Thanks so much for this! Just one question…at just after 3 minutes you compare Palmer’s EQ graph with yours, but I see no change in the graph.
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Palmer ORBIT 11 Cardioid Coaxial 3-way studio monitor (MSRP 799€/899$)
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Pretty obvious you either got a lemon or have a ground loop somewhere, just return it.
olieb
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Superb! Not much left for the NFS to add [understatement ;-) ]. Thanks again.
About that hiss thing. The given RMS value is the one for the black graph, I suppose?
The blue one is a bit funny, how did you subtract two (uncorrelated) noise signals? And the result showing up 15dB up is a bit counterintuitive.
Giving the unfiltered (?) RMS-value is understandable and a clear thing, but it is not what one hears.
The result of ≈20dB SPL at 1m is to a big part due to low frequency contribution where the ear is much less sensitive than in 2-4kHz range.
There is no established filter that applies to 15 phon, but A-weighting is probably the next best thing.
However, hiss is a nasty thing to measure (and compare).
AnalogSteph
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I dearly hope that things won't be anywhere near 39 dB after A-weighting, as that would be truly atrocious. The ADAM T5V that's attracting noise complaints on a regular basis is approaching 30 dB(A), the JBL LSR305 isn't much lower, and only a select few can beat the Neumann KH310 at 16.5 dB(A).
www.audiosciencereview.com
A speaker this size and level handling could probably afford 26-28 dB(A) but not a whole lot more if you can help it. There should be few complaints at 25ish.
Hiss List (S&R)
Lots of discussion about hiss lately, how perceptible or annoying it is, and if it matters. I've created a sheet with Sound & Recording measurements of hiss in active loudspeakers: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1n62hGAdKptSSKC74_fIT_R7DxFJ60YR2_O9C8x-vYQI/edit?usp=sharing Viewers can...
www.audiosciencereview.com
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The high group delay results from an LF tuning to obtain extended bass from a very small box. A very large box/woofer could produce the same bass extension and SPL with much lower group delay.
2-3ms is a very low group delay even for a sealed box unless it is very bass limited.
The orbits bass group delay is similar to some vented boxes although the shape of the curve is different.
If Palmer corrected the group delay it would introduce too much global latency so they have left it alone.
Humans are very good at tolerating delay in low frequencies so likely not audible.
RT.
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Thanks again. As was already clear after your first part, this is an excellent, powerful little monitor. Considering the price and especially the fact that it can compete with much more expensive speakers, we have a new player on the market. Sure, Genelec's SAM and Neumann's MA1 are still ahead thanks to their measurement and correction systems, but if you already use a different measurement and equalization system, the Orbit 11 is a very good choice. Perhaps even the best choice in this price range.
Dont have any ground loop.. simply i can hear it when at rhat distance.. not a problem i simply get further away.. the rest on this speakers is just amazing..
Have you tried changing the input pad? Depending on where the pad is in the circuit, it might reduce the hiss as well
Pearljam5000
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Can you describe the sound
Thanks
Some thougts about hiss and gain:
with my purifiy poweramp, as well with hypex modules, my main volume level on the preamp is -30 to - 20 dB. With the Palmer it is -50 dB at max without any correction on the speaker. So I used the input attenuation to it's max of - 20dB and in this constellation the preamp is running now in the same range as with the other components (XLR analogue input). Perhaps that percived hiss is due to high gain on the input of the Palmer.
with my purifiy poweramp, as well with hypex modules, my main volume level on the preamp is -30 to - 20 dB. With the Palmer it is -50 dB at max without any correction on the speaker. So I used the input attenuation to it's max of - 20dB and in this constellation the preamp is running now in the same range as with the other components (XLR analogue input). Perhaps that percived hiss is due to high gain on the input of the Palmer.
Audionaut
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He did > 'My Palmer Orbit 11 monitors sound frighteningly fantastic. Jackpot!'
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Suggestion: perhaps add this video and text to the original post as well?
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There's a tiny change. Palmer's provided specs have been on point.
Ha, thanks! I did rewatch it several times, so as not to miss your point. Thanks for clarifying!
Pearljam5000
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I meant in a more detailed way
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Equalizer setting: desk position and wall distance less than 30 cm. In an equilateral triangle setup, the Orbit 11 reproduces speech very naturally.
Songs from the Harman Kardon playlist: very balanced sound with deep-reaching bass. The localization of voices and instruments is precisely possible.
In the 50 m² living room, the sound at around 90 dB measured at a distance of 1 meter is definitely room-filling with sufficient bass. The effect of standing waves is significantly less pronounced compared to the Salon 2s. This may possibly be due to the different speaker positions and/or the position of the woofers.
You're listening to what speaker with Beryllium tweeter exactly ?Get some Beryllium tweeters to compensate for it
That's why I like bright speakers because my hearing is also not the best.
Pearljam5000
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Right now? No speakerYou're listening to what speaker with Beryllium tweeter exactly ?
But I've heard Focal with Beryllium and liked them a lot
I dialed down gain at input to - 20 dB so it would fit to the other equipment. That's for analogue input.
As I'm not that sensitive to that (anymore), I questioned the 'next generation' about this entity. The answer (he's mostly into PA and Horns): they all hiss, untill the music begins to play, then you won't hear it anymore.
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