Normal XLR cables vs Star-Quad XLR cables

[Tks]

@RayDunzl

No idea if they're local. Their stuff ships for California I think, so that's a bit odd I guess.

 

[misterdog]

To repeat myself:
For balanced XLR interconnects, stick with a Shielded Twisted Pair (STP) with a braided shield.

MAGNETIC REJECTION
The braid or foil shield on the outside of a cable cannot provide any shielding against magnetic fields. This can be demonstrated with a magnet and a copper penny. The force of the magnet will pass through the copper penny without much change. Likewise, magnetic fields can pass through multiple layers of copper and foil shielding without being attenuated.

Power supplies in audio devices, computers, and chargers produce AC magnetic fields that can cause interference in an audio cable. When an audio cable passes near an AC magnetic field, the audio conductors act like the secondary winding in a transformer and picks up a magnetically-induced voltage. This voltage may be AC line hum, AC line-related buzz, or a variety of other unwanted and ugly sounds.

Balanced interfaces can only reject magnetic interference when both the + and - conductors receive exactly the same common-mode interference. If one conductor receives more magnetic interference than the other, the rejection is greatly reduced. In practice, one internal wire will be closer to the magnetic interference and it will see a stronger magnetic field. This imbalance reduces the rejection.



If four-conductor star-quad cable is used, the rejection of magnetic interference can be improved by about 20 to 50 dB compared to standard 2-conductor balanced cable. Star-quad cable uses two conductors for the + audio and two for the - audio. The precise geometric configuration of these conductors causes an equal common-mode pick-up of magnetic interference on both of the + and - conductor pairs. This magnetically-induced common-mode voltage will be rejected if the balanced receiver has a good CMRR.

The full article is well worth a read.
https://benchmarkmedia.com/blogs/application_notes/balanced-vs-unbalanced-analog-interfaces

 

[boswell]

Interesting article but doesn't the article say that consumer level XLR connections on consumer level audio equipment are not providing the noise reduction that balanced can give because there is no processing of the signal at the receiving end. It is the same with the now very popular "balanced" out put from DAPs to IEMs or headphones where 4v drives them rather than the 2v with "unbalanced" but there cant be any noise reduction because the + to gnd and the - to gnd signals are not compared. the result is louder/stronger but less noisy?
A.Consumer

 

[CDMC]

Interesting article but doesn't the article say that consumer level XLR connections on consumer level audio equipment are not providing the noise reduction that balanced can give because there is no processing of the signal at the receiving end. It is the same with the now very popular "balanced" out put from DAPs to IEMs or headphones where 4v drives them rather than the 2v with "unbalanced" but there cant be any noise reduction because the + to gnd and the - to gnd signals are not compared. the result is louder/stronger but less noisy?
A.Consumer

I think you are conflating two issues with consumer equipment:

1) Some consumer equipment with balanced connections is not true differential balanced, which negates the advantage from common mode rejection. Over time, less consumer equipment seems to have fake balanced connections.
2) Consumer equipment runs at 4v max for balanced (approx +14dbu) and pro at 12.25v (+24dbu). This higher voltage gives a 10db potential greater sn ratio.

Here is the catch. Even RCA cables have a sn ratio of over 110db, well in excess of nearly all consumer equipment not to mention the source material and listening environment. Consumer environments also don’t typically have the long runs and electrical noise of pro environments, the primary reason for balanced connections. Nor are consumers mixing 24bit audio where the recording may (but it is extremely unlikely) been made at a low enough level to need the extra sn ratio to retrieve the lowest level information (the recording would have to be made at least -30dbfs, which would only happen by mistake). In real world terms, balanced offers no advantage in a home environment, unless you have a noise issue or very long runs.

That said, I use balanced in my main system as it has them. I also like xlr connectors better than rca. Personally, I use worlds best cables from amazon, the are inexpensive, use good connectors, and wire from canare or mogami.

 

[RayDunzl]

This can be demonstrated with a magnet and a copper penny.

Where can I find a copper penny?

 

[misterdog]

Where can I find a copper penny?

Henry can supply you with one - at a price.

Inside a shed next to his house, Henry has orange tubs filled with 200,000 pennies, and he spends hours sorting through roll after roll of the coins. But it's not just any and all pennies, Henry is only interested in those that are dated from 1982 and earlier because those are the coins made with 95 percent copper. A copper penny is worth more than other pennies -- now mostly made of zinc -- currently priced at $0.024.

 

[watchnerd]

I think there's a greater return on your investment if you know how to solder and put together a cable. One can build a cable with Canare StarQuad and Neutrik connectors for less money than an off the shelf standard XLR cable. Of course this varies with someone's experience and hands on DIY skills.

Blue Jeans cables are so cheap and can be had with Canare and Neutrik that I'm happy to just let them do it for the small price difference.

And their Sonobond ultrasonic welder is waaaay better than my soldering iron.

 

[ripvw]

...And their Sonobond ultrasonic welder is waaaay better than my soldering iron.

I like BJC too but I thought their ultrasonic welder was only used for speaker wire:

https://www.bluejeanscable.com/articles/ultrasonic-welding.htm

 

[MacCali]

I’m new to audio, but it seems like the benefit of a short interconnect cable needing this extra shielding is probably overkill. Design cable has great prices and from my search audioblast is either out of business or unable to keep up with demand.

For long runs this cable is superior. Besides that on a short run not much more can make this cable the better deal vs the cost

 

[watchnerd]

I like BJC too but I thought their ultrasonic welder was only used for speaker wire:

https://www.bluejeanscable.com/articles/ultrasonic-welding.htm

Oh, I have their speaker wire, too.

I've got the Canare star quad with locking bananas.

 

[phoenixsong]

I don't like star quad because they don't work with the crimp terminal XLR ends I prefer. You can't fit two barrels of insulation in the open barrel crimp terminal.

For soldered XLR terminals, they're fine.

Hi, could you tell me the reason behind your preference for crimp connectors? I've been hearing mixed things and have trouble figuring out which is better

 

[Ron Texas]

Where can I find a copper penny?

I have at least 600 of them wrapped 50x

 

[jhaider]

Hi, could you tell me the reason behind your preference for crimp connectors? I've been hearing mixed things and have trouble figuring out which is better

Personal lack of inclination to solder, ownership of the right crimp tool/die for the Neutrik crimp XLRs.

Functionally I would say both approaches (soldering with minimal skill, crimping with the right die) are fine.