Hi everyone, new member, first post, figure I'll start with a brief introduction. I'm a dyed-in-the-wool STEM guy, chemistry and chemical engineering in college (1975 - 1979) where I was introduced to higher quality audio systems, taught myself to program microprocessors right out of school and made a career switch to computer engineering, primarily software with a little bit of hardware early on. I've upped my audio game in steps rather than gradually. When my roommate graduated at the end of my freshman year I bought his Marantz 2270 receiver and original Technics SL1200 TT, and upped my speakers accordingly. I had to leave that behind due to a divorce settlement in the early '90s (losing that SL 1200 killed me) and built a new system from Kenwood, Technics, and Bose components. Still consumer grade, but on the higher end of that class. In 2013 I built a 5.1 home theater system with Marantz separates, Mirage mains, Paradigm for the rest, various digital sources, and a Panasonic plasma TV. Just last year I upgraded that to newer, better Marantz separates, top of the line Mirage mains (used), a Technics SL-100 C TT, and LG OLED TV. I'm very much a test and measurement type, and have a healthy although not absolute skepticism of a lot of the 'golden ears' kind of stuff that goes on in high-end audio. A lot of the discussions over on Agon, where I'm also a member, are interesting but almost entirely opinion-based and seeking advice over there becomes a matter of whose opinion you think you can trust the most. Which brings me to the reason for this post.
Here's my concern: My pre-amp is a Marantz AV 20, similar enough to the AV 10 reviewed here to use the results as a deciding factor in the purchase (thanks Amir!). When I listen to digital sources - blu-ray, CD - a volume level of 68 - 72 produces a room-filling, immersive SPL. When I use the TT with an A/T VM750xSH MM cartridge going into the built-in phono input of the AV 20, I have to turn the volume up to 80+ to get a SPL that sounds loud, never mind immersive. When I look at Amir's review of the AV 10, his SINAD vs Volume Level chart has an annotation that says 'Max clean output = 4.82 volts (vol. = 84)'. The way I read that is at 80+ volume level I'm bumping up against the limit for clean output from the pre-amp, and I'd like to go louder with it at times without straining the amp and introducing distortion.
What I've done: Figuring a phono stage would help, I researched them here and on Agon. Michael Fidler's Spartan 20 was highly praised across the board so I contacted him directly about my situation. If I remember the gist of that conversation correctly, the S-20 is a good match for the cartridge and the line inputs on the AV 20, but I would probably get an increase of only about 3 dB and I might lose much of the headroom for handling pops and clicks that the phono input has built into it. When he asked what my concern was and I told him about having to turn the volume up so high, and referenced the chart mentioned above, he said I might be interpreting the graph incorrectly. And maybe I am. Anyway, RL jumped in and I didn't pursue it any further until now.
My question(s): Is my interpretation of that graph correct, and based on that, is my concern about turning the volume up past 80+ a valid one? If so, given Michael's comments about minimal increased gain and possible loss of headroom, is a phono stage even a viable option? Is there any solution other than replacing the pre-amp that would address my preference, I'll call it, for higher sound levels at more amp-friendly volume levels?
Thanks in advance for any advice. And @amirm thanks for what you do here, I've found more usable, valuable information (to my way of thinking) here in 1/10th of the time I've spent on Agon parsing through opinions about equipment that is completely removed from my reality. Donation made.
Here's my concern: My pre-amp is a Marantz AV 20, similar enough to the AV 10 reviewed here to use the results as a deciding factor in the purchase (thanks Amir!). When I listen to digital sources - blu-ray, CD - a volume level of 68 - 72 produces a room-filling, immersive SPL. When I use the TT with an A/T VM750xSH MM cartridge going into the built-in phono input of the AV 20, I have to turn the volume up to 80+ to get a SPL that sounds loud, never mind immersive. When I look at Amir's review of the AV 10, his SINAD vs Volume Level chart has an annotation that says 'Max clean output = 4.82 volts (vol. = 84)'. The way I read that is at 80+ volume level I'm bumping up against the limit for clean output from the pre-amp, and I'd like to go louder with it at times without straining the amp and introducing distortion.
What I've done: Figuring a phono stage would help, I researched them here and on Agon. Michael Fidler's Spartan 20 was highly praised across the board so I contacted him directly about my situation. If I remember the gist of that conversation correctly, the S-20 is a good match for the cartridge and the line inputs on the AV 20, but I would probably get an increase of only about 3 dB and I might lose much of the headroom for handling pops and clicks that the phono input has built into it. When he asked what my concern was and I told him about having to turn the volume up so high, and referenced the chart mentioned above, he said I might be interpreting the graph incorrectly. And maybe I am. Anyway, RL jumped in and I didn't pursue it any further until now.
My question(s): Is my interpretation of that graph correct, and based on that, is my concern about turning the volume up past 80+ a valid one? If so, given Michael's comments about minimal increased gain and possible loss of headroom, is a phono stage even a viable option? Is there any solution other than replacing the pre-amp that would address my preference, I'll call it, for higher sound levels at more amp-friendly volume levels?
Thanks in advance for any advice. And @amirm thanks for what you do here, I've found more usable, valuable information (to my way of thinking) here in 1/10th of the time I've spent on Agon parsing through opinions about equipment that is completely removed from my reality. Donation made.
