Onkyo TX-RZ50 Review (Home Theater AVR)

[EWL5]

I already have Arcam with DIRAC, not looking actively to change but this one gives me eARC compared to current ARC and that's my motivation really.
I am looking for get a pre-owned one and so return may not be an option, that's why thought I will check here if there was any significant update to improve upon the issues originally identified.

Pre-owned means you'll keep the AVR regardless of issues that pop up, especially if limp mode comes into play! You should look away from PAC AVRs for pre-owned unless it's an RZ70 or similar.

 

[Guddu]

Pre-owned means you'll keep the AVR regardless of issues that pop up, especially if limp mode comes into play! You should look away from PAC AVRs for pre-owned unless it's an RZ70 or similar.

I was planning to get one with at least 1yr Onkyo warranty left, but just not return option.

 

[Rottmannash]

I was planning to get one with at least 1yr Onkyo warranty left, but just not return option.

I have been using the RZ50 for several years now and it has been reliable and sounds fine. Not sure what people are expecting to see/hear but I haven't noticed any of the "issues" noted during the review/measurement. Have never noted "limp mode" (must monitor the web UI to see whether the fans come on or "limp mode" is triggered) even when the outboard Buckeye Purifi amps were blinking their red "distortion" LEDs. The AVR powers the Atmos speakers only but still the volume at that point was scary. Maybe if one used all inboard amps someone might accidentally trigger "limp mode" but so far no one's mentioned it occurring in several forums I watch. I would not hesitate to buy one but I'd try to find a new one if possible.

 

[ryanmh1]

I have read about first 20 pages of this thread for the issues identified during testing and review.
Has there been any improvements on the recently sold versions or is it still same, anyone knows?

There is not now nor was there ever a real issue that will affect anyone in normal use on normal speakers. This was protection circuitry being activated by running test tones. Unless you're going to try to run a pair of highly inefficient speakers with massive woofers at ear-splitting levels, you'll be fine. At the point where the protection circuitry becomes an issue, you'll have long since gone to an outboard amp anyway.

 

[Guddu]

There is not now nor was there ever a real issue that will affect anyone in normal use on normal speakers. This was protection circuitry being activated by running test tones. Unless you're going to try to run a pair of highly inefficient speakers with massive woofers at ear-splitting levels, you'll be fine. At the point where the protection circuitry becomes an issue, you'll have long since gone to an outboard amp anyway.

I was looking to use it in pre-amp mode anyway but just found out that internal power-amp may not be disabled while using pre-out.

 

[dlaloum]

I was looking to use it in pre-amp mode anyway but just found out that internal power-amp may not be disabled while using pre-out.

The O/I AVR's don't disable the internal power amp when running as a pre, however if you are using it exclusively as a pre, (ie: not a hybrid configuration where some channels are powered internally and some externally) - then you can put it in eco mode, which will lower the power rail voltage and reduce power consumption of the amp circuits.

 

[Rottmannash]

I was looking to use it in pre-amp mode anyway but just found out that internal power-amp may not be disabled while using pre-out.

It seems there was a debate here about how much distortion was introduced having the amps powered (Onkyo/Integra) but not used and being able to shut them down (Denon) but can't remember the consensus but I believe the distortion introduced downstream wasn't egregious. Maybe someone else remembers this discussion better. I do know the RZ70 has the amp bypass feature as does the RZ30 (which is cheaper than the RZ50).

 

[dlaloum]

It seems there was a debate here about how much distortion was introduced having the amps powered (Onkyo/Integra) but not used and being able to shut them down (Denon) but can't remember the consensus but I believe the distortion introduced downstream wasn't egregious. Maybe someone else remembers this discussion better. I do know the RZ70 has the amp bypass feature as does the RZ30 (which is cheaper than the RZ50).

All I can say is that the lab bench tests of both families of AVR's showed they had good/adequate noise and distortion control (SINAD)....

I've had an Integra DRX3.4 and have recently moved to an X4800 - I used the 3.4 in hybrid mode (external and internal amps) and the X4800 I am currently using as a straight AVR - performance has been good, very clean - with character primarily driven by Dirac Target curve.
The 3.4 did not sound clean running in pure AVR mode into my difficult speakers - which I assume may be due to a rise of distortion into the reactive low impedance load... the X4800 does not appear to suffer from this.

 

[AndreaIta]

Can anyone help me make a choice? I've had an Onkyo TX-RZ50 for about two years and it sounds good. Now a friend has given me a JBL Synthesis SDP-4 (Lexicon MC-4) to try.

I'll start by saying that I use it with an ADA PTM-6150 amplifier because the Onkyo doesn't have enough power to power my Klipsch 5.1 system.

I tried the JBL and think it sounds better. Is it possible that an older unit is better? Can anyone make a comparison?

Thanks

 

[EWL5]

Can anyone help me make a choice? I've had an Onkyo TX-RZ50 for about two years and it sounds good. Now a friend has given me a JBL Synthesis SDP-4 (Lexicon MC-4) to try.

I'll start by saying that I use it with an ADA PTM-6150 amplifier because the Onkyo doesn't have enough power to power my Klipsch 5.1 system.

I tried the JBL and think it sounds better. Is it possible that an older unit is better? Can anyone make a comparison?

Thanks

If I understand you correctly, you had the RZ50 and JBL taking turns running off the ADA amp when making your comparison? Also, did you volume match to the same dB during your comparison?

It is possible for older units to be better...it could also be something else. Your answers to the above should clue us in.

 

[techsamurai]

Can anyone help me make a choice? I've had an Onkyo TX-RZ50 for about two years and it sounds good. Now a friend has given me a JBL Synthesis SDP-4 (Lexicon MC-4) to try.

I'll start by saying that I use it with an ADA PTM-6150 amplifier because the Onkyo doesn't have enough power to power my Klipsch 5.1 system.

I tried the JBL and think it sounds better. Is it possible that an older unit is better? Can anyone make a comparison?

Thanks

I don't want to say bad things about a product that someone owns and enjoys but I couldn't keep the RZ50. It had an amazing featureset and DIRAC and is a great value.

For me, it was very thunderous like you'd expect from an Onkyo and turned my living room into a movie theater - like a real movie theater. I have huge bass extension on my LCR so I could be watching a commercial and it would be crazy. The sound was impressive but in a living room and with TV shows, it was too much.

The issue for me was music and for whatever reason my previous AVR and the entire setup including the room, the center channel, the cabinet was a gift from the Gods of Music - I'm agnostic but they chose me and gave me the sound of that AVR in my room. Few people in their lifetimes will ever hear sound like that and I heard it all the time for 20 years to the point that I took it for granted and even assumed people were listening to better sound. Had I not been lucky, I'd be buried under amps the size of a coffin, speakers twice my size, and cables that could be used to pull a boat and I'd own more measuring equipment than anyone here.

So yeah an old AVR can sound better than another AVR.

In my case my AVR was the choice of reviewers for playing music and I understand why. If you are willing to spend a lifetime tuning your system, you could get great sound out of most AVRs that offer room correction.

But there are AVRs that will literally make your jaw drop where you don't expect it with music in movies, 2 channel, and even games. But luck has to shine on you to get that absolutely perfect color skin on a TV. Even the best calibrators cannot fix that if the TV won't do it- they can get great skin tones but they will never be perfect. Same with vocals or instruments.

 

[MbphotoX]

yeah, having 1-2 dB more in SPL will do that

I mean, it has a perfectly flat frequency response.. and, unless the speakers run out of power with other amplifiers, should therefore "sound the same"..

But I'm a very strong supporter of "music has to feel good, no matter the price tag or measurements of the equipment"..
I love me a great tube amp, no matter how "bad" the SINAD and shit look.
My positive feeling rates it higher than any flagship amp out there.

 

[techsamurai]

All I can say is that the lab bench tests of both families of AVR's showed they had good/adequate noise and distortion control (SINAD)....

I've had an Integra DRX3.4 and have recently moved to an X4800 - I used the 3.4 in hybrid mode (external and internal amps) and the X4800 I am currently using as a straight AVR - performance has been good, very clean - with character primarily driven by Dirac Target curve.
The 3.4 did not sound clean running in pure AVR mode into my difficult speakers - which I assume may be due to a rise of distortion into the reactive low impedance load... the X4800 does not appear to suffer from this.

X4800? Is that the same as the 4800H? That actually runs your high impedance speakers? Interesting.

 

[EWL5]

X4800? Is that the same as the 4800H? That actually runs your high impedance speakers? Interesting.

I think you meant low impedance speakers. Why is it surprising? Have you seen the 4800 benchmarks?

 

[techsamurai]

I think you meant low impedance speakers. Why is it surprising? Have you seen the 4800 benchmarks?

Yes indeed - low as in difficult to drive requiring more power in general. Thanks for the catch.

On specs, they don't seem to be that far apart but clearly it made a huge difference for you. I have the 4800h but I use my 8002 for amplification.

 

[EWL5]

Yes indeed - low as in difficult to drive requiring more power in general. Thanks for the catch.

On specs, they don't seem to be that far apart but clearly it made a huge difference for you. I have the 4800h but I use my 8002 for amplification.

I forget. Did you ever put the 4800 through a DL calibration or Dirac is not for you?

 

[techsamurai]

I forget. Did you ever put the 4800 through a DL calibration or Dirac is not for you?

What's DL - is it Dirac Live? No I didn't use Dirac on the 4800. If they offered a month free trial or longer (2 months would be fair to properly evaluate), I might have. If it sounded great, I'd keep it and pay for it. They offer a 14 day and that's too short unfortunately for most busy folks especially those willing to pay for it.

I wish they had a bit more faith in their product.

 

[EWL5]

What's DL - is it Dirac Live? No I didn't use Dirac on the 4800. If they offered a month free trial or longer (2 months would be fair to properly evaluate), I might have. If it sounded great, I'd keep it and pay for it. They offer a 14 day and that's too short unfortunately for most busy folks especially those willing to pay for it.

I wish they had a bit more faith in their product.

Yes, DL is Dirac Live. Technically you can try every Dirac license and get a full refund if not satisfied (make sure to check w/our resident Dirac rep Flak first before paying).

There is currently no competing technology that can do what Dirac ART can do (I'd say it's about 90+% rave reviews).

 

[techsamurai]

Yes, DL is Dirac Live. Technically you can try every Dirac license and get a full refund if not satisfied (make sure to check w/our resident Dirac rep Flak first before paying).

There is currently no competing technology that can do what Dirac ART can do (I'd say it's about 90+% rave reviews).

That is interesting - I think they would get a lot more evaluations and sales if they offered a longer trial. But I might consider it. I run 2 AVRs with Audyssey (one for music/movies/gaming) and another for quality music listening - the 4800h is in preamp mode.

 

[EWL5]

That is interesting - I think they would get a lot more evaluations and sales if they offered a longer trial. But I might consider it. I run 2 AVRs with Audyssey (one for music/movies/gaming) and another for quality music listening - the 4800h is in preamp mode.

You can learn more about ART in this thread here:

Active Room Treatment (ART) by Dirac

Dirac is demoing Active Room Treatment (ART) at CES and here are two videos about it... :) Flavio

www.audiosciencereview.com

@dlaloum has a 4800 and recently got ART so you can get his thoughts on it in that thread (and to not derail this RZ50 thread any longer).