Post research here that casts doubt on ASR objectivism

[Leporello]

hour second

Thanks.

 

[Deleted member 31910]

They may well.be similar, I don't know because I've not seen measurements of the +

Well, maybe they measure wildly different but I find that a little hard to believe. At the stage I am at I don't know that there is a lot of ways for me to improve my sound for little or no cost outside of room treatment and EQ. I've been collecting and buying and selling gear for the last 10-15 years pretty seriously. I'm now at the point where I know I need to purchase new gear to make steady improvements and that is partly why I have come to this forum to learn about how to make better informed decisions on new gear.

I think for any younger, newer people to audio, the real way you save money is by buying used gear and learning how to service your gear and fix basic problems that arise such as cold solder joints, corrosion/oxidation, bad capacitors, faulty power switches, etc. and learning how to replace discrete components. I see a lot of people on here giving advice who probably have very little experience to listening to a lot of gear.. but I would like to learn what I can about measurements, room EQ, and DSP. Those are my next steps.

 

[Jimbob54]

Well, maybe they measure wildly different but I find that a little hard to believe. At the stage I am at I don't know that there is a lot of ways for me to improve my sound for little or no cost outside of room treatment and EQ. I've been collecting and buying and selling gear for the last 10-15 years pretty seriously. I'm now at the point where I know I need to purchase new gear to make steady improvements and that is partly why I have come to this forum to learn about how to make better informed decisions on new gear.

I think for any younger, newer people to audio, the real way you save money is by buying used gear and learning how to service your gear and fix basic problems that arise such as cold solder joints, corrosion/oxidation, bad capacitors, faulty power switches, etc. and learning how to replace discrete components. I see a lot of people on here giving advice who probably have very little experience to listening to a lot of gear.. but I would like to learn what I can about measurements, room EQ, and DSP. Those are my next steps.

Handily schiit measured it themselves https://www.schiit.com/public/upload/PDF/Schiit Preamp APx555 Standard Test Suite_ Freya Plus.pdf

 

[Deleted member 31910]

Handily schiit measured it themselves https://www.schiit.com/public/upload/PDF/Schiit Preamp APx555 Standard Test Suite_ Freya Plus.pdf

Yeah, I saw they posted measurements at the bottom of the page but I never bothered looking at them as they don't mean anything to me Can't understand them and I just use my ears

I will only buy new from places that offer a in home trial/return period.

 

[Thomas_A]

I enjoy my bluetooth radio in my greenhouse as I plant things. Doesn't mean it produces great sound.

You need to buy more IKEA stuff.

Spoiler: Eneby

 

[Blumlein 88]

Well, maybe they measure wildly different but I find that a little hard to believe. At the stage I am at I don't know that there is a lot of ways for me to improve my sound for little or no cost outside of room treatment and EQ. I've been collecting and buying and selling gear for the last 10-15 years pretty seriously. I'm now at the point where I know I need to purchase new gear to make steady improvements and that is partly why I have come to this forum to learn about how to make better informed decisions on new gear.

I think for any younger, newer people to audio, the real way you save money is by buying used gear and learning how to service your gear and fix basic problems that arise such as cold solder joints, corrosion/oxidation, bad capacitors, faulty power switches, etc. and learning how to replace discrete components. I see a lot of people on here giving advice who probably have very little experience to listening to a lot of gear.. but I would like to learn what I can about measurements, room EQ, and DSP. Those are my next steps.

So you are just going right down the list aren't you. You see a lot of people giving advice who probably have very little experience listening to a lot of gear. I'd say you are clueless. Lot of people on here giving advice have lots of experience, education, knowledge and understanding of lots of gear. You first tell us you don't know much tech stuff and then give advice about how young people should be doing things. Your advice is not only not useful, but pretty much unusable for most gear made the past 15 years. Discrete components.............good luck with that.

Gear other than speakers has improved so much really inexpensive gear is capable of performance not even possible not that long ago. That is where the bang for buck is if you understand how to put systems together. With a little help even speakers are capable of being good without being huge in cost.

You want some advice?......find/buy speakers you like or love and work backwards from there. You know where the best place in the world to find out about exemplary speaker performance exists? Right here on ASR with Amir and Erin and some other's measurements to narrow the field. Other than speakers, you can have fully transparent gear and there is then no steady improvement. Maybe you find that boring if you live for the thrill of new gear upping your enjoyment, but if you can wrap your mind around it, it can be very liberating.

 

[Deleted member 31910]

So you are just going right down the list aren't you. You see a lot of people giving advice who probably have very little experience listening to a lot of gear. I'd say you are clueless. Lot of people on here giving advice have lots of experience, education, knowledge and understanding of lots of gear. You first tell us you don't know much tech stuff and then give advice about how young people should be doing things. Your advice is not only not useful, but pretty much unusable for most gear made the past 15 years. Discrete components.............good luck with that.

Gear other than speakers has improved so much really inexpensive gear is capable of performance not even possible not that long ago. That is where the bang for buck is if you understand how to put systems together. With a little help even speakers are capable of being good without being huge in cost.

You want some advice?......find/buy speakers you like or love and work backwards from there. You know where the best place in the world to find out about exemplary speaker performance exists? Right here on ASR with Amir and Erin and some other's measurements to narrow the field. Other than speakers, you can have fully transparent gear and there is then no steady improvement. Maybe you find that boring if you live for the thrill of new gear upping your enjoyment, but if you can wrap your mind around it, it can be very liberating.

I never said there weren't intelligent people on this forum with lots of experience capable of educating others. I simply said I see a lot of people giving out advice who probably haven't listened to a lot of gear.

You think its difficult to find good quality gear used with discrete components? Not sure where you live but its plentiful in my area. They also make gear with discrete components new, it just costs a lot more.

Any monkey with a soldering iron can replace discrete components and shoot deoxit into a potentiometer. Most people who do any work with their hands can manage this kind of thing. Especially when you have the help of friendly communities online to assist in troubleshooting. I happen to enjoy working with my hands and fixing and servicing things, and yes, it adds to my enjoyment of the hobby.

Other than my DACs I don't own any gear made within the last 15 years that I can recall. Are you suggesting that my gear is rubbish? I'm clueless because I take a different approach? Maybe ASR should start measuring some vintage gear so we can see how it compares to the newer stuff that was not even possible that long ago.

I honestly don't think I've spent more than 5k on this hobby and I think you'd have quite a difficult time finding a pair of speakers for new under $5k that could beat Yamaha NS-1000s with the companion YST-SW1000 subwoofer.

Really don't understand the hostility toward recommending people shop used to save money and learning to service their gear.

 

[Mart68]

You've got some really good equipment IMO. That;'s not the issue. The issue is your philosophy. Better to start off with Descartes, not Carlos Castenada.

 

[Purité Audio]

I never said there weren't intelligent people on this forum with lots of experience capable of educating others. I simply said I see a lot of people giving out advice who probably haven't listened to a lot of gear.

You think its difficult to find good quality gear used with discrete components? Not sure where you live but its plentiful in my area. They also make gear with discrete components new, it just costs a lot more.

Any monkey with a soldering iron can replace discrete components and shoot deoxit into a potentiometer. Most people who do any work with their hands can manage this kind of thing. Especially when you have the help of friendly communities online to assist in troubleshooting. I happen to enjoy working with my hands and fixing and servicing things, and yes, it adds to my enjoyment of the hobby.

Other than my DACs I don't own any gear made within the last 15 years that I can recall. Are you suggesting that my gear is rubbish? I'm clueless because I take a different approach? Maybe ASR should start measuring some vintage gear so we can see how it compares to the newer stuff that was not even possible that long ago.

I honestly don't think I've spent more than 5k on this hobby and I think you'd have quite a difficult time finding a pair of speakers for new under $5k that could beat Yamaha NS-1000s with the companion YST-SW1000 subwoofer.

Really don't understand the hostility toward recommending people shop used to save money and learning to service their gear.

There is some terrific vintage hear, amplifiers, turntables, the Yamahas were class leaders in their time, I have some old Meridian loudspeakers and they are not that different to the very latest designs, as long as replacement parts can still be sourced.
Keith

 

[Deleted member 31910]

There is some terrific vintage hear, amplifiers, turntables, the Yamahas were class leaders in their time, I have some old Meridian loudspeakers and they are not that different to the very latest designs, as long as replacement parts can still be sourced.
Keith

Definitely. I have some GNP 220 speakers that are precursors to the Wilson Watt speakers. Yamaha pioneered the beryllium dome drivers that are used in some high end speakers today such as Focal.

 

[JSmith]

You are still believing one thing or the other.

I know what you're getting at, but it is a bit askew. Measurements are just that, factual measurements of that particular item... they do not require any belief. What you may be suggesting though is people that don't understand the measurements just believe what others may infer from those measurements.



JSmith

 

[AdamG]

Trolling Posts removed and poster graciously given an all expenses paid Thread reply Vacation. This thread is not a general discussion about reality and philosophy of reality.

As a friendly reminder this thread is about: ”Post research here that casts doubt on ASR objectivism”.

 

[SIY]

Didn't have you down as a magnetic fields fan.

Well, I despised the Peter Gabriel cover of this song, so does that count?

 

[Pennyless Audiophile]

Has anyone spotted a single reply that complies with the OP’s request, so far?

Excluding sarcasm and higher forms of humour?

This might loosely qualify, maybe.
https://www.researchgate.net/public...f_High_Resolution_Audio_Perceptual_Evaluation

 

[Pennyless Audiophile]

Sorry, I can't help myself. One quick response and I am out.

If you want to talk about Kantian transcendentalism, Cavellian Skepticism, or even general epistemology, I am sure there are many here that can school you on that too. But as you have done nothing to show that you have even a modicum of understanding about what you are talking about, that seems like a miserable proposition.

A rude reply like this is exactly what we do not need. People is here because they don't understand the approach but they are curious. Keeping telling them that they are idiots and should get out of your way will bring nothing.
They will all have the same questions and the same objections, more or less, so we should give them he same answers in a coherent manner. Sorry for repeating myself but a "Start here" section where new members can be forwarded would do a great good. I am not knowledgeable enough to write it but I am happy to support how I can whomever would like to pick up the task.

In an Italian military forum, many years ago now, we had the same problems with the boys coming to the forum from video games. I wrote an "Air Warfare 101" post and we started referring clearly green users to it. The number of "silly posts" (no offense, it is just an expression...) was drastically reduced.

 

[Jimbob54]

Well, I despised the Peter Gabriel cover of this song, so does that count?

Absolutely!

 

[USER]

A rude reply like this is exactly what we do not need. People is here because they don't understand the approach but they are curious. Keeping telling them that they are idiots and should get out of your way will bring nothing.
They will all have the same questions and the same objections, more or less, so we should give them he same answers in a coherent manner. Sorry for repeating myself but a "Start here" section where new members can be forwarded would do a great good. I am not knowledgeable enough to write it but I am happy to support how I can whomever would like to pick up the task.

In an Italian military forum, many years ago now, we had the same problems with the boys coming to the forum from video games. I wrote an "Air Warfare 101" post and we started referring clearly green users to it. The number of "silly posts" (no offense, it is just an expression...) was drastically reduced.

What people don't need is to wade through 10+ pages of this type of messy nonsense. He himself admitted numerous times as to not knowing what he is talking about. That is NOT posting in good faith and is precisely what we try to avoid here. How much patience and thoughtful and informative responses did he get and not bother to consider? Indeed he was kicked out of the thread for his endless, lazy rebuttals that did nothing to really engage with the point of the thread. That's the beyond generous view. The other is that he was trolling. He would have received a similar response in a philosophical message board as well. You absolutely need some attempt at rigor to talk philosophy. You don't have to be a genius or have read everything but you need to engage in good faith and with the millennia of discourse out there. Science and philosophy were considered the same thing (were under the same umbrella) a couple of hundred years ago, after all. They share a lot of values.

 

[AdamG]

What people don't need is to wade through 10+ pages of this type of messy nonsense. He himself admitted numerous times as to not knowing what he is talking about. That is NOT posting in good faith and is precisely what we try to avoid here. How much more patience and thoughtful and informative responses did he get and not bother to consider? Indeed he was kicked out of the thread for his endless, lazy rebuttals that did nothing to really engage with the point of the thread. That's the beyond generous view. The other is that he was trolling. He would have received a similar response in a philosophical message board as well. You absolutely need some attempt at rigor to talk philosophy. You don't have to be a genius or have read everything but you need to engage in good faith and with the millennia of discourse out there.

We are on it and soon now the problem will be resolved.

 

[Raindog123]

I am on it and soon now the problem will be resolved

You’ve discovered how to change people’s attitude? What is it - hypnosis, shock therapy, hard labor, ..?

 

[AdamG]

You’ve discovered how to change people’s attitude? What is it - hypnosis, shock therapy, hard labor, ..?

Did I send a mixed message?