Newb's experiences with Minidsp Flex Dirac Live

[middlemarch]

It isn't hard to believe. You can find many people on just ASR alone who have been dissatisfied for a wide range of reasons. Search for "Dirac sounds bad." There's tons of good advice in those threads for people who want to try to twist Dirac into working. It isn't an easy button and people who can roll their own, like me, may learn it isn't an easy button the hard way

Unfortunately I have to agree with you (I really wish Dirac Live worked better). Some folks have good results, I also was not one of them. I think Dirac comes into its own with Bass Control, and finally achieves what it originally set out to do with ART (at least I hope so, just bought the full ART suite yesterday, and an A1H to run it on). Problem with the miniDSP approach and Dirac is that none of their products support Bass Control or ART. If you then have to limit correction to under 250 or 300 Hz, it then seems you're not getting a whole lot of bang for the buck.

As always, your mileage may vary

 

[Miniyouuuu]

Until Dirac Bass Control arrives to MiniDSP, you need to integrate the subwoofer with the main speakers before any interaction with Dirac Live.

You must integrate the subwoofer by placing it in the best possible location to avoid cancellations or to complement the cancellations from the main speakers that you cannot avoid.

Once you have placed the sub in the best spot, you have to integrate it in terms of volume and phase with the speakers. That requires establishing the crossover point (for the sub and, if you wish, for the speakers).

My advice is to do all of this in REW. It is a manual process that Dirac should theoretically handle, but ultimately you learn to do it quickly and well. I even recommend generating the PEQ in biquads from REW and importing them into MiniDSP.

Personally, I prefer not to touch the speakers at all and apply all PEQ to the subs, as they are usually the ones with room mode issues.
With the sub well-integrated, you can then open Dirac and perform all the measurements.

Dirac will recommend an automatic curve. I do not recommend it. It tries to be too perfect and alters the sound significantly. I prefer to replicate the average curve between the left and right channels and prevent Dirac from trying to fill dips. However, you can use Dirac to smooth out some peaks above the baseline.

When exporting, I recommend testing two alternatives: exporting with gain/delay enabled and exporting to another preset with gain/delay disabled. When I used the UMIK-1 microphone, I preferred gain/delay disabled; now that I use the UMIK-2, I prefer leaving it at the default (enabled).

On the other hand, although Dirac recommends different curtains, I would discard any correction in Dirac below 60Hz and above 800Hz. Move the curtains to that spectrum. Below 60Hz, it tends to want to fill dips and generates delays that ruin the bass, and above 800Hz, it can force a very metallic and unnatural sound.

You might ask yourself… why do I want Dirac if I had to go through a complex manual process beforehand? Because Dirac does one thing very well that is much more complicated with REW: it adjusts phases across the frequency curve and achieves a much more precise sound.

But be careful, as it is highly dependent on the precision of the microphone and the precision of the measurement positions. If you measure the center, then 40cm to the right, and then 70cm to the left, it will shift the image to the left. Try to ensure that any movement away from the center is exactly symmetrical relative to it. The main measurement is very important, but other measurements affect the soundstage.

 

[Keith_W]

You know, I honestly don't know what Dirac (non-DLBC, non-ART) does that REW can't do. Maybe someone who knows about DSP can tell me. You can adjust the phase with REW too, if you knew what to look for. Maybe it's just easier to use?

 

[Miniyouuuu]

REW doesn’t create FIR filters. Just export IIR filters or data to provide to an external software like RePhase or Dirac. Does it matters? IIR affect linearity, FIR don’t. But due to the amount of processing FIR filters require, Dirac does use IIR for low bass filters and FIR for higher frequencies.

Dirac makes simple the way of setting the average of many spots. That’s possible in REW but require many steps.

Additionally to that, to my experience Dirac is good for the final step, but I prefer to prepare Dirac with some previous work. Maybe with Dirac Art it is not necessary…

 

[Ellebob]

I will comment on any of the EQ systems. Whether it is Dirac ART, Audyssey, ARC Genesis, YPAO, etc. I've been a calibrator for decades. Any of these EQ systems are taking their best guess on what is going on in the room. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. That's why you will often hear I got better results doing it manually or when turning it off.

Even when I talk to manufacturers with these devices they say things like. "It will get you 85% there but if you want to get the best you need to do a manual calibration."
"Don't rely on a box to fix your problem."
They know these EQs are flawed and can't figure out every situation. Trinnov is the best in my opinion. No other EQ system does what Trinnov does. Of course no other system can tell where the sound is coming from, that's why they use four microphones. No other system does remapping. But as good as Trinnov is, it can still mess up.

I remember one of our instructors saying, "Acoustics is easy, just follow the rules." "Acoustics, like real estate it is all about location, location, location and location. Location of seating, location of speakers, location of subwoofers, location of acoustic treatments." Now in most homes it is very difficult to get everything in the proper locations. That typically only happens in dedicated spaces. Trying to fix things with EQ one has to make smart decisions based on room setup. There are times we can EQ a dip in the response, other times we can't.

These EQ systems are making decisions whether to fix a peak or a dip without having any knowledge of speaker response or what is going on in the room. They have certainly gotten better over the years but they are not perfect. Listening is key, and if you don't like the sound with the EQ turned on and it sounds better with it off. Then don't use it. It stinks with MiniDSP that you pay extra for these features when it doesn't work. There are tricks about using these systems to improve your chances of getting a good result.

Doing manual measurements and finding out what is happening in each seat is crucial. Knowing how the speakers measure is also important. What does an EQ system do when one seat has a dip at a certain frequency and another seat has a peak at that same frequency? Does it fix the peak? Does it fix the dip? Does it just average it out? Does it leave it alone? Sometimes you shouldn't measure certain seats. It is reality that it can't fix it for every seat. We need to accept that sometimes there's going to be some cheap seats in the audience. Don't correct for those seats. If all seats measure similarly then an auto EQ will have a good chance of having a good result. This typically only happens in designed rooms where seats are placed in specific locations, and 2 or more subs are used.

Using REW for measurements and getting a better idea what's going on your room. You should be able to make smart decisions about speaker and sub placement as well as mic placement and Dirac. I bet the you will get a better result. I commend you for taking the time to learn!

 

[Miniyouuuu]

In all cases after Dirac implementation I would recommend another REW check. There you’ll find if everything went as expected.

 

[「 ✦ JIM ✦ 」]

Hi OP, I'm relatively new to Minidsp and it has been a total game changer for me! I've finally been able to integrate my subs without guessing and the combined eq on the mains has taken my system into a different dimension. It really has opened my ears to what is possible and what performance was hiding away all these years. I recon I've improved my system by 50% when I consider all the factors! I did opt to skip the Dirac in all fairness as I was not happy about the potential of it excessively boosting frequencies as I do like to listen loud well into the late 90dB's on regular occasions. It was a bit of a learning curve using REW. Not so much learning the software but applying some logic as to best approach the tuning as there are so many ways to accomplish the same thing.

 

[「 ✦ JIM ✦ 」]

Not strictly related to Dirac, but rather a newbie question in relation to the setup of minidsp - is it better to adjust the sub level directly in the sub or use the gain settings in the Minidsp dashboard? I've done it directly in the sub as I have easily adjustable settings via the Arendal app. Would doing it in the Minidsp be a digital adjustment rather than analogue down at the sub considering I'm using the Minidsp dac?

 

[Mort]

Not strictly related to Dirac, but rather a newbie question in relation to the setup of minidsp - is it better to adjust the sub level directly in the sub or use the gain settings in the Minidsp dashboard? I've done it directly in the sub as I have easily adjustable settings via the Arendal app. Would doing it in the Minidsp be a digital adjustment rather than analogue down at the sub considering I'm using the Minidsp dac?

It almost certainly won't change the quality of the audio. Most of us leave the subwoofer at Max volume and adjust through the minidsp so we only manage in one place and that reduces errors.