Pioneer PD-D9 Review (CD/SACD Player)

[NTTY]

That's too bad—Ebay lists 40 from $20 to $85.

Postage to Switzerland would be high for the few I saw accepting to send, from 40 to 80$, and I need to add customs process and taxes on top, so that kills it.
These two versions seem to be only available in US or UK, maybe there’s the same for Europe under a different product code/name?

 

[motoret]

What a joy to read this review and watch the graphs from your measurements. Thank you so much @NTTY.
I owned this player since 2008, and has now been inside a box for some years. I always assumed Legato sounded better since it was recommended (and also the default setting) by the manufacturer and even by some hifi magazines..... Now I can understand better what this filter does, and makes me want to try the "OFF" setting which I actually never did. My ears were always very pleased with its SACD performance, which I always thought it was mind blowing on this player.

 

[Roland68]

Chunky cd players and transports look cool. Great review.

Compared to my gold-colored Sony DVP-S9000ES and Teac VRDS-25, the PD-D9 looks like sleek understatement .

 

[Roland68]

It's funny, despite having enjoyed stereo reproduction since the late 70s, I actually find stereo reproduction of music very uninvolving. I much prefer some multichannel presentation even if it is less realistic. The immersive soundfield is just so much more enjoyable.

I listen to multichannel stereo (more than two channels) classical and jazz recordings, where available, and the faithfulness to live sound is much better than the plain 2.0 stereo versions of the same programs.

And I share @OsoSolitario's bewilderment about the fact that most of the higher end SA-CD players were 2.0 only.

But there have been some manufacturers that have done their homework to support multichannel SA-CD in the past: Philips (the first Philips SA-CD player was a multichannel DVD-V/SA-CD player: the SACD-1000), Sony (with the glorious SCD-XA777ES and SCD-XA9000ES and the little brothers SCD-XA333ES and SCD-XA3000ES as well as the following SCD-XA1200ES and more humble players), Marantz (SA-12S1, SA8260) and some smaller boutique manufacturers that deserved to be praised for that: Linn (Akurate CD) and Esoteric (SA-60). Unfortunately, none of these manufacturers has persisted in its effort, Sony being the longest supporter of multichannel audio-only SA-CD players.

The backward-looking nature of most of the Hi-fi sellers and reviewers is undoubtedly responsible for this state of affairs.

The market was not demanding, obviously. Maybe some studios were reluctant to master with 6 channels and not being paid 3 times more?

I guess more than resellers, audiophiles disregarded multichannel as low value devices and probably did not trust that quality could be found in masters. I don’t know.

I think more than two speakers is way too intrusive so I never went multichannel.

To me an SACD player is the opportunity to test a good CD player

And for those wanting a perfect SACD multichannel player, there is the OPPO BDP-95

The SACD manufacturers, especially Philips and Sony, did their homework back then, but they were wrong, but not in the way you might think.
Multichannel audio is an absolute niche in the hi-fi market, significantly smaller in 2000 than it is today. Especially since high-resolution digital data transmission via HDMI wasn't possible until a few years later.
In addition to the relatively limited selection of multichannel SACDs, the sometimes not-so-great mastering was a drawback. Another factor was the relatively high entry price for a complete system at the time.

Multichannel audio's share of the hi-fi market is so small that it's not even included in most statistics. The original predictions for multichannel audio have, in reality, fallen far short of expectations and forecasts. At the beginning, there were even opinions that said retailers would hardly sell stereo in the foreseeable future.

Retailers are certainly not to blame for this. The dealers who had embraced multi-channel technology at the time, set up demonstration rooms, and purchased large quantities suffered almost all of them. Just as quickly as sales initially soared, they plummeted again.

Given these circumstances, the number of SACD players with analog and HDMI outputs is very large, but 98-99% of these devices are used exclusively for stereo anyway.

 

[A Surfer]

Sometimes you have to create the market not follow it.

 

[SigmaR1]

Taking into account that:

1- In a multi-channel hi-fi system, 3 to 5 speakers will deliver the same power as 2 speakers in conventional stereo systems.
2- the advances made over the last 20 years that have led to the advent of small, low distorsion speakers

Installing a multi-channel hi-fi system is much less intrusive than it was 20 or 30 years ago. The realism produced by a multi-channel system is incomparable to what can be achieved with only two speakers. This is something I could observe at home or in the B. Neveu's studio (BNL/Syrius recordings) with stereo 6.0 recordings diffused via 2, 4 or 6 channels.

 

[NTTY]

What a joy to read this review and watch the graphs from your measurements. Thank you so much @NTTY.
I owned this player since 2008, and has now been inside a box for some years. I always assumed Legato sounded better since it was recommended (and also the default setting) by the manufacturer and even by some hifi magazines..... Now I can understand better what this filter does, and makes me want to try the "OFF" setting which I actually never did. My ears were always very pleased with its SACD performance, which I always thought it was mind blowing on this player.

Thanks! And get it out of its box

 

[Matias]

Wow, the depth of this review is awesome. Congrats! Nice player indeed.

 

[19lexicon78]

your reviews of cd-players are great to read.
i just bought one for family. transport is perfect, if they don't like the sound they can buy an external DAC.
oja, paid far less than a new tascam cd 200. bargain...

 

[Baki]

Well... I've been using PD D9J from 2008 until 2021. That was my last, fifth cd player which I am now keeping in the locker having a just emotional value.
Since I was always into DIY throughout the years it has been heavily modified, very often with advise of well known people from DIYAudio and DIYHiFi of which the latter does not exist for years now.
It was reliable (and still is in working state) but truth to be told I was not overly happy with it either in stock or being upgraded in a key areas.
Of all DSD discs I have tried none of them has been satisfactory and CD layer being always better sound-wise.
Wolfson DAC is of voltage out type with an average performance.
You won't miss anything if you don't buy it.
My two cents.

 

[Scytales]

Well... I've been using PD D9J from 2008 until 2021. That was my last, fifth cd player which I am now keeping in the locker having a just emotional value.
Since I was always into DIY throughout the years it has been heavily modified, very often with advise of well known people from DIYAudio and DIYHiFi of which the latter does not exist for years now.
It was reliable (and still is in working state) but truth to be told I was not overly happy with it either in stock or being upgraded in a key areas.
Of all DSD discs I have tried none of them has been satisfactory and CD layer being always better sound-wise.
Wolfson DAC is of voltage out type with an average performance.
You won't miss anything if you don't buy it.
My two cents.

Did you performed thorough measurements before and after each modification in order to check if improvements actually took place instead of worsening performances? If yes, would you mind sharing your mods and these measurements with us?

 

[GWolfman]

Thanks @NTTY for your frequent contributions to this site!

 

[Baki]

Did you performed thorough measurements before and after each modification in order to check if improvements actually took place instead of worsening performances? If yes, would you mind sharing your mods and these measurements with us?

I am not a tech guy neither I have a measuring equipment.
What I have done is to change the OPA2134 for another opamp of your choice. The current one is the discrete one. Also, it has been concluded that there is no need to use the dual opamp but the single one. If you do that even to the stock OPA2134 you will have the benefit. Regulators for the analog and digital stage have been replaced with the better ones. Clock oscillator has been replaced with dedicated circuit. Coupling capacitors could be removed if you already have these in the next stage. The chassis has been additionally damped since the top cover is ringing like hell. Plenty of other minor tweaks as well. With all these mentioned changes you cannot go wrong. All this has been done during a multi year period and of course each change has been repeated back and forth before making the final decision.
It is very useful to have a service manual for all this.
If someone needs it I can send via PM.

 

[Baki]

Did you performed thorough measurements before and after each modification in order to check if improvements actually took place instead of worsening performances? If yes, would you mind sharing your mods and these measurements with us?

And to directly answer your first question: you can't know what technical excellence would sound like. However, good measured results are useful to know if a particular device has any major flaws that can create a negative impression during listening.

 

[xaviescacs]

Great review as always! But a bit late for me... I had one of those and sold it few years ago (not playing CDs anymore) perhaps with this review I could've got a few more bucks for the thing

 

[NTTY]

And to directly answer your first question: you can't know what technical excellence would sound like. However, good measured results are useful to know if a particular device has any major flaws that can create a negative impression during listening.

That will be my sole interaction with you.

I initially just added you to my "ignored" list, but since you come back with the same obsolete statements, of BS asymmetry principle nature, I feel I owe the community a general reply, being the OP.

In three posts you consistently demonstrated your ignorance on the matter, yet have no worries suggesting Pioneer did not do their job and that what we measure here is of no interest/importance.

So, you throw discredit at Pioneer as well as at the members of ASR community, for being facts based and perfectly able to correlate measurements with hearing experience, BTW, all with random statements based out of nothing you dare and can document/explain.

 

[Roland68]

That will be my sole interaction with you.

I initially just added you to my "ignored" list, but since you come back with the same obsolete statements, of BS asymmetry principle nature, I feel I owe the community a general reply, being the OP.

In three posts you consistently demonstrated your ignorance on the matter, yet have no worries suggesting Pioneer did not do their job and that what we measure here is of no interest/importance.

So, you throw discredit at Pioneer as well as at the members of ASR community, for being facts based and perfectly able to correlate measurements with hearing experience, BTW, all with random statements based out of nothing you dare and can document/explain.

I can only confirm @NTTY's statement.
Over the past few years, we've conducted several hundred fully leveled blind tests within a project, including with dozens of DACs and CD/SACD players, the results of which agree with both Amir's tests and those of NTTY. These tests were conducted completely independently of those on ASR and are often very far apart in time.

We also had many guests and their devices with us, often so-called audiophiles.
Their statements never stood up in controlled blind tests, regardless of whether they were "a difference like night and day" or "much worse than other devices." Only when a device was defective or had extremely poor measurements were the results very clear.
Everything else was very close, even with audible differences, but not like "night and day."

So-called "sounded" devices can make an audible difference, which is also measurable, but must be considered defective because they permanently alter the original musical material/signal.
It should be clear to everyone that without tone controls or DSP, such a thing constitutes an uncontrolled and altering intervention in the original signal.

The excuses from the guests during these tests as to why even they couldn't hear the "huge difference" would fill an entire book. I was even once accused of tampering with their own CDs, which they had brought with them.

 

[Sonny1]

This company does modifications and I believe they once offered a mod of this model. Interestingly like most mod companies they do not provide and validation of “improvements” but the link does provide some interesting internal shots. I had the matching two channel receiver in this line when it came out, for my second system. I bought it cheap and sold it cheap as I rarely used it. Build quality was good and it was cool looking. One of the many pieces of gear that occupied a temporary space in my system(s). Sadly, my other hobbies (fitness, cycling, work ) and family commitments have limited my audio tinkering and listening time. My Sonos speakers get 90% of the action these days. They don’t sound as good as the main system but the convenience is hard to beat. http://www.lampizator.eu/LAMPIZATOR/REFERENCES/Pioneer PD-D9/Pdd9.html

 

[Baki]

I can only confirm @NTTY's statement.
Over the past few years, we've conducted several hundred fully leveled blind tests within a project, including with dozens of DACs and CD/SACD players, the results of which agree with both Amir's tests and those of NTTY. These tests were conducted completely independently of those on ASR and are often very far apart in time.

We also had many guests and their devices with us, often so-called audiophiles.
Their statements never stood up in controlled blind tests, regardless of whether they were "a difference like night and day" or "much worse than other devices." Only when a device was defective or had extremely poor measurements were the results very clear.
Everything else was very close, even with audible differences, but not like "night and day."

So-called "sounded" devices can make an audible difference, which is also measurable, but must be considered defective because they permanently alter the original musical material/signal.
It should be clear to everyone that without tone controls or DSP, such a thing constitutes an uncontrolled and altering intervention in the original signal.

The excuses from the guests during these tests as to why even they couldn't hear the "huge difference" would fill an entire book. I was even once accused of tampering with their own CDs, which they had brought with them.

I do not criticize the technical review! I have it since 2008 and you do not. I just simply do not advice anyone to buy it second hand.

That will be my sole interaction with you.

I initially just added you to my "ignored" list, but since you come back with the same obsolete statements, of BS asymmetry principle nature, I feel I owe the community a general reply, being the OP.

In three posts you consistently demonstrated your ignorance on the matter, yet have no worries suggesting Pioneer did not do their job and that what we measure here is of no interest/importance.

So, you throw discredit at Pioneer as well as at the members of ASR community, for being facts based and perfectly able to correlate measurements with hearing experience, BTW, all with random statements based out of nothing you dare and can document/explain.

Likewise. I ultimately trust to my ears and you do not. That's democracy.

 

[Baki]

This company does modifications and I believe they once offered a mod of this model. Interestingly like most mod companies they do not provide and validation of “improvements” but the link does provide some interesting internal shots. I had the matching two channel receiver in this line when it came out, for my second system. I bought it cheap and sold it cheap as I rarely used it. Build quality was good and it was cool looking. One of the many pieces of gear that occupied a temporary space in my system(s). Sadly, my other hobbies (fitness, cycling, work ) and family commitments have limited my audio tinkering and listening time. My Sonos speakers get 90% of the action these days. They don’t sound as good as the main system but the convenience is hard to beat. http://www.lampizator.eu/LAMPIZATOR/REFERENCES/Pioneer PD-D9/Pdd9.html

Come on. How could Lukacz Fikus do the blasphemy to such a unique Pioneer's product? How he dares to make and sell the dacs costing dozens of thousands dollars?