Palmer ORBIT 11 Cardioid Coaxial 3-way studio monitor (MSRP 799€/899$)

[Liftro]

I’ve been looking at the thd graphs and I’m not sure how to read or understand these? The original KH120’s that I own have higher distortion than the KH120ii’s so if the Orbit 11’s can at least match my KH120’s I would be very happy.
Looking at the charts provided so far, how do the Orbit 11’s compare to the original KH120a’s, KH120ii’s and KH150’s?

Regarding output, I tend to run my KH120a’s with the output on the 100dB setting and the input gain turned up to 0dB. I’ve never had my MOTU 828es interface turned up anywhere near full volume and when I want to play a mix at the loudest I feel comfortable with I’m still only turning the interface up to 70%. I have a lot of headroom left even when it’s only set to the 100dB output setting. Palmer state a max peak spl of 116db compared to 111dB of my KH120’s. I based on this info, I don’t think I’ll ever run out of output with the Orbit 11’s.

I

I had my Neumanns speakers set to 86dB SPL at my listening position (I have mild hearing loss), with additional peaks reaching 105dB SPL, and I can assure you that it was more than enough for creating, mixing, and listening to music. I only turned up the volume slightly if I went to the sofa, which was about 2.5 meters from the speakers, to listen to music, or when I wanted to dance in the middle of the room. My point is that the Palmer will definitely cover the sound pressure, at least in the near field.

 

[Palladium]

Curious minds want to know anyway even if it’s the end results that counts.

IME even if they are known OEM manufacturered drivers they can be bespoke versions adapted to the needs of the design ?
One can not help to notice that some brand name drivers makes people more interested ?

Or they could make thier own drivers ? Who knows, curiosity and all that

Personally I find the whole integrated product very interesting I think it’s more than its parts, even if I’m of-course curious of the nitty gritty details like any other audio nutcase . I do not expect an answer to everything as they will keep some IP to themselves naturally.

I don't want to mention any names but I do know at least one case where the total driver costs isn't even 10% of the speaker MSRP.

 

[TimVG]

There is no beating physics. For their intended purpose as nearfield monitors (!!) low frequency response will be extended and most likely more than sufficient before reaching audible distortion. For far field applications you'll need subs. This enclosure is packed to the brim. The numbers they produce are quite excellent everything considered, but you cannot expect everything at this price point - and in my opinion you're getting a whole lot. I'm tempted to buy a pair just because of the value.

 

[Thomazzino]

I'm really looking forward to this.
Only thing I'm worried about is the metal (neodym) tweeter. I have really bad experiences with metal based tweeters (Amphion/Genelec).
Never heard Neodym tweeters before so I'm interested to hear if it has the same "shrill" as the rest of the metal tweeters.

 

[Downsideup]

I'm really looking forward to this.
Only thing I'm worried about is the metal (neodym) tweeter. I have really bad experiences with metal based tweeters (Amphion/Genelec).
Never heard Neodym tweeters before so I'm interested to hear if it has the same "shrill" as the rest of the metal tweeters.

It's Titanium Dome Tweeter, with Neodymium magnet.
I'm definitely looking forward to the sonic signature as well, although it has good specs, voicing is definitely a key factor. I heard Kii Three, next to ATC SCM150, and Genelec, and I guess a lot of people will think one is a lot "truer" than another. taste and ears come into play.
So I'm after transparency, and also being a producer : "it is clear, fast to work with" which is another factor, harder to evaluate.

 

[Liftro]

It's Titanium Dome Tweeter, with Neodymium magnet.
I'm definitely looking forward to the sonic signature as well, although it has good specs, voicing is definitely a key factor. I heard Kii Three, next to ATC SCM150, and Genelec, and I guess a lot of people will think one is a lot "truer" than another. taste and ears come into play.
So I'm after transparency, and also being a producer : "it is clear, fast to work with" which is another factor, harder to evaluate.

How do you compare these three monitors side by side? Which one did you like best?

 

[Thomazzino]

It's Titanium Dome Tweeter, with Neodymium magnet.
I'm definitely looking forward to the sonic signature as well, although it has good specs, voicing is definitely a key factor. I heard Kii Three, next to ATC SCM150, and Genelec, and I guess a lot of people will think one is a lot "truer" than another. taste and ears come into play.
So I'm after transparency, and also being a producer : "it is clear, fast to work with" which is another factor, harder to evaluate.

Exactly. "it is clear, fast to work with" is what I'm also looking for. Amphion also uses Titanium dome tweeters and alot of people swear by them, but it gives me tinnitus, especially in the 10-12k range. Only way to find out is to try them out I guess.

 

[Pearljam5000]

Genelecs are as clear as they come

 

[pat355]

is just me being paranoid or am I seeing people sign up on ASR just to post speculative issues about this or that potential problem with these new speakers? almost as if to tame demand for said speakers. Yeah, probably just my tinnitus hitting my world perception again...

 

[Downsideup]

Exactly. "it is clear, fast to work with" is what I'm also looking for. Amphion also uses Titanium dome tweeters and alot of people swear by them, but it gives me tinnitus, especially in the 10-12k range. Only way to find out is to try them out I guess.

Yes it's very personal, I am very peculiar about high end but I love Amphion. Some of them have a tiny bump at 10k I guess, but I probably am not hearing much in that rande anymore I suppose?!

How do you compare these three monitors side by side? Which one did you like best?

SEC Audio in Switzerland, basically a 200m2 room with what they call a WALL OF SOUND. a switcher to alternate between all the dreams monitors.

I was there for a short time ( and to pick up a sub), and listen to the monitors just fun.
Kiis were doing a fine job in a more polite/processed way if I can describe it that way, muscular lows. SCM150 had they signature, "proud mids" that almost seems in front. Anyway both could work well and have to be auditioned in the customers place, with their ears, for a long time. no way to tell otherwise.
This was a very quick switching session, don't take my word for it and try to find them and have a listen !

I'm had the chance to have ATC SCM150 (had for quite cheap), and sold them because my room was too small. Now in a gigantic place I miss them, and have absolutely no way to find the same deal as it way rare in 2017, and now with new prices, it's impossible. Can be clean, loud AND extended. Expensive combo.

I almost wanted to by orbit and compare with my Amphions, and ATC SCM20, but in the middle of construction work here, it'd be kinda silly.

 

[JoeDiMEG]

(...) am I seeing people sign up on ASR just to post speculative issues about this or that potential problem with these new speakers? almost as if to tame demand for said speakers.

A serious competitor reacted here. I take that as a very good sign.

Very few KH120-owners seem a little bit triggered.

Because the speakers are the same price and the capacitor-thread about the KH120 was IMHO not really reassuring.


KR

 

[Thomazzino]

is just me being paranoid or am I seeing people sign up on ASR just to post speculative issues about this or that potential problem with these new speakers? almost as if to tame demand for said speakers. Yeah, probably just my tinnitus hitting my world perception again...

Aren't forums about people sharing their opinions? Isn't it also good that this monitor is bringing many people here to discuss about it? Thats how Amphion got their hype (Gearspace thread).

In the end the tweeter material is the only thing I'm worried about with these monitors which is a praise given all the other areas monitors need to perform in. If these monitors perform as advertised then they will take over this price range and above big time. Most of us are waiting for Amrim's tests and making decisions afterwards, so scepticism isn't going to kill this speakers demand. It will do the opposite.

Maybe it's not your tinnitus, maybe it's your negative vision.

 

[Liftro]

A serious competitor reacted here. I take that as a very good sign.

Very few KH120-owners seem a little bit triggered.

Because the speakers are the same price and the capacitor-thread about the KH120 was IMHO not really reassuring.


KR

Anyone who didn't want a speaker with these features implemented at this price, let them cast the first stone.

 

[amirm]

Anyone who didn't want a speaker with these features implemented at this price, let them cast the first stone.

We don't buy features. We buy demonstrated fidelity. Testing data must be in front of us to form proper opinion.

 

[pat355]

Aren't forums about people sharing their opinions? Isn't it also good that this monitor is bringing many people here to discuss about it? Thats how Amphion got their hype (Gearspace thread).

In the end the tweeter material is the only thing I'm worried about with these monitors which is a praise given all the other areas monitors need to perform in. If these monitors perform as advertised then they will take over this price range and above big time. Most of us are waiting for Amrim's tests and making decisions afterwards, so scepticism isn't going to kill this speakers demand. It will do the opposite.

Maybe it's not your tinnitus, maybe it's your negative vision.

I agree, must be my tinnitus. For someone who literally just signed up you sure know a lot about how this forum works. Cool
I sincerely hope you'll find all the info you need to make a good decision for your set-up

 

[Liftro]

A little humor here. Sorry for using AI, but I wanted to be quick.

 

[Liftro]

We don't buy features. We buy demonstrated fidelity. Testing data must be in front of us to form proper opinion.

I totally agree, that's why, although I feel excited, I don't plan to spend any money until it's confirmed that it's worth it.

 

[Liftro]

I agree, must be my tinnitus. For someone who literally just signed up you sure know a lot about how this forum works. Cool
I sincerely hope you'll find all the info you need to make a good decision for your set-up

I think what happens is that many people see and read the forum but don't decide to create an account until the right moment comes or they have some doubt. I'm speaking mainly for myself.

 

[dickiefunk]

Distortion measurements are NOT standardized so you can't compare manufacturer's data with mine. Or other people. So you need to wait for my testing to get conclusive information.

Mind you, they are not useless and you can see correlations for specific problems. Just not with respect to playback capability, SPL, etc.

Thanks Amir for this info. Looking forward to your review,

 

[dickiefunk]

I'm sure Orbit are enough in your case. All the max spl specs are unfortunately vague to me, for ex:
-Kh120 II output 116,8db SPL max
-Orbit 11 output 116db SPL max

Of course the first with 6L volume, a small woofer, will certainly not output the same power.

Neumann:

Max. SPL calc. in half space at 3% THD at 1m (averaged between 100 Hz and 6 kHz) 116.8 dB SPL Max. SPL in full space at 3% THD at 1m (averaged between 100 Hz and 6 kHz) 110.8 dB SPL Bass capability: Max. SPL in half space at 3% THD at 1m (averaged between 50 Hz and 100 Hz) 105.1 dB SPL Max. short term SPL with IEC-weighted noise (IEC 60268-5) at 1 m, in typical listening conditions 108 dB(C) SPL Max. short term SPL with music material at 2.3 m in typical listening conditions (pair / full range) 98 dB(C) SPL Max. short term SPL with music material at 2.3 m, in typical listening conditions (pair with subwoofer) 104 dB(C) SPL Max. long term SPL with pink noise at 2.3 m, in typical listening conditions (single / pair full range) 88 / 93 dB(C) SPL Max. long term SPL with pink noise at 2.3 m, in typical listening conditions (single / pair with subwoofer) 87 / 93 dB(C) SPL

Orbit 11: SPL Max of 116db at what scale ? anechoic ? distance ? pink noise?
I'd love to have a continuous max spl in general, and of course for Orbit 11 if possible @UffdiePalme !! Thanks in advance.

Thanks for sharing this. I’m using the original mk1 KH120’s which have less output than the mk2’s so yes I’m sure the Orbit 11 will be more than enough for me. I have my KH120’s turned down to the 100dB output setting on the back and never have the main volume on my audio interface turned anywhere near max ever.