Pioneer VSX-LX505 AVR Review

[fadetoblackbs]

I am really pissed off that we will not get DLBC on the 505.

This is what the Dirac support wrote to me today:
„We’d be pleased to sell Bass Control licenses to owners of the Pioneer VSX LX 505 but it doesn’t support Dirac Bass Control… sorry!“

So it looks it is a hardware related topic. Or Pioneer simply does not release the 505 for the update. I wonder why. So probably we can forget about DLBC in the 505. So frustated I did not buy the RZ50…

 

[EWL5]

I am really pissed off that we will not get DLBC on the 505.

This is what the Dirac support wrote to me today:
„We’d be pleased to sell Bass Control licenses to owners of the Pioneer VSX LX 505 but it doesn’t support Dirac Bass Control… sorry!“

So it looks it is a hardware related topic. Or Pioneer simply does not release the 505 for the update. I wonder why. So probably we can forget about DLBC in the 505. So frustated I did not buy the RZ50…

It’s not hardware related as the 505 is an RZ50 clone. Pioneer pulled its license from the PAC group in 2024.

Vox International Up For Sale, As Consumer Sales Plunge, Pioneer Brand Dropped – channelnews

www.channelnews.com.au

 

[fadetoblackbs]

Thanks for answering.

I dont understand the reason why they dont allow Pioneer customers to buy a Dirac DLBC license anyway.

If Pioneer is part of PAC or not makes no difference - if Pioneer and Dirac make an agreement it should be possible for us customers to buy the license right?

It’s not hardware related as the 505 is an RZ50 clone. Pioneer pulled its license from the PAC group in 2024.

Vox International Up For Sale, As Consumer Sales Plunge, Pioneer Brand Dropped – channelnews

www.channelnews.com.au

 

[Power Pop 23]

It is my speculation, PAC decided sales of Pioneer or Elite branded electronics did not justify further investment and PAC decided to not renew their license with Pioneer and instead concentrate on the Onkyo and Integra brands. I guess Pioneer could directly license with Dirac. That would involve getting back into the AVR business instead of licensing the brand. I think Pioneer is now focused on electronics for vehicles.

 

[fadetoblackbs]

It is my speculation, PAC decided sales of Pioneer or Elite branded electronics did not justify further investment and PAC decided to not renew their license with Pioneer and instead concentrate on the Onkyo and Integra brands. I guess Pioneer could directly license with Dirac. That would involve getting back into the AVR business instead of licensing the brand. I think Pioneer is now focused on electronics for vehicles.

Thanks for your valuable Feedback

 

[EWL5]

Thanks for answering.

I dont understand the reason why they dont allow Pioneer customers to buy a Dirac DLBC license anyway.

If Pioneer is part of PAC or not makes no difference - if Pioneer and Dirac make an agreement it should be possible for us customers to buy the license right?

It does make a difference. Pioneer's focus is on something else (as Power Pop 23 suggested) and probably has no direct relationship w/Dirac.

Gentex recently acquired Voxx (PAC) but there are no press releases where Pioneer is even mentioned so the PAC relationship is probably severed for good!

 

[tbob22]

It’s not hardware related as the 505 is an RZ50 clone. Pioneer pulled its license from the PAC group in 2024.

Vox International Up For Sale, As Consumer Sales Plunge, Pioneer Brand Dropped – channelnews

www.channelnews.com.au

It may be related to the shared crossover setup. DLBC is available on the LX805 which has individual crossovers for each channel like the Onkyo models.

 

[EWL5]

It may be related to the shared crossover setup. DLBC is available on the LX805 which has individual crossovers for each channel like the Onkyo models.

Not an issue. Most mass market Japanese AVRs have gotten Dirac Live Bass Management (DLBM) over the last 3-13 months. Individual crossovers can be set per speaker group using DLBM that is included w/the base DL license (don't need to pay for DLBC) and that will supersede any deficiency in the AVR bass management via the exported filter (software over hardware).

 

[tbob22]

Not an issue. Most mass market Japanese AVRs have gotten Dirac Live Bass Management (DLBM) over the last 3-13 months. Individual crossovers can be set per speaker group using DLBM that is included w/the base DL license (don't need to pay for DLBC) and that will supersede any deficiency in the AVR bass management via the exported filter (software over hardware).

I don't know if the LX505 has Dirac Live Bass Management either. My Onkyo NR7100 certainly doesn't but the RZ70 and LX805 do have bass management. I helped a buddy set up an LX805 and was surprised it had more features compared to my NR7100 including Bass Management which sets the crossovers automatically (NR7100 requires manual crossover setting).

 

[EWL5]

I don't know if the LX505 has Dirac Live Bass Management either. My Onkyo NR7100 certainly doesn't but the RZ70 and LX805 do have bass management. I helped a buddy set up an LX805 and was surprised it had more features compared to my NR7100 including Bass Management which sets the crossovers automatically (NR7100 requires manual crossover setting).

As previously speculated by me and others, the 505 doesn't have DLBM because Pioneer is no longer part of PAC (why pay Dirac when the Pioneer license is gone?)! The RZ50 and DRX 5.4 clone got it because they are still part of PAC (both AVRs got DLBM on the same day towards the end of last October)!

There's no question in my mind that this is not a hardware issue!

The 7100 and DRX 3.4 didn't get DLBM/DLBC probably for product segmentation to make the RZ series more premium (as for the 305, see the above concerning Pioneer).

 

[tbob22]

As previously speculated by me and others, the 505 doesn't have DLBM because Pioneer is no longer part of PAC (why pay Dirac when the Pioneer license is gone?)! The RZ50 and DRX 5.4 clone got it because they are still part of PAC!

There's no question in my mind that this is not a hardware issue!

Just saying the DLBC may rely on individual crossovers to integrate the speakers with the subs which the 505 does not offer as far as I'm aware so you're stuck with a single crossover point for all speakers (say 80hz or whatever).

Someone could test with Dirac but I'd guess it's like my NR7100 and does not support DLBM either.

I'm not saying it isn't because of the license but we do not know for sure and Pioneer responded saying the hardware will not support it and one of the big differences is the individual vs global crossovers when compared to the RZ50.

The NR7100, LX305, and DRX-3.4 should also support DLBC as the hardware is very similar to the RZ50 and DRX-5.4 but none of them do either.

 

[EWL5]

I'm not saying it isn't because of the license but we do not know for sure and Pioneer responded saying the hardware will not support it and one of the big differences is the individual vs global crossovers when compared to the RZ50.

Re-read the quote below from Dirac:

This is what the Dirac support wrote to me today:
„We’d be pleased to sell Bass Control licenses to owners of the Pioneer VSX LX 505 but it doesn’t support Dirac Bass Control… sorry!“

Nowhere does it say or imply that it's a hardware issue (that was fadetoblackbs' assumption). The loss of the Pioneer license still makes Dirac's response true!
If I have misunderstood you, please link to an official Pioneer statement saying hardware doesn't support DLBM/DLBC on the 505!

 

[EWL5]

The NR7100, LX305, and DRX-3.4 should also support DLBC as the hardware is very similar to the RZ50 and DRX-5.4 but none of them do either.

I'm in agreement w/you that those AVRs probably have the hardware and can technically support DLBM/DLBC but have been nerfed to differentiate from the next tier up!

What's the proof? The newer RZ30 is a dead ringer for the 7100 and can do DLBM/DLBC. What's the difference? It's an RZ model!

 

[tbob22]

Re-read the quote below from Dirac:

Nowhere does it say or imply that it's a hardware issue (that was fadetoblackbs' assumption). The loss of the Pioneer license still makes Dirac's response true!
If I have misunderstood you, please link to an official Pioneer statement saying hardware doesn't support DLBM/DLBC on the 505!

Fair enough, I should have read that a bit closer.

Maybe there are additional fees for them to add/support the license for a specific unit. Could also be why the Onkyo NR7100, DRX 3.4, & LX305 are also missing it.

 

[tbob22]

I'm in agreement w/you that those AVRs probably have the hardware and can technically support DLBM/DLBC but have been nerfed to differentiate from the next tier up!

What's the proof? The newer RZ30 is a dead ringer for the 7100 and can do DLBM/DLBC. What's the difference? It's an RZ model!

Yeah, the RZ30 and DRX 3.4 seem very similar pre-out set up and all. The main difference being the RZ30 has two individual sub preouts. I wonder if it has the same power limiting as the RZ50 and clones do as well or if it's more like a cut down RZ70.

 

[EWL5]

Yeah, the RZ30 and DRX 3.4 seem very similar pre-out set up and all. The main difference being the RZ30 has two individual sub preouts. I wonder if it has the same power limiting as the RZ50 and clones do as well or if it's more like a cut down RZ70.

I was expecting the Integra version of the RZ30 to make its debut at CES but either I missed the news or there's really been no buzz!

More likely they are trying to get the firmware that enabled DLBM/DLBC on recent PAC AVRs fully cooked before debuting another new AVR!

 

[tbob22]

I was expecting the Integra version of the RZ30 to make its debut at CES but either I missed the news or there's really been no buzz!

More likely they are trying to get the firmware that enabled DLBM/DLBC on recent PAC AVRs fully cooked before debuting another new AVR!

Yeah, could be. Working with the LX805 was a pleasure. A serious piece of kit for sure and he grabbed it at $1499. Even with the concerns about the future of Pioneer I think if it goes on sale again it will be difficult for me to not consider upgrading at that price.

 

[fadetoblackbs]

So if there are no hardware restrictions on the 505 for DLBC, it is up to Pioneer if they want to offer the customers the option to be able to buy the Dirac license. Even if they are out of the PAC group, it is in their hands.
Dirac would agree as they can have profit with the additional license. Pioneer could make their model 505 more competitive to the RZ50 as they are no longer in the same group and maybe increase sales. Nobody would buy a 505 today if people know that the RZ50 hardware clone has better Software Features.
Here in Europe you can get the 505 for 899€… with DLBC threy could increase the price and improve sales performance.
The RZ50 costs almost 1300€…

 

[Power Pop 23]

So if there are no hardware restrictions on the 505 for DLBC, it is up to Pioneer if they want to offer the customers the option to be able to buy the Dirac license. Even if they are out of the PAC group, it is in their hands.
Dirac would agree as they can have profit with the additional license. Pioneer could make their model 505 more competitive to the RZ50 as they are no longer in the same group and maybe increase sales. Nobody would buy a 505 today if people know that the RZ50 hardware clone has better Software Features.
Here in Europe you can get the 505 for 899€… with DLBC threy could increase the price and improve sales performance.
The RZ50 costs almost 1300€…

Pioneer sold their Home A/V business to Onkyo in September 2014. As an owner of a '505' too, I do not consider myself a customer of Pioneer, but rather a customer of PAC. If you want access to DLBC and greater, consider selling your '505' to raise money for another AVR.

Pioneer Sells Home AV Business to Onkyo - HomeTheaterReview

Reuters reported late last week that Pioneer Corp. is selling its home AV business to Onkyo Corp., that Pioneer will take a 14.95 percent stake in Onkyo, and that both brands will remain intact. Here is that brief report: From...

hometheaterreview.com

 

[EWL5]

So if there are no hardware restrictions on the 505 for DLBC, it is up to Pioneer if they want to offer the customers the option to be able to buy the Dirac license. Even if they are out of the PAC group, it is in their hands.
Dirac would agree as they can have profit with the additional license. Pioneer could make their model 505 more competitive to the RZ50 as they are no longer in the same group and maybe increase sales. Nobody would buy a 505 today if people know that the RZ50 hardware clone has better Software Features.
Here in Europe you can get the 505 for 899€… with DLBC threy could increase the price and improve sales performance.
The RZ50 costs almost 1300€…

Pioneer has no interest in coming back to the AVR world. If you need further proof of that, I have a Pioneer Elite plasma tv sitting in the attic!