Pioneer VSX-LX505 AVR Review

[DavidMcRoy]

I am not smart enough, or educated enough to understand the implications of this 20W limit governor. Does this, simply speaking, refer only to situations where there is a sustained demand for over 20 watts continuously for more than a specified time? I ask because the perceived sound (by me, that is) seems somewhat constricted playing back recordings that have a lot of dynamics. By "constricted" I mean where there are strong attacks (such as a brass ensemble in a jazz recording), the audio seems to choke at the initial peak of the attack, vs. an external power amp with better headroom. My understanding is that, in general, the demand on an amplifier is primarily taxed by its ability to respond to and reproduce the (often frequent) intermittent dynamics. Perhaps this is an entirely separate issue and what is being discussed is more related to test conditions with artificial signals (sine wave sweeps, pink noise, and the like). Sorry if I am confused.

I can imagine a program like, "If Conditions A, B and C are met, then Event X happens. But if Condition D is also present, nothing will happen," that sort of thing.

 

[dlaloum]

If you read the FTC requirement for measuring rated power it states that it is to be read after 5 minutes of continuous running at that power.

Pioneer’s website lists the FTC power rating:
120 W/ch 8 ohms, 20 Hz-20 kHz, THD 0.08 %, 2ch Driven FTC

This AVR cannot run at anywhere near its rated power for more than 35 seconds.

Martin

From the Onkyo RZ50 Review:

Clearly there is some monitoring going on internally causing the amplifier to go into ECO/power limiting mode. With 8 ohm load, I didn't see this problem:

@amirm - given the two AVR's have identical power amp boards with presumably identical nanny circuits - there is a substantial cognitive dissonance in showing the RZ50 as not having any trouble passing the 8ohm test, and the LX505 flunking out.

In fact the 8ohm LX505 test looks like the RZ50 4 ohm test:

Given this problem I could not run my max and peak power. But did run my frequency sweeps post a power cable removal:

It seems to me that either this LX505 sample is faulty/flawed in some way, or, there may have been a mixup in testing, and it was in fact setup for 4ohm?

I agree with others that if the 8ohm test hits power limiting at 20W to 40W after 35s, then there is a serious problem.

Skimming through it, I assumed that graph was a mislabelled 4ohm graph as it matches what I expect from this family of AVR's on 4 ohm continuous - but if it really is, as labelled, an 8ohm test - then I retract much of what I said... something is definitely wrong.

 

[valerianf]

"It seems to me that either this LX505 sample is faulty/flawed in some way"
It is the protection design that is completely flawed.
Usually protection thresholds are not very accurate: +/- 10% or may be 20%.
On the Onkyo tested by Amir the protection is only triggered for a 4 ohms load but the Pioneer protection is triggered even on 8 ohms load.
It is a bad design.

 

[buz]

I can confirm that the ciuser interface works on pioneer, too.

 

[ArturoKiwi]

I can confirm that the ciuser interface works on pioneer, too.

And??? COuld you find something usefull in the hidden menu?

 

[dlaloum]

"It seems to me that either this LX505 sample is faulty/flawed in some way"
It is the protection design that is completely flawed.
Usually protection thresholds are not very accurate: +/- 10% or may be 20%.
On the Onkyo tested by Amir the protection is only triggered for a 4 ohms load but the Pioneer protection is triggered even on 8 ohms load.
It is a bad design.

From past experience with Onkyo/Integra/Pioneer, it is highly likely that the circuit boards are identical - and we also know that much of the firmware is identical too.

Identical circuit boards that provide differing test results indicate a likely fault.

The Pioneer should not be going into protection mode on a continuous 8ohm test.

 

[isolar8001]

From past experience with Onkyo/Integra/Pioneer, it is highly likely that the circuit boards are identical - and we also know that much of the firmware is identical too.

Identical circuit boards that provide differing test results indicate a likely fault.

The Pioneer should not be going into protection mode on a continuous 8ohm test.

The firmwares are identical...I looked at both of them.

 

[isolar8001]

For those that want a nice review of a Pioneer that's not obviously defective......

Pioneer Elite VSX-LX305 9.1 Channel AV Receiver with 8K video - Full Review!

The Review When I was first asked if I would like to review the new-ish (released in 2021) Pioneer VSX-LX305 Elite AV receiver, I did somewhat of a double-take. Hmmm… I mused; Pioneer was not a brand I had heard much about lately. But, having owned Pioneer products in the past (i.e., the Pioneer...

www.avnirvana.com

 

[Martin]

For those that want a nice review of a Pioneer that's not obviously defective......

Pioneer Elite VSX-LX305 9.1 Channel AV Receiver with 8K video - Full Review!

The Review When I was first asked if I would like to review the new-ish (released in 2021) Pioneer VSX-LX305 Elite AV receiver, I did somewhat of a double-take. Hmmm… I mused; Pioneer was not a brand I had heard much about lately. But, having owned Pioneer products in the past (i.e., the Pioneer...

www.avnirvana.com

Where are the measurements in that “review”?

 

[Deleted member 19122]

The measurements are what they are But in real world use there is not one report of these avrs shutting down in the year plus they've been on the market.Zero in any of the online forums.I've cranked mine to reference volume a few times on classical multichannel music and it has never shut down.Sure at those volumes the amps start to give out That typical saggy bottom/harsh highs of all middling avrs pushed too hard.But at those volumes and according room sizes you are more than likely running separate power amps anyway.Look at it this way,is there a cheaper pre with 98 sinad and Dirac if you go separates? Considering these are available for 900 or so in the EU,it's a steal

 

[JSmith]

a nice review of a Pioneer

JSmith

 

[ArturoKiwi]

The measurements are what they are But in real world use there is not one report of these avrs shutting down in the year plus they've been on the market.Zero in any of the online forums.I've cranked mine to reference volume a few times on classical multichannel music and it has never shut down.Sure at those volumes the amps start to give out That typical saggy bottom/harsh highs of all middling avrs pushed too hard.But at those volumes and according room sizes you are more than likely running separate power amps anyway.Look at it this way,is there a cheaper pre with 98 sinad and Dirac if you go separates? Considering these are available for 900 or so in the EU,it's a steal

I can find it only at 1600/1700€

 

[damirj79]

1299€

https://www.idealo.de/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/202211873_-vsx-lx505-schwarz-pioneer.html

Vsx-lx305 is 999€.

 

[stupidvillager]

So when these go into protection, is there a way to tell? A click, they shut down...or do they just keep going just at a lower output. This is the main reason I went with a Cinema 50. I am not an audiophile by any means. More of just a hobbyist. Mine is used mainly for home theater and I don't have any external amplification. So the amp section is what I cared about. But I was going back and forth between this Pioneer/Onkyo and the Marantz, but I felt the Marantz amp section was better.

 

[ArturoKiwi]

1299€

https://www.idealo.de/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/202211873_-vsx-lx505-schwarz-pioneer.html

Vsx-lx305 is 999€.

Did try to put it in the chart in the two shops?
You can't buy it there. Only on eBay

 

[Ageve]

The measurements are what they are But in real world use there is not one report of these avrs shutting down in the year plus they've been on the market.Zero in any of the online forums.I've cranked mine to reference volume a few times on classical multichannel music and it has never shut down.Sure at those volumes the amps start to give out That typical saggy bottom/harsh highs of all middling avrs pushed too hard.

Why would there be reports of it shutting down? The power is limited. It still works...

"Harsh highs" = distortion, caused by clipping?

 

[damirj79]

Did try to put it in the chart in the two shops?
You can't buy it there. Only on eBay

What is wrong with ebay? Even if delivery is only on germany, you can use some mailbox forwarding service like mailboxde

 

[ArturoKiwi]

What is wrong with ebay? Even if delivery is only on germany, you can use some mailbox forwarding service like mailboxde

Usually it means that it is imported and in EU the warranty service is very strict.
If I have a problem with a gear that is imported (they know from the serial number), they refuse to repair it. Stop. No other options

 

[damirj79]

Not necessarly. Pioneer for EU markets is easily distinguished by DAB option which USA (specifically this market because it is a lot cheaper there) model does not have.

 

[AndreaT]

If you read the FTC requirement for measuring rated power it states that it is to be read after 5 minutes of continuous running at that power.

Pioneer’s website lists the FTC power rating:
120 W/ch 8 ohms, 20 Hz-20 kHz, THD 0.08 %, 2ch Driven FTC

This AVR cannot run at anywhere near its rated power for more than 35 seconds.

Martin

The more I think about this characteristic of the AVR, the more I think it is a scam. How convenient for the manufacturer to down size cooling fins, power supply, and whatever else to save on metal and wires and sell the unit as a 120 W/ch. Honest specs should specify 20 W/ch, as even modestly higher outputs for less than 1 minute (42 W per Amir test) put the unit in a limp mode until restarted.

It is one great benefit of ASR to assess equipment and show to us how unscrupulous companies sell much inflated specs to the consumer.

In the end, I will avoid purchasing any electronic equipment made by Pioneer from now on.

Finally, please consider how many other amplifiers are made to specs: many of these sell for less, much less, that this horrible AVR.