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Old Formula 1 video. Nearly an hour long so only watch if you are interested in fairly historic F1. May be spoiled for some by me being in it

Thomas savage

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The "plank" was just a way to make sure the cars were not in the least stable (but highest downforce) region and to give the authorities a way to measure whether you were or not.
With 1mm front ride height representing 0.1 secs it was worth doing everything one could. I used a preloaded stay at the front of the floor set so it stayed to length on the FIA test rig but compressed when the skid touched the floor without exceeding the wear limit ;)
I got about 5 to 7 mm lower that way - a winning margin.
Naughty ha ha , that's what it's all about
 
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Frank Dernie

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It's metal now, you see sparks from it in the night races.
No the bulk of it is still the same but the number and type of metal skid blocksone is allowed to embed in it is specified and changed over the years. We used titanium for years and it sparks, then it got changed to steel which doesn't then back to Ti for the spectacle!
 

Soniclife

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Are they going back to the classic width? That would make the aero easier, at least 50% of work on open wheel cars is reducing the damage caused by wheel wakes.
They are doing a bunch of stuff, designed to improve the racing.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Formula_One_World_Championship#Regulation_changes
It's the first set of rule changes I've seen that actually might improve the racing, but I'm aware of where I am in the Dunning–Kruger curve with this, I'm just hoping Ross Brawn still knows how to interpret a rule book.
 

balletboy

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None of the drivers who make it as far as F1 are mediocre in any sense of the word. They are all stunningly talented, just some more than others.

I think there were one or two who brought in big bucks for their drive. I remember discussing Alex Yoong with his manager, he was with the private Portman team, I think he got his seat with Minardi because he brought them a load of Malaysian money, with no success whatsoever.

Good point about wet weather making overtaking easier, really sorts the men from the boys. The top three in all-wet wins are:
11 wins Hamilton
5 wins Senna
4 wins M.Schumacher
Says it all really. Hamilton's wet-weather win in the British GP in his early days for McLaren was simply stunning.

Can't let the discussion fail to mention the wonderful Tyrrell P34, here with Jody Scheckter on board. I think the idea was to use mini wheels and hide them behind the front wing that was subject to a width restriction. It famously got a 1-2 somewhere in the 1970s, before being banned.
a97ff09742cb3713cba9a5343a0b6a4b.jpg
 

Dialectic

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I was reading the interesting discussion on this thread but finally got around to watching the video. Having been a Formula 1 fan since early 2006, I found it entertaining to see a livelier and simpler era of Formula 1.

I had known of Frank Williams' accident but never knew that he was a quadriplegic and was using his shoulders to propel his wheelchair. It's impressive and inspiring to see him in charge of a dominant team after a life-altering event.

And I'm glad for the sake of his ASR cred that, in the 1980s, @Frank Dernie enjoyed listening to "digitally recorded choral music"!

Thanks to Frank for posting and for sharing his thoughts and recollections about Formula 1 in the thread
 
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Frank Dernie

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I think there were one or two who brought in big bucks for their drive. I remember discussing Alex Yoong with his manager, he was with the private Portman team, I think he got his seat with Minardi because he brought them a load of Malaysian money, with no success whatsoever.

Good point about wet weather making overtaking easier, really sorts the men from the boys. The top three in all-wet wins are:
11 wins Hamilton
5 wins Senna
4 wins M.Schumacher
Says it all really. Hamilton's wet-weather win in the British GP in his early days for McLaren was simply stunning.

Can't let the discussion fail to mention the wonderful Tyrrell P34, here with Jody Scheckter on board. I think the idea was to use mini wheels and hide them behind the front wing that was subject to a width restriction. It famously got a 1-2 somewhere in the 1970s, before being banned.
View attachment 65036
The Tyrell was a misunderstanding actually!
Derek Gardner (talking here to Jody) heard that a reduced frontal area reduces drag, which it does, but actually thought that was the area of the front rather than the silhouette of the front elevation, which is the reality, and dominated by the rear tyres actually.
Nobody copied it which says everything you need to know!
I remember the car coming into the pits at Anderstorp and Roger Hill, the chief mechanic, making a what's wrong gesture to Jody (no radios back then) and Jody pointing to the front where one of the little wheels was missing. Cars don't get back to the pits with a wheel off often.
 
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Frank Dernie

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I was reading the interesting discussion on this thread but finally got around to watching the video. Having been a Formula 1 fan since early 2006, I found it entertaining to see a livelier and simpler era of Formula 1.

I had known of Frank Williams' accident but never knew that he was a quadriplegic and was using his shoulders to propel his wheelchair. It's impressive and inspiring to see him in charge of a dominant team after a life-altering event.

And I'm glad for the sake of his ASR cred that, in the 1980s, @Frank Dernie enjoyed listening to "digitally recorded choral music"!

Thanks to Frank for posting and for sharing his thoughts and recollections about Formula 1 in the thread
Frank's accident was a big shock but one of the real reasons we survived was that Patrick Head actually had always run the company from day to day and Frank got the money together (the hardest job of all!) and had signed some good long term deals before he was injured. He also had final choice of driver, though he did seek recommendations from Patrick, myself and Neil Oatley (who ran one of the cars and managed updates from factory to race team.
I was running the test at Ricard. Peter and Frank came out which was really unusual because Frank hated testing usually because we had a new car and driver which looked like we would blow everybody away in 1986.
He was full of the joys of spring when he left, and as he has said himself, he was going to have a big accident one day.
The fact it was his own fault has helped mim accept it.
I sat in Marseilles hospital all night while they operated on him.
It is a long story so ask if you want me to add still more OT ramblings.
I still visit Frank every 2 to 3 weeks for a cup of tea and a chat about the old days (or was doing before the lockdown, we are both in the vulnerable group now)
I f you are interested I really enjoyed the film made based on Ginni Williams' book, I thought it was well done but how anybody pwersuaded Frank to be in it is a mystery - he tried to destroy every copy of the book back in the day.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Williams_(film)
 

Soniclife

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I f you are interested I really enjoyed the film made based on Ginni Williams' book, I thought it was well done but how anybody pwersuaded Frank to be in it is a mystery - he tried to destroy every copy of the book back in the day.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Williams_(film)
I didn't watch that when it came out, I'd assumed it was a dull PR piece, only watched it after people here praised it, thought it was fascinating when I finally did. Having access to a lot of insight from the women in his life makes it a different film than you would usually get about F1.
 

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I think it's difficult for most folks in the US to understand just how popular Formula 1 is, around the globe. I guess in the world of auto racing, F1 is considered the pinnacle.

For me it always has been Formula 1 and WRC. Rally drivers are a special breed of people, they are nuts. I think I would handle a F1 lap at full speed, but put me next to a WRC driver and I will probably scream like a baby. When they drive it seems like they are actively trying to kill themselves.

F1 drivers are not well equipped for public speaking.
The two things which really stick out in the exceptional drivers I have been lucky enough to work with is they are both very intelligent and introvert. Unintelligent but otherwise quick drivers don't win as much as they should, extroverts crash a lot.
All of them have to come up with some sort of strategy to deal with the pain any introvert feels in the public eye, they are rarely the people they seem in public.
What I really like about the new generation (Norris, Verstappen, Leclerc) is that they also stream them playing sim-racers and join amateur sim-racers. Lando Norris shaving his head on stream was hilarious.

 
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Frank Dernie

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I didn't watch that when it came out, I'd assumed it was a dull PR piece, only watched it after people here praised it, thought it was fascinating when I finally did. Having access to a lot of insight from the women in his life makes it a different film than you would usually get about F1.
Well it is really only peripherally about F1 it is from a book about an eccentric relationship.
 
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Frank Dernie

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For me it always has been Formula 1 and WRC. Rally drivers are a special breed of people, they are nuts. I think I would handle a F1 lap at full speed, but put me next to a WRC driver and I will probably scream like a baby. When they drive it seems like they are actively trying to kill themselves.
You would probably be physically unable to take a flat out lap in an F1 car.
One of the top US single seater drivers, who I promised never to name, wanted to try the World Championship but after a couple of runs his neck muscles were so overloaded he could no longer hold his head up and he was still going 5 seconds off the pace.
He came back the next day but his muscles hadn't recovered enough. It was though a good idea to have a US household name in F1 for financial reasons. He decided the training required was too inconvenient and continued his very lucrative career back home.
 
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Frank Dernie

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Please do.
:)
I was running the test and had just decided to stop after a small fuel pump leak caused a fire which charred the carbon chassis a tiny bit. We were loads quicker than anybody else and had covered the important test items so I decided to be cautious and we were packing up when a youth on a moped arrived asking for me and saying Frank had had an accident and was asking for me.
I assumed he had slid into a ditch and needed a push out (not for the first time) but Nelson was very concerned because he knew the route we took down the hill to the autoroute was dangerous, so we all went.
Nelson had a car phone, almost unknown back then, but not much signal. Nelson, his doctor, Nigel Mansell and myself went. We got to the scene before the ambulance and it was obviously a big shunt, the car was upside down but Peter was out and walking about unmarked. Frank was lying with his head on his briefcase and he looked fine to me, he had a little wound on his head but was complaining his arms hurt, which seemed odd they looked fine.
The ambulance arrived and put him on an inflatable thing before setting off down the hill towards Toulon very slowly. We followed. It became obvious it was serious when the ambulance stopped and a doctor and police car arrived to minister to him by the side of the road.
Nelson finally got through to Bernie Ecclestone, the boss of F1 then and probably Frank's closest friend to tell him.
It was Sunday and when we got to Toulon hospital there was only one young doctor in residence, and it was he who had come up to minister to Frank.
He arranged X-rays. Peter Windsor expected me to take control (!) it is amazing what confidence F1 people have in the engineers, The doctor was obviously overawed and worried to have Frank there. Anyway I looked at the X-rays with him and he explained to me that in his opinion the broken vertebrae had moved far enough to have severed the spinal chord. That was the first shock. He was unsure what to do, the chief doctor was on his way but since he said speed was the essence I suggested he do what he had learned in med school, which was to manipulate the bones back into place before swelling got too much.
When the chief doctor arrived he was obviously "well-oiled", it was after lunch on his day off after all, and annoyed. He said, what are these clowns doing in my surgery, this man is going to die and I am going back to my guests. That was the second shock.

Anyway it had been arranged for an ambulance to take Frank to the big hospital at Marseilles for surgery.

By then Bernie was up to date and I had called Patrick who told Frank's wife, Ginni. Bernie arranged for his 'plane to pick up Professor Sid Watkins, the F1 medical delegate, and bring him to Marseilles. Nigel went in the ambulance with Frank, I went to the airport with Nelson to wait for Sid.

Sid was a bit embarassed. He is (was now sadly) a brain surgeon and knew how good the French doctors are and hoped they weren't offended.
Anyway he went in as an observer and came out to those of us waiting with updates of how it was going. He told us Frank would definitely be quadriplegic but the operation went well. It took all night.

We were travelling home on the Monday so went to the hotel to get some kip. Nigel and I were in the same rental car so we decided to go early to the airport via the hospital to see Frank.
When we got there they didn't want us to go into intensive care. Nigel sent the nurse off to ask somebody more senior and as soon as she went he walked in anyway and I followed. Frank was awake but had loads of external stays holding his head and neck in place.
He looked sideways at Nigel, then at me then said "and who the f*ck is testing then?", so I knew his brain was unaffected.

Thats it really for me, I visited him once he was back in the UK but otherwise it was Ginni and family who looked after his convalescence.
As a keen runner before his super fitness probably saved his life. OTOH he found the exercises he was given during recuperation trivial and didn't bother as a result he did not keep as much strength as he could have had, one of the people with a similar injury who made the lightweight wheelchair Frank ended up with had the same injury but managed to drive with "elbow cup" controls. Amazing.
 

Koeitje

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You would probably be physically unable to take a flat out lap in an F1 car.
One of the top US single seater drivers, who I promised never to name, wanted to try the World Championship but after a couple of runs his neck muscles were so overloaded he could no longer hold his head up and he was still going 5 seconds off the pace.
He came back the next day but his muscles hadn't recovered enough. It was though a good idea to have a US household name in F1 for financial reasons. He decided the training required was too inconvenient and continued his very lucrative career back home.
Physically it would be a problem yes, but mentally it wouldn't. With WRC it would be the reverse :D.
 

DChenery

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Can-AM was known to be pretty wild and wooley. Here's a link to an article w/pics of the legendary Porsche 917 that shut down the circuit.

https://www.autoweek.com/car-life/classic-cars/a32536626/donohue-porsche-917-30-flat-12-photos/

Finally got time to read the article. I remember the car killing everything on the track. At the last race I saw in Edmonton, it actually lapped all the cars on the track, and double lapped the stragglers! I seem to remember it was a different configuration than in the article. After some hunting around this afternoon, I found this, which is an article on the car I saw destroy the field.

http://www.speedhunters.com/2013/06/face-to-face-with-the-destroyer-porsche-917-10-canam/

Hope you enjoy it!!
 

DChenery

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:)
I was running the test and had just decided to stop after a small fuel pump leak caused a fire which charred the carbon chassis a tiny bit. We were loads quicker than anybody else and had covered the important test items so I decided to be cautious and we were packing up when a youth on a moped arrived asking for me and saying Frank had had an accident and was asking for me.
I assumed he had slid into a ditch and needed a push out (not for the first time) but Nelson was very concerned because he knew the route we took down the hill to the autoroute was dangerous, so we all went.
Nelson had a car phone, almost unknown back then, but not much signal. Nelson, his doctor, Nigel Mansell and myself went. We got to the scene before the ambulance and it was obviously a big shunt, the car was upside down but Peter was out and walking about unmarked. Frank was lying with his head on his briefcase and he looked fine to me, he had a little wound on his head but was complaining his arms hurt, which seemed odd they looked fine.
The ambulance arrived and put him on an inflatable thing before setting off down the hill towards Toulon very slowly. We followed. It became obvious it was serious when the ambulance stopped and a doctor and police car arrived to minister to him by the side of the road.
Nelson finally got through to Bernie Ecclestone, the boss of F1 then and probably Frank's closest friend to tell him.
It was Sunday and when we got to Toulon hospital there was only one young doctor in residence, and it was he who had come up to minister to Frank.
He arranged X-rays. Peter Windsor expected me to take control (!) it is amazing what confidence F1 people have in the engineers, The doctor was obviously overawed and worried to have Frank there. Anyway I looked at the X-rays with him and he explained to me that in his opinion the broken vertebrae had moved far enough to have severed the spinal chord. That was the first shock. He was unsure what to do, the chief doctor was on his way but since he said speed was the essence I suggested he do what he had learned in med school, which was to manipulate the bones back into place before swelling got too much.
When the chief doctor arrived he was obviously "well-oiled", it was after lunch on his day off after all, and annoyed. He said, what are these clowns doing in my surgery, this man is going to die and I am going back to my guests. That was the second shock.

Anyway it had been arranged for an ambulance to take Frank to the big hospital at Marseilles for surgery.

By then Bernie was up to date and I had called Patrick who told Frank's wife, Ginni. Bernie arranged for his 'plane to pick up Professor Sid Watkins, the F1 medical delegate, and bring him to Marseilles. Nigel went in the ambulance with Frank, I went to the airport with Nelson to wait for Sid.

Sid was a bit embarassed. He is (was now sadly) a brain surgeon and knew how good the French doctors are and hoped they weren't offended.
Anyway he went in as an observer and came out to those of us waiting with updates of how it was going. He told us Frank would definitely be quadriplegic but the operation went well. It took all night.

We were travelling home on the Monday so went to the hotel to get some kip. Nigel and I were in the same rental car so we decided to go early to the airport via the hospital to see Frank.
When we got there they didn't want us to go into intensive care. Nigel sent the nurse off to ask somebody more senior and as soon as she went he walked in anyway and I followed. Frank was awake but had loads of external stays holding his head and neck in place.
He looked sideways at Nigel, then at me then said "and who the f*ck is testing then?", so I knew his brain was unaffected.

Thats it really for me, I visited him once he was back in the UK but otherwise it was Ginni and family who looked after his convalescence.
As a keen runner before his super fitness probably saved his life. OTOH he found the exercises he was given during recuperation trivial and didn't bother as a result he did not keep as much strength as he could have had, one of the people with a similar injury who made the lightweight wheelchair Frank ended up with had the same injury but managed to drive with "elbow cup" controls. Amazing.

Frank: Thanks. Keep'm coming and we'll have your book done in a couple of weeks. ;)
 

Soniclife

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Well it is really only peripherally about F1 it is from a book about an eccentric relationship.
Good films about sports are rarely focused just on the sport it seems, but the insights into what sort of person is driven to achieve are fascinating, most of us don't spend much time around people like that.
 

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Frank, maybe Bernie E. can arrange a good ghost writer. These insider insights disappear with the individual unless published, and the sport loses parts of its history. Possibly a good retirement project. How many Engineers get to put their perspective forward. No pressure of course. o_O
 
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