New system - WiiM Ultra + Fosi V3 Mono's

[facefirst]

So, after watching with interest from the sidelines and having seen the simply abysmal performance of the Naim Uniti Atom, I have finally pulled the trigger on a new set of electronics. I am selling my Uniti Nova (used prices are still insane so fingers crossed I get a decent amount back...) and replacing it with a WiiM Ultra as the core of the system and a pair of the V3 Mono amps. My speakers are 88db / 6 ohm nominal so there should be more than enough power. What I am really keen to report back on is if they actually sound different. I have a sneaky suspicion that Naim add a little colour to their outputs which could be why so many people like their stuff even though objectively it is pretty poor. It's based on nothing but a hunch though and tbh I don't intend to go through the proper testing needed to properly compare.

Quite excited tbh.

 

[facefirst]

So, after watching with interest from the sidelines and having seen the simply abysmal performance of the Naim Uniti Atom, I have finally pulled the trigger on a new set of electronics. I am selling my Uniti Nova (used prices are still insane so fingers crossed I get a decent amount back...) and replacing it with a WiiM Ultra as the core of the system and a pair of the V3 Mono amps. My speakers are 88db / 6 ohm nominal so there should be more than enough power. What I am really keen to report back on is if they actually sound different. I have a sneaky suspicion that Naim add a little colour to their outputs which could be why so many people like their stuff even though objectively it is pretty poor. It's based on nothing but a hunch though and tbh I don't intend to go through the proper testing needed to properly compare.

Quite excited tbh.

Also, if anyone is reading this:

Would it be worth using a pair of these on each of my speakers? I have no idea what effect (if any) splitting each RCA into two would have, or whether having that much power to spare is actually needed. But for lolz it might be a thing...right?

 

[staticV3]

Also, if anyone is reading this:

Would it be worth using a pair of these on each of my speakers? I have no idea what effect (if any) splitting each RCA into two would have, or whether having that much power to spare is actually needed. But for lolz it might be a thing...right?

There's frankly no point to passive bi-amping. Just a waste of money and resources.

Improvements can be had via bi-amping by moving the crossover upstream of the Amps, like what you see in modern studio monitors, but that's not an easy process.

Bi-amping 101

This article provides a quick look at how bi-amplification works. The conventional scheme is to split the signal into two frequency bands before the power amplifiers that drive the speakers. The bass (LF) amp sees only LF signals and drives only the LF driver (woofer). The treble (HF) amp sees...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[facefirst]

There's frankly no point to passive bi-amping. Just a waste of money and resources.

Improvements can be had via bi-amping by moving the crossover upstream of the Amps, like what you see in modern studio monitors, but that's not an easy process.

Bi-amping 101

This article provides a quick look at how bi-amplification works. The conventional scheme is to split the signal into two frequency bands before the power amplifiers that drive the speakers. The bass (LF) amp sees only LF signals and drives only the LF driver (woofer). The treble (HF) amp sees...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Funnily enough I stumbled across that article just after I posted my question. Thanks for the reply.

 

[facefirst]

OK so all arrived and set up. Two things to note:

a single stereo RCA cable works when the amps are stacked but will not reach if they’re not.

The WiiM volume progression is waaaay more linear than the Naim, meaning you need to dial in more to get the volume. This is a good thing because you could never use most of the volume dial on the Naim anyway.

In terms of sound…they sound the same. The room correction is subtle but I’m impressed with the results.

Question: for the 2v RCA output on the WiiM, what gain setting would you use on the amps? 25 or 36…?

 

[staticV3]

Question: for the 2v RCA output on the WiiM, what gain setting would you use on the amps? 25 or 36…?

Use the lowest amplifier gain that still allows you to reach your desired listening level.

This rule can be applied to all playback systems, headphones or speakers.

Also, it's worth looking into manually setting the WiiM's PEQ parameters, including enabling the Sub output and trying different Xover frequencies, even if no Sub is used.

Better results can be achieved this way, vs just running the WiiM's automatic room correction.

 

[Stratofever]

having seen the simply abysmal performance of the Naim Uniti Atom

Have you heard it ?
What's on paper is one thing, what you hear is another.

Also, what speakers are you using? Changing that has even greater impact than your amp

 

[facefirst]

Have you heard it ?
What's on paper is one thing, what you hear is another.

Also, what speakers are you using? Changing that has even greater impact than your amp

I've got the Nova version, which whilst I cannot 110% say is basically the same, I would be surprised if it wasn't basically the same internals albeit with a more powerful amplification stage. It sounds lovely. My speakers are Sonus Faber Olympica II's. I've got the new amps and WiiM and it sounds...pretty much the same but at 1/5th the cost, which is awesome.

 

[Stratofever]

I have a similar setup, using a Naim Uniti Atom with Dali Rubicon 2
They are bookshelves, but actually less efficient then your Olympica II (87db at 4 ohm vs 88db at 6ohm)
So they actually need to be driven a bit more with a less powerful amp than yours.

What I can tell you, is that the biggest difference remains the source of your sound.
There's a big difference if using Analog in, Toslink, Coax or Airplay.
Airplay being the least appealing sound by far in my case, and Toslink gave the best result from streaming lossless data (against analog in using an ESS9068 and ESS9018)

What input were you using on your Nova for testing? Maybe your 9039Q2M is better than the Nova's inner DAC!

I would keep the Ultra, try different inputs on your Nova and then compare that best result vs the Fosi.
I am not ready to believe the the Fosi will give you the same "muscular and energetic" sound that your Naim will... in fact Fosi has a tendency to sound a bit thin and lifeless.

Then there's the whole wiring conversation, RCA wires used, speaker wires... so many factors add up to the equation in order to achieve the most optimal sound !!!

 

[BlackTalon]

I would keep the Ultra, try different inputs on your Nova and then compare that best result vs the Fosi.
I am not ready to believe the the Fosi will give you the same "muscular and energetic" sound that your Naim will... in fact Fosi has a tendency to sound a bit thin and lifeless.

Then there's the whole wiring conversation, RCA wires used, speaker wires... so many factors add up to the equation in order to achieve the most optimal sound !!!

I was okay until I hit the last couple sentences...

facefirst, you have definitely been on the better path. And the wires/ cables are not relevant unless there is an issue with a connection, etc.

Naim has their fans. Which is fine. But if there is a different 'sound' base on the input used that is a red flag for me.

 

[Stratofever]

But if there is a different 'sound' base on the input used that is a red flag for me.

It seems to be the case, I do suggest trying all of them out... I've spent hours A/B testing to confirm it.

And the wires/ cables are not relevant unless there is an issue with a connection, etc.

I used to think that too but you'd be surprised how much it influences your sound, some speaker wires are best with some amps, depends on impedance and reactance of your setup.

 

[facefirst]

Honestly, I don't think the wiring is a factor in my set up. Everything is OFC, decent thickness and with proper connections etc. I've also made sure that power and signal cables aren't in the same runs to eliminate any (likely non-existent) noise. The Naim is beautiful device, but I cannot get around how much more performance you can get at a fraction of the cost. I also now have more of a base to mess around with, as the current set up is more flexible.

 

[telemike]

me too

 

[3ddi3@udio]

This forum is nice to see. I am also giving this WiiM Ultra and Fosi V3 mono amp combination a try. I've been using a Yamaha CA810 running into a pair of Klipsch RP500M speakers and R-120SW subwoofer. But that old amp is starting to give out, so time for a change. Time to step into some current gear I suppose. Going to keep those Klipsch speakers for the time being. So far I really like the look of the Ultra unit, especially the size. That CA810 though a beauty with those VU meters was a full size beast. I also purchased a pair of Fosi amp fans as I've heard they V3's can get rather hot. I'll keep you all posted as I put everything together and start spinning some vinyl and streaming some Spotify. Cheers!

 

[staticV3]

This forum is nice to see. I am also giving this WiiM Ultra and Fosi V3 mono amp combination a try. I've been using a Yamaha CA810 running into a pair of Klipsch RP500M speakers and R-120SW subwoofer. But that old amp is starting to give out, so time for a change. Time to step into some current gear I suppose. Going to keep those Klipsch speakers for the time being. So far I really like the look of the Ultra unit, especially the size. That CA810 though a beauty with those VU meters was a full size beast. I also purchased a pair of Fosi amp fans as I've heard they V3's can get rather hot. I'll keep you all posted as I put everything together and start spinning some vinyl and streaming some Spotify. Cheers!

Would highly recommend you apply the 7-band PEQ preset that can be found in the "Data & EQ" tab below:

Measurements for speaker Klipsch RP-500M

www.spinorama.org

Spoiler: Preset

Preamp: -2.3 dB

Filter 1: ON PK Fc 72 Hz Gain +2.99 dB Q 0.25
Filter 2: ON PK Fc 117 Hz Gain -4.30 dB Q 0.87
Filter 3: ON PK Fc 910 Hz Gain -2.26 dB Q 1.90
Filter 4: ON PK Fc 1642 Hz Gain +2.98 dB Q 2.33
Filter 5: ON PK Fc 6818 Hz Gain -0.45 dB Q 2.63
Filter 6: ON PK Fc 11476 Hz Gain -2.37 dB Q 0.25
Filter 7: ON PK Fc 16239 Hz Gain -3.25 dB Q 1.10

Dashed is stock response, solid with EQ:


That leaves three PEQ filters to knock down room modes.

A preset for the RP-500M II is available as well, in case you own that version.