• Welcome to ASR. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Phono Cartridge Crosstalk Measurement and Tonearm Radial Tracking Error

fricc

Member
Forum Donor
Joined
May 24, 2019
Messages
63
Likes
88
Location
San Francisco Bay Area
Most test records (e.g: STR-100) have their frequency sweep track (used by the Phono Cartridge Response Measurement Script) at the beginning of the record, where the Radial Tracking Error is not null.
This is problematic for estimating the cartridge crosstalk, and indeed the instructions provided by The guidebook suggest that we play with the cartridge azimuth (turning the headshell slightly, or adding spacers) to attain optimal results.
This is probably OK for estimating the cartridge best performance, but it probably not a good idea for actually setting up the cartridge/turntable, which has been designed to minimize its readout error at a different location of the tonearm's arc. Right?
Aside from the cartridge's azimuth, the other factors that contribute to the crosstalk misestimation is the Horizontal Tracking Error itself, the cartridge is not aligned with the grooves and it blends the channels slightly, increasing crosstalk. I found that twisting the cart slightly also improves crosstalk. The linear velocity at the outer edge of the record is also the highest, this is good for frequency resolution, but it probably amplifies high frequency tracking errors and anti-skating forces as well (which are also change across the record radius).
BTW: I'm suspecting that — on healthy cartridges — the "azimuth twist" probably mostly compensates for the anti-skating error at the beginning of the record.
What do you guys think?
 
Last edited:
There is a lot in the fun thread about crosstalk factors. You have the usual azimuth that affects left-right crosstalk, VTA that affects absolute crosstalk and then the vector forces at the stylus tip that cause twisting.

Horizontal tracking error mainly cause H2 distortion and inter channel phase error.
 
Last edited:
The stylus has to be perpendicular. Using test tones can end up with the stylus out of perpendicular which just creates its own issues. That’s my opinion anyway

An ideal cartridge have both the motor and stylus symmetrical to groove walls. The stylus has a certain tolerance - and azimuth matters more with line contacts. However, an ML/MR stylus has a certain rounding and will be forming longer contact patches during as it wears. Records also varies and grooves can deviate from perfect ±45°. If stylus azimuth is within ±2° for an ML/MR, there are no practical issues - it will wear in.
 
An ideal cartridge have both the motor and stylus symmetrical to groove walls. The stylus has a certain tolerance - and azimuth matters more with line contacts. However, an ML/MR stylus has a certain rounding and will be forming longer contact patches during as it wears. Records also varies and grooves can deviate from perfect ±45°. If stylus azimuth is within ±2° for an ML/MR, there are no practical issues - it will wear in.
Well quite. As far as I’m concerned if it’s in spec then that’s your cartridge. If it’s out of spec just send it back.

There are just too many variables to ever achieve anything by messing around with azimuth - but if one must (and we all do it..) then perpendicular is the far better metric than reducing crosstalk imo.
 
Well quite. As far as I’m concerned if it’s in spec then that’s your cartridge. If it’s out of spec just send it back.

There are just too many variables to ever achieve anything by messing around with azimuth - but if one must (and we all do it..) then perpendicular is the far better metric than reducing crosstalk imo.
Spec is something you cannot check very easily. Orbray has e.g. 90±5° for zenith on a stylus. What is the spec for azimuth given a specific cartridge in relation to mounting plate?

Here is an animation of a SAS MR and a AT ML in a groove. The SAS has started adjusted to the groove, 50-60 h use, and is cross-talk optimised regarding azimuth.

 
Last edited:
Spec is something you cannot check very easily. Orbray has e.g. 90±5° for zenith on a stylus. What is the spec for azimuth given a specific cartridge in relation to mounting plate?
obviously if it’s not meeting crosstalk spec then something is badly out of alignment and it can just be returned.

If it’s in spec though crosstalk could be any combo from stylus, cantilever, magnets, and coils. You could have a perfectly mounted stylus and end up shifting it out of alignment chasing crosstalk because of wonky magnets or coils.

presumably then one is reliant on high frequency distortion to get the stylus back in perpendicular if it’s out of wack.
 
obviously if it’s not meeting crosstalk spec then something is badly out of alignment and it can just be returned.

If it’s in spec though crosstalk could be any combo from stylus, cantilever, magnets, and coils. You could have a perfectly mounted stylus and end up shifting it out of alignment chasing crosstalk because of wonky magnets or coils.

presumably then one is reliant on high frequency distortion to get the stylus back in perpendicular if it’s out of wack.
Again, correction of a less than ±2° error you will have no problem whatsoever with the stylus in the groove, given the inclination angles of 55-60°. Those ±35-45° inclination triangle stylus cartoons you linked to are just wrong and misleading the reader.
 
Last edited:
Again, correction of a less than ±2° error you will have no problem whatsoever with the stylus in the groove, given the inclination angles of 55-60°. Those ±35-45 inclination triangle stylus cartoons you linked to are just wrong and misleading the reader.
I’m using your +/- 5 degrees as the extreme not 2 degrees. Clearly distortion and tracing can be improved if it’s out of whack by 5 degrees if one insists on correcting azimuth
 
I’m using your +/- 5 degrees as the extreme not 2 degrees. Clearly distortion and tracing can be improved if it’s out of whack by 5 degrees if one insists on correcting azimuth
Which ±5 degrees? I am not talking about the zenith spec from Orbray. The azimuth spec is set by the manufacturer mounting the stylus+cantilever in the armature.
 
Well it’s out of spec where do you think the issue will manifest itself?
Crosstalk is distortion even if signals are partly correlated. I would have it as low as possible and even between channels .
 
Back
Top Bottom