On the Distortion of Cirrus Logic CS431xx-Based Devices: A Comparative Review

[markanini]

1: Using the Shanling app, I can set the dongle to High Gain or Low Gain. Which should I use for best quality output? i.e. lowest noise and distortion. I get adequate volume with either option for my use, and I use the dongle with easy to drive 28 and 60 Ohm IEMs and headphones, and also Logitech Z623 powered speakers.

High gain for headphones, and aux use. Low gain for IEMs.

 

[testp]

Is low gain best on the Tanchjim Space?

anything in low gain is better to high gain as far as i know, until you need higher gain

 

[jkim]

Do the affected devices display the same issues with 3.5mm and "balanced" outputs?

Yes, both outputs exhibit the same distortion behavior.

 

[Mike123]

So why do some devices not show the hump? What are they doing differently? Are the ones with the hump fixable with a firmware update?

IMHO, all the information is contained in paragraph 4.3 of the datasheet for the chip. HV_EN should be 0. ADPT_PWR should be 010. And it is desirable that the input signal should not exceed -11 dB DBFS. This will lead to the fact that the output signal will become smaller in amplitude and will require additional amplification. I have had a DAC (hat for Raspberry Pi) on this chip for a long time, I discovered this problem myself and also a long time ago. All I did was reduce the signal in the player by 20 dB and increase the volume in the amplifier. Problem is not visible on measurement. But the record parameters are not visible either .

 

[jkim]

IMHO, all the information is contained in paragraph 4.3 of the datasheet for the chip. HV_EN should be 0. ADPT_PWR should be 010. And it is desirable that the input signal should not exceed -11 dB DBFS. This will lead to the fact that the output signal will become smaller in amplitude and will require additional amplification. I have had a DAC (hat for Raspberry Pi) on this chip for a long time, I discovered this problem myself and also a long time ago. All I did was reduce the signal in the player by 20 dB and increase the volume in the amplifier. Problem is not visible on measurement. But the record parameters are not visible either .

The change of CS431xx registers you are referring to prevents only the kind of distortion caused by the voltage rail transition in the chip's Class H mode.

The Cirrus hump distortion, which gets steady at a fixed signal level below -12 dBFS, is a different kind that cannot arise from its Class H operation logic described in Section 4.3 of the datasheet.

 

[KDRN]

man, i have so much cirrus logic dacs. and like 3 out of 5 of them has clicking artifacts with the test files. the worst one is the apple type c to 3.5mm dongle. with the almost none existent one which is my meizu hifi dac

 

[HeebieGenie]

man, i have so much cirrus logic dacs. and like 3 out of 5 of them has clicking artifacts with the test files. the worst one is the apple type c to 3.5mm dongle. with the almost none existent one which is my meizu hifi dac

I own some too, waiting patiently to see test results for the FiiO K11, if it does then I'm going to steer clear of CL powered DACs in general for now.

 

[markanini]

I need a 2V dongle for Aux purposes, 1V dongles serve me well for IEMs and have a more usable volume range, but too low output for Aux. Glad that I'm reading this report first. At the end of the day CS43131 dongles are very cost-effective, choosing one of the good ones makes me feel good about it.

 

[VientoB]

I feel sad that my Tanchjim is no longer perfect

 

[KDRN]

i just discovered if i set my TRN Black Pearl to NOS Digital Filter. the clicking disappeared (edit: maybe trn programmed the firmware to disable DRE when NOS is used?)


didnt achieved the same results on my fiio KA13 tho

 

[KDRN]

i got tired of opening chrome(i use firefox) just to access the web app. so ide revered engineered the driver and made myself a little program to change the settings on my Black pearl. its its very bare bones. but it works

EDIT: yeah, ide made one for android too.. 80% of the time was getting monet to work lol

 

[jkim]

i got tired of opening chrome(i use firefox) just to access the web app. so ide revered engineered the driver and made myself a little program to change the settings on my Black pearl. its its very bare bones. but it works

View attachment 458696

EDIT: yeah, ide made one for android too.. 80% of the time was getting monet to work lol

View attachment 458736

This is a good find!

True, with NOS selected, the TRN Black Pearl's DRE is indeed turned off. And the distortion does not occur:

However, we get huge garbage of ultrasonic distortion in return. Sure, we won't hear it, but our transducer or amp may not like it (perhaps incurring IMD, too?).

We need DRE to be turned off with a proper reconstruction filter in place.

 

[MCH]

This is a good find!

True, with NOS selected, the TRN Black Pearl's DRE is indeed turned off. And the distortion does not occur:
View attachment 458758

However, we get huge garbage of ultrasonic distortion in return. Sure, we won't hear it, but our transducer or amp may not like it (perhaps incurring IMD, too?).

We need DRE to be turned off with a proper reconstruction filter in place.

Do these apps write directly the registers? If yes, maybe @KDRN can see what registers are different when selecting NOS filter and we could, by elimination, attempt to find out which one DRE_EN is. Additionally this dongle might have I2c accesible...

 

[KDRN]

Do these apps write directly the registers? If yes, maybe @KDRN can see what registers are different when selecting NOS filter and we could, by elimination, attempt to find out which one DRE_EN is. Additionally this dongle might have I2c accesible...

the data its sending and receiving when i was playing around with it are pretty simple. i dont think they put out all the information. i think the change has to be done through the firmware itself

 

[quiet]

This is a good find!

True, with NOS selected, the TRN Black Pearl's DRE is indeed turned off. And the distortion does not occur:
View attachment 458758

However, we get huge garbage of ultrasonic distortion in return. Sure, we won't hear it, but our transducer or amp may not like it (perhaps incurring IMD, too?).

We need DRE to be turned off with a proper reconstruction filter in place.

I'm looking to buy a DAC, and I was settled on the Black Pearl before seeing this thread. Microphone support is important for me. I was hoping to keep my purchase under $100, but under $50 would be ideal. I'm open to other dongles, or potentially a cheap desktop DAC. Would you say there are other options that would provide a better value given the cirrus hump issue? Will the ultrasonic distortion from the NOS filter matter if I plan to mostly use a 24 bit 48kHz format? I'm new to this hobby and to audio science.

I currently own Ziigaat Arete's (fairly sensitive and low impedance I think, 108db and 9ohm. I want to avoid background noise) and FiiO FT1's. Thanks

 

[jkim]

I'm looking to buy a DAC, and I was settled on the Black Pearl before seeing this thread. Microphone support is important for me. I was hoping to keep my purchase under $100, but under $50 would be ideal. I'm open to other dongles, or potentially a cheap desktop DAC. Would you say there are other options that would provide a better value given the cirrus hump issue? Will the ultrasonic distortion from the NOS filter matter if I plan to mostly use a 24 bit 48kHz format? I'm new to this hobby and to audio science.

I currently own Ziigaat Arete's (fairly sensitive and low impedance I think, 108db and 9ohm. I want to avoid background noise) and FiiO FT1's. Thanks

The ultrasonic nonlinear response is there regardless of the DAC's sample rate.

Have you seen the list of recommended portable devices under "Additional Remarks after Part II Tests"?

• Qudelix 5K: Now that the problem of CS431xx is known better, the Qudelix 5K is even more appealing. Sure, it's more expensive but still reasonably priced and supports Bluetooth as well as on-board parametric EQ (PEQ). What more would you ask for?
• FiiO BTR15: Potentially a good device for the same reason as the Qudelix 5K is. But given the superior user interface and functionality of the 5K, I would not choose the BTR15 over the 5K. Edit. Had a chance to measure the PEQ response of the BTR15 as a USB DAC. Far from being correct. I do not recommend this product if its PEQ function is needed for USB connection.
• FiiO BTR17: Highest output power for a portable device. Also with on-board PEQ and Bluetooth support. But substantially more expensive than the 5K or BTR15, and somewhat bulky for a portable device.
• FiiO KA17: Similar to the FiiO BTR17 except for no Bluetooth support. Still a bit pricy.
• iFi Go Link Max or Hiby FC4: If you don't need Bluetooth or PEQ, this seems to be a good choice.
• iFi Go Link or FiiO KA1 or Hiby FC3 (with or without display): If you don't need Bluetooth or PEQ or higher-power balanced output, this seems to be a good budget choice.
• Neutron HiFi DAC V1: A niche product with on-board DSP functions like PEQ, cross-feed, and surround sound. Represents the best implementation of the ES9219 DAC chip. Unbalanced output only. No Bluetooth.
• E1DA 9038D: A niche product designed by E1DA (Ivan) using ES9038Q2M, providing extremely transparent unbalanced 3.5 mm output. Just a USB DAC. No on-board PEQ, no Bluetooth.
• E1DA 9039S: Another niche product based on ESS's recent ES9039Q2M, boasting measurably the most transparent output with extremely low noise and distortion even under low impedance loads. Just a USB DAC. No PEQ, no Bluetooth. It provides only a 2.5mm balanced connection which should limit usability for some users.
• Topping DX1: Not truly portable but small enough to carry in a bag. Based on the excellent AKM AK4493S chip. Just a USB DAC, no on-board PEQ, no Bluetooth.

With your budget, how about the iFi Go Link or Go Link Max? If you don't mind somewhat large size, the Topping DX1 is also an excellent USB DAC/HP amp.

 

[quiet]

The ultrasonic nonlinear response is there regardless of the DAC's sample rate.

Have you seen the list of recommended portable devices under "Additional Remarks after Part II Tests"?


With your budget, how about the iFi Go Link or Go Link Max? If you don't mind somewhat large size, the Topping DX1 is also an excellent USB DAC/HP amp.

Interesting, my rationale for asking was that I read that a 48kHz sample rate only carried frequencies up to 24kHz.

I did see the recommendations and I checked out the Go Link and the DX1, but they don't have the mic support I was hoping for. I was considering going up to the Qudelix 5K, but I wanted to check for alternatives first. However, I see now that I missed that the HiBy FC3 has microphone support as well, so I think that's my new pick. Thanks!

 

[jkim]

Interesting, my rationale for asking was that I read that a 48kHz sample rate only carried frequencies up to 24kHz.

Only the signal can be played up to 24 kHz (if contained in the recording) at the Fs of 48 kHz. The artifact shown above arises due to the digital filter of the DAC, so it's there regardless of the playback sampling frequency.

I did see the recommendations and I checked out the Go Link and the DX1, but they don't have the mic support I was hoping for. I was considering going up to the Qudelix 5K, but I wanted to check for alternatives first. However, I see now that I missed that the HiBy FC3 has microphone support as well, so I think that's my new pick. Thanks!

The Hiby FC3 (w/ display) was tested at ASR and showed excellent performance for its class. It can supply up to 1.43 Vrms into 33 Ohms and should be able to power your headphones with no trouble.

 

[zany.ninja]

Interesting, my rationale for asking was that I read that a 48kHz sample rate only carried frequencies up to 24kHz.

I did see the recommendations and I checked out the Go Link and the DX1, but they don't have the mic support I was hoping for. I was considering going up to the Qudelix 5K, but I wanted to check for alternatives first. However, I see now that I missed that the HiBy FC3 has microphone support as well, so I think that's my new pick. Thanks!

You might also want to consider the Creative Sound Blaster X1 - which is just a relabelled SXFI Amp. Reviewed by Amir here, currently on sale for about 50$ from Creative's website. Is a little old, but still a solid performer, and quite a bit more powerful than the Hiby FC3. Main drawbacks are no DSD support, and it downsamples high res to 48Khz. But has a few neat features for microphone users, like noise cancellation, auto-mute, mic mute button, etc. SXFI is a gimmick, but can be fun to play around with, is said to be very good for gaming (I never tried it for that). Worth seriously considering imo.

 

[jkim]

You might also want to consider the Creative Sound Blaster X1 - which is just a relabelled SXFI Amp. Reviewed by Amir here, currently on sale for about 50$ from Creative's website. Is a little old, but still a solid performer, and quite a bit more powerful than the Hiby FC3. Main drawbacks are no DSD support, and it downsamples high res to 48Khz. But has a few neat features for microphone users, like noise cancellation, auto-mute, mic mute button, etc. SXFI is a gimmick, but can be fun to play around with, is said to be very good for gaming (I never tried it for that). Worth seriously considering imo.

This is a nice alternative. Measurements by RAA look solid---Amir's measurements were limited by an ASIO driver issue he had before. I agree, for the current price, one may seriously consider it.