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Nice Female Rock Band! The Warning
- Thread starter amirm
- Start date
I watched few episodes of this documentary and found it very interesting. It's on my to do list to catch the episodes I missed.
Women Who Rock
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Women Who Rock
Women Who Rock (TV Series 2022– ) ⭐ 7.3 | Documentary, Music
Women Who Rock: With Shania Twain, Susanna Hoffs, Sheryl Crow, Nancy Wilson. Features interviews with several female pioneers in music and pays homage to those who have stormed the stage and wielded their instruments.
m.imdb.com
LOL - I first ran across The Warning 9 years ago when they were kids...
They've changed quite a bit.
Martin
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So watch this and tell me you don't think it was for men.
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Or this from Glastonbury.
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And the original for comparison.
As I said in the private convo you initiated but apparently lost interest in, there's not doubt pop (and rock) stars and groups may well trade on sex appeal. But I wasn't kidding about a generation gap. I was a child last century and a teenager for the first decade of this one, for 70s and 80s rock references I dive into my parents' taste (my mum remembered the Pretenders) which is entirely cool. There was certainly an explosion of female artists from the late 70s. I'm not a fan of blues-based rock (to put it another way, I like the rock but not the roll) so that bluesy Led Zeppelin stuff is almost as bad as country to my ear (otoh the angle Houses of the Holy takes on that stuff is not bad at all). But I didn't grow up with it and if you did you'll have a different feeling for rock music I imagine.
So some recent rock'n'rollers playing to sexist tropes looks more like Stockholm syndrome to me. Ok I'm not always enamoured of mainstream and a Disney product like Miley breaking out into same isn't going to have initial appeal. Previous generations certainly internalised the male gaze because that was the only perspective on offer. Obviously some still do. of course you can find examples galore.
But I did actually say I was hard pressed to think of a female artist/group that I like a lot that writes/performs/dresses to please men. I did subsequently think of Babymetal
but looking at my list of most played stuff per Apple Music I can see (from the top) Arca, Charli xcx, Banshee, Cherry Glazerr, Poppy, Swan Meat, yeule, Coucou Chloe, Jack Off Jill, MIA, FKA twigs, Gurldoll, Alice Glass, Kelsey Lu, Lana Del Rey, London Grammar, Agnes Obel ... so to the extent that you addressed that question to me, then not really for men (for people, sure). Where does that leave things?
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Sounds like Metallica-lite to me.
Nothing new here.
As for killer drums - I guess, if hitting hard is your thing..
OP
- Thread Starter
- #50
You missed the part where I said "and singing." How many examples of that do you have that do it with such comfort?
OP
- Thread Starter
- #52
It leaves you confused. Seems like you only listen to those singers rather than watch their videos. Here is Lana Del Rey who is one of my favorite singers:But I did actually say I was hard pressed to think of a female artist/group that I like a lot that writes/performs/dresses to please men. I did subsequently think of Babymetal
That video has whopping 610 million views! You think appealing to men with sex is not part of the appeal?
I randomly picked another name on your list, Cherry Glazerr. Went to her channel on youtube and this is the second official video on it:
It gets worse from there if I pick the first name on your list, Arca:
It is just stunning to me how little you know about what is obvious to everyone in the world that sex is part and parcel of music these days.
Fixed it for you
I credit you for diving in rather than ignoring, and appreciate it. I'm well aware of LDR's success, but that song and the video depiction is about doomed, self-destructive relationships. Reading it as sexual invitation to men would be weird, a level of gaslighting that boggles the mind. You'd be aware of her body of work I imagine, which makes that interpretation even more odd. Saying it has a beautiful aesthetic is a different response, I think. Are you maybe conflating them?
Diving into two artists you appear unfamiliar with does "get worse from there". You appear to argue that expressions of sexuality depicted are by women for men? Taken to the (not uncommon) extreme some men think that simply by existing in public, women invite a sexual response. You don't argue that of course but I'm sure you know how f*cked up that is. And how tiresome. The second song you picked is from the album "I don't want you any more" and you must miss the repeated lyric "you make me want to crawl away, I'm so ashamed, I'm not this way" and the entirely ironic presentation. A number of her songs are quite raw explications of sexual abuse. Presented for men? In a way, but certainly not the way you appear to be interpreting. Again, ignorance of an artists's body of work is a solid route to misinterpretation.
What did you think the third video was about? Arca is a trans woman, I'm quite certain her body of work, performances and videos re gender and sexuality are entirely different from a likely superficial reaction implied. But elaborate if you like, I'm not sure where you were going there..
But again, I did appreciate your effort even if we diametrically disagree on several aspects. And I haven't suggested that alongside interesting work on the myriad aspects of human desire by the artists I listed we don't also have hackneyed sexual tropes executed with crude economic efficacy by many others. But to help with the context thing and end on a lighter note, Clementine offers what must be a documentary on a woman's experience participating in threads like this on ASR. Astonishingly accurate, how did she do it?
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LoL... I stopped assuming that women peacocking is always for men many years ago.
gg*LoL... I stopped assuming that women peacocking is always for men many years ago.
Haha, I could've saved myself a lot of typing if I'd just thought to say that.
I don't find much wrong with Amir's initial post, but it's still interesting that the word "Female" must be included in the title. Would anyone even mention "male" in the title if all the band members were men, and would anyone call it a "Nice Female and Male Rock Band!" if there was a mix of both men and women in the band?
I have a book suggestion written by Kim Gordon from Sonic Youth. The title of the book is Girl in a Band and was named so because she often got questioned throughout her whole career about how she felt "being a girl in a band".
The “girl in a band” reading of women’s musical worlds is clearly a rhetorical opening salvo, but one that Gordon reports (in her 2015 memoir Girl in a Band and elsewhere) was formative to her identity as a woman playing music, most famously in Sonic Youth. She felt objectified and that her complexity as a whole person was compromised, stashed under a reductive label of woman (i.e., the girlfriend, the eye candy). For any human being, stereotyping is terrifying and deeply horrible. But the girl-in-a-band myth has been unraveling—in both women’s production of music and women’s writing about music—for many decades.
I find it interesting that anytime somebody uses one of the two gender terms that they are sometimes scrutinized and made to feel as if they are doing something incorrectly. It's become nauseating and trivial but the agenda must roll on I guess.I don't find much wrong with Amir's initial post, but it's still interesting that the word "Female" must be included in the title. Would anyone even mention "male" in the title if all the band members were men, and would anyone call it a "Nice Female and Male Rock Band!" if there was a mix of both men and women in the band?
I don't find much wrong with Amir's initial post, but it's still interesting that the word "Female" must be included in the title. Would anyone even mention "male" in the title if all the band members were men, and would anyone call it a "Nice Female and Male Rock Band!" if there was a mix of both men and women in the band?
I have a book suggestion written by Kim Gordon from Sonic Youth. The title of the book is Girl in a Band and was named so because she often got questioned throughout her whole career about how she felt "being a girl in a band".
The “girl in a band” reading of women’s musical worlds is clearly a rhetorical opening salvo, but one that Gordon reports (in her 2015 memoir Girl in a Band and elsewhere) was formative to her identity as a woman playing music, most famously in Sonic Youth. She felt objectified and that her complexity as a whole person was compromised, stashed under a reductive label of woman (i.e., the girlfriend, the eye candy). For any human being, stereotyping is terrifying and deeply horrible. But the girl-in-a-band myth has been unraveling—in both women’s production of music and women’s writing about music—for many decades.
Oh great suggestion, I didn't know about it. I do like Sonic Youth a lot. The quote is entirely on point.
On the thread subject line and band, I agree. The fact they are three sisters is more notable and rare. We have Haim also, and probably some others. A thread on sibling bands would be pretty interesting.
That is interesting for sure... a repository of YouTube and other sources of music videos to check out.
