Yup. With no requirements for cooking at full power for 5 minutes as is mandated now.

As to those TO-3 transistors, you well know they could not wait to get rid of them and replaced with plastic, TO packages which much higher thermal impedance but cheaper cost. Cost cutting was alive and well then.