PMC fenestria, new Flagship speaker for the consumer market

[TitaniumTroy]

http://www.audioxpress.com/news/pmc...-2018-with-new-fenestria-flagship-loudspeaker
https://pmc-speakers.com/products/consumer/fact/fenestria

I like speakers that use out of the box thinking, but with some science to back it up. Will probably need some big mono blocks to power these with a sensitivity of 86db. Hope they bring a pair to AXPONA 2019, as the closet dealer to me is in Irvine CA.

"A three-way, ultra-high-resolution passive twin Advanced Transmission Line (ATL) loudspeaker, fenestria incorporates all-new, tailor-made drivers, twin Laminair vents for improved aerodynamic ATL airflow, plus a newly designed cabinet that houses the treble and mid-range units in an innovative and elegant reflection-free module. The result is at once aesthetically beautiful and highly engineered.

According to PMC, much of fenestria’s five-year design process has focussed on removing the unwanted distortion and coloration introduced by the loudspeaker itself, so that the listener hears nothing but music. For this reason, PMC refer to it as “the loudspeaker you’ll never hear.”

“fenestria is the perfect example of our holistic design approach,” explains Peter Thomas, PMC’s owner and chief designer. “Our aim was to make the best passive loudspeaker we could, with an open mind when it came to technologies and materials. We looked at all options to achieve the purest, most transparent sound, and fenestria was the result.”

 

[Dialectic]

Sadly, they are passive.

They are also hideous. If I brought home a pair of Fenestrias, my wife would defenestrate me.

 

[garbulky]

"According to PMC, much of fenestria’s five-year design process has focussed on removing the unwanted distortion and coloration introduced by the loudspeaker itself, so that the listener hears nothing but music. "
So that's what speakers have been doing wrong this whole time! Who knew?!

 

[Cosmik]

So what do the holes in the front do? Are they bass reflex ports, or so-called 'transmission lines'? Whatever, Mr. John Watkinson would not be impressed.

...we have to recognise that material and technology restrictions that led to the adoption of resonant techniques no longer apply and that it is only tradition that sustains their use.
GETTING GOOD BASS:
• Realistic loudspeaker reproduction requires reproduction of the input waveform.
• To prevent audible phase distortion, loudspeakers must be phase linear from their lowest frequency up to at least a few kilohertz
• Use sealed enclosures: no port – no hangover.
AVOID THE FOLLOWING:
• Reflex, bandpass, ABR and transmission line speakers that cannot reproduce the input waveform and which cause serious phase distortion audible as poor LF resolution and hangover.
• Passive moving coil loudspeakers driven from general-purpose audio amplifiers that cannot be phase linear.
REMEMBER:
• Tradition is an easy alternative to thinking what to do.
• The difference between many of today’s loudspeaker designers and those of 50 years ago is that back then designers understood the basics but didn’t have access to advanced materials, whereas today it is the other way round.

 

[Sal1950]

They are also hideous. If I brought home a pair of Fenestrias, my wife would defenestrate me.

I guess beauty is in the eye and all that, I thought they looked pretty cool. Besides that's what a "man cave" is for, at least one place where the ole lady doesn't have a say in anything.
Now hideously expensive, yes. Just what the world doesn't need, another $65,000 dollar fart box.

 

[sergeauckland]

So what do the holes in the front do? Are they bass reflex ports, or so-called 'transmission lines'? Whatever, Mr. John Watkinson would not be impressed.

A real transmission line absorbs ALL the energy from the back of the driver, so theoretically, doesn't need vents except to equalise air pressure. However, a practical transmission line still leaves some small amount of energy at the lowest frequencies, so needs to vent that. The main difference between a bass reflex vent and a transmission line vent is that the BR is tuned, and involves a resonance and hence energy storage, whereas a TL doesn't. A so-called quarter-wave TL isn't a true TL, but my understanding of PMC's larger 'speakers is that they are pretty true TLs down to very low frequencies. I don't know about these new 'speakers, TLs are pretty big for domestic applications, so not many do it that way. Looking at the link in the OP, they don't look big enough to be true TLs.

S

 

[Soniclife]

Their standard description Advanced Transmission Line. As I understand it they are neither ports or TL, but a sort of mix.
The speakers of theirs I have heard always seem to have lean bass, and often a treble peak, they really push detail and can sound impressive on the right track, but on the wrong track they are horrible.

 

[sergeauckland]

Back in the '70s, Dr Arthur Bailey published a set of articles in Wireless World on Transmission Lines, which were commercialised by Radford. They claimed that all the LF energy was absorbed by the line, and it didn't make any significant difference if the line was open or closed. The articles made a strong point that the stuffing in the line was critical, too much and too close to the driver resulted in back-pressure and hence coloration, whilst not enough stuffing didn't absorb enough, so left the vent outputting too much, and also causing coloration.
They were BIG! Not surprised they don't have much of a following these days for domestic loudspeakers.

S.

 

[Thomas savage]

Not the way forward but it’s the customer that’s keeping these companies in yesteryear.

 

[Apesbrain]

I guessed $30k and was way off!

My favorite TL speaker will always be the Fried Studio IV.

 

[Sal1950]

Not the way forward but it’s the customer that’s keeping these companies in yesteryear.

Seems all it takes is the ability to write a good cover story on how the designer has once again reinvented the wheel with revolutionary thinking. There's a good sized market of audiophools with more money than sense and you know what P. T. Barnum used to say.

 

[sergeauckland]

Not the way forward but it’s the customer that’s keeping these companies in yesteryear.

I agree. Passive loudspeakers are just so much less then optimum, yet audiophiles are so reluctant to abandon their carefully chosen (sighted) amplifiers and cables for something properly integrated.

S.

 

[Thomas savage]

I agree. Passive loudspeakers are just so much less then optimum, yet audiophiles are so reluctant to abandon their carefully chosen (sighted) amplifiers and cables for something properly integrated.

S.

Still true for high high end ( price wise lol) but the rest of the market seems to be opening up to the more integrated solutions.

There’s hope on the horizon.

 

[Sal1950]

I agree. Passive loudspeakers are just so much less then optimum, yet audiophiles are so reluctant to abandon their carefully chosen (sighted) amplifiers and cables for something properly integrated.

S.

Agreed but once you take all that stuff away what will be left to call it a hobby and play with any more? If the day should come where the majority of audiophiles could finally be convinced that bits is bits if the stream coming off his (PC, server, CD player, etc) is bit perfect, and just plug that into a active, dsp'd, box and all is done? The print and web media might just as well close it up and go home, put a fork in it guys, they're done.
We here mostly know that bits is bits, the decent electronics have been transparent for decades, and whither active or passive the transducer end is all that matters any more.
But who wants to hear that, it sure as hell ain't any good for commerce or the HiFi community in general.

 

[sergeauckland]

Agreed but once you take all that stuff away what will be left to call it a hobby and play with any more? If the day should come where the majority of audiophiles could finally be convinced that bits is bits if the stream coming off his (PC, server, CD player, etc) is bit perfect, and just plug that into a active, dsp'd, box and all is done? The print and web media might just as well close it up and go home, put a fork in it guys, they're done.
We here mostly know that bits is bits, the decent electronics have been transparent for decades, and whither active or passive the transducer end is all that matters any more.
But who wants to hear that, it sure as hell ain't any good for commerce or the HiFi community in general.

I'm not sure I want to be part of a community that relies on the continuance of a myth for its survival. I got into audio in the late 1960s, when there was still a lot of engineering to be done. Now, it's all pretty much marketing and Emperor's New Clothes so very little to interest me.
S

 

[Sal1950]

I'm not sure I want to be part of a community that relies on the continuance of a myth for its survival.

I wasn't promoting the twisted situation, just stating the facts.

 

[TitaniumTroy]

Interesting 91views at the other forum, you know the one where Amir is, "he who's name shall not be mentioned". 91 views their and no reply's. Here 270 views and 15 responses, you think the no responses at the other forum is because PMC is not a typical audiophile speaker?

 

[freddi]

4 toy size woofers + short t-line + big price = "not impressed" - I doubt if Danley's speaker shown here costs that much https://www.danleysoundlabs.com/products/loud-speakers/synergy-horn/sh69/

$1000 and woodworking skills should build a competent 2- channel horn system. John Inlow has straight midbass plans (for sale). If young, I'd be
happy with the old University Classic basshorn (but probably something other than its "Cobraflex: midhorn.

For the direct radiator fan with less spl requirements,, I've heard that the little Morel based "Solstice" speaker is pretty good

https://imgur.com/8Yfar8Y

 

[Wombat]

4 toy size woofers + short t-line + big price = "not impressed" - I doubt if Danley's speaker shown here costs that much https://www.danleysoundlabs.com/products/loud-speakers/synergy-horn/sh69/

$1000 and woodworking skills should build a competent 2- channel horn system. John Inlow has straight midbass plans (for sale). If young, I'd be
happy with the old University Classic basshorn (but probably something other than its "Cobraflex: midhorn.

For the direct radiator fan with less spl requirements,, I've heard that the little Morel based "Solstice" speaker is pretty good

https://imgur.com/8Yfar8Y

Danley prices, July 2015: https://ccsnewengland.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Danley-Sound-Labs-MSRP-Price-List.pdf

 

[freddi]

thank - although a "lot of money" those seem fair considering driver and xover parts cost

here's one of TD's earliest Unity on top of one of my Karlson couplers - it would normally sport
a slotted pipe tweeter right above the woofer - that pipe works well on top too.

https://imgur.com/4CJY0SA

https://imgur.com/kMwSfs1