New Sigberg Audio development thread: The Sentinel - A music oriented reference subwoofer developed for the Manta system.

[Sigberg Audio]

I must say, these look serious.

And the removal of the timber bit makes them look much more upmarket too.

Am I close perhaps in thinking around £40,000 - £45,000 for the full set up (two subs)?

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Thank you. I hope to land them a little bit lower than that, but you're in the ballpark. There are some unknowns yet with regards to pricing on the subs. The Mantas alone (no subs) are a little more than 16000GBP currently.

 

[Sokel]

Okay, time to share some early renderings of the new baby. Alongside the Manta to get an impression of the scale. Manta is a pretty big monitor, so feels a bit weird that it suddenly looks small. Testing carbon fiber base on the Mantas in these renderings, would be a nice cohesive touch given the fact that the Sentinel drivers are carbon fiber. Not sure if this will be a reality yet.

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And below a couple of illustrations of the subs stacked, for those who think 4x15" per side is reasonable.. I like how the shaped sides (and also the grills when attached) form a satisfying pattern when stacked.
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I was right about it, admit it

(seems like a natural path, doesn't it? )

 

[Sigberg Audio]

I was right about it, admit it

(seems like a natural path, doesn't it? )

I don't remember what you said (please remind me), but yes I'm sure you were.

 

[Sokel]

I don't remember what you said (please remind me), but yes I'm sure you were.

Since your plans are essentially about an extended 3-way with the new sub been more like a bass extended module, perfectly made for Manta...

(My suggestion, a while back, was about a bass module, rather than a sub )

 

[Sigberg Audio]

Since your plans are essentially about an extended 3-way with the new sub been more like a bass extended module, perfectly made for Manta...

(My suggestion, a while back, was about a bass module, rather than a sub )

Hm, I'm not sure I understand the difference. This new sub (bass module) won't conceptually be any different than our current subwoofers (?)

 

[Sokel]

Hm, I'm not sure I understand the difference. This new sub (bass module) won't conceptually be any different than our current subwoofers (?)

Usually the difference is about range and specific use.

If I understood correctly, it will acoustically and visibly supplement Mantas (even in a stacked configuration and used as stereo units(?) )
If the above is true and the x-over point is well above the usual 80Hz, it's then a bass module (to the Mantas, specifically)

 

[Salt]

Put the Manta on top of the bass module, and you get bass extension.
Use the subs independently to fit into room, you get sub extension.

 

[Sigberg Audio]

Usually the difference is about range and specific use.

If I understood correctly, it will acoustically and visibly supplement Mantas (even in a stacked configuration and used as stereo units(?) )
If the above is true and the x-over point is well above the usual 80Hz, it's then a bass module (to the Mantas, specifically)

To an extent you are correct, yes.

While the Sentinel can be used with any speakers, it's explicitly designed to complement the Mantas.

The footprint of the Sentinel is larger than the Manta, so the Manta will fit on top. The Sentinel also is so tall that the height of the Manta on top of it will be reasonable to get the tweeter in a good position. But beyond that, they will not be specifically designed to have the Mantas on top.

The crossover to the Mantas will be 100hz, the same as our current subwoofers.

 

[Sigberg Audio]

Manta with dark/black wood base instead of carbon. This is likely to be what we'll end up with, real carbon will be too complicated without any functional benefit, and I don't want to do just a carbon wrap.

 

[Paul7777x]

So much better imo.

But… I don’t understand why there has to be a visible ‘base’ at all?

It would look much cleaner and more ‘ ‘professional’ as a build with just a single, non differentiated front (and side) panel. Same finish from top to bottom.

 

[Sigberg Audio]

So much better imo.

View attachment 537235

But… I don’t understand why there has to be a visible ‘base’ at all?

It would look much cleaner and more ‘ ‘professional’ as a build with just a single, non differentiated front panel. Same from top to bottom.

There doesn't have to be, but that's a design element I chose to implement to make it stand out a bit. Some will like it and some will not.

 

[JohnnyNG]

There doesn't have to be, but that's a design element I chose to implement to make it stand out a bit. Some will like it and some will not.

Gorgeous.

 

[Paul7777x]

There doesn't have to be, but that's a design element I chose to implement to make it stand out a bit. Some will like it and some will not.

Fair enough naturally, and I’m not yet likely to have the cash, and if/when I did I’d go for the Sarannas.

But I really don’t see what this curious thing of adding ‘design’ elements is?

The Orbit 11 with their daft orange ring to kill a good design. And the new Clarity 66 with the totally unnecessary wiggly lines among others.

I’d argue that the Cardioid slots are exactly enough to make the Manta stand out quite delightfully among more bland designs.

Adding a further element can be seen as one to many in a small space. Too ‘busy’.

And sometimes a design needs to be as visually simple as possible to stand out; as anything else detracts from an otherwise impressive form.

Still. Not my job. And I hope you take it as a mere comment from a friendly voice.

 

[Sigberg Audio]

Fair enough naturally, and I’m not yet likely to have the cash, and if/when I did I’d go for the Sarannas.

But I really don’t see what this curious thing of adding ‘design’ elements is?

The Orbit 11 with their daft orange ring to kill a good design. And the new Clarity 66 with the totally unnecessary wiggly lines among others.

And sometimes a design needs to be as visually simple as possible to stand out; as anything else detracts from an otherwise impressive form.

One reason can be from the manufacturers perspective that you want something that can make the product identifiable and distinct from other products. McIntosh is a good example of this. Like the design or not, but everyone who has even a passing interest in hifi can immediately see that it's a McIntosh when they see one.

Another can be to add some visual aesthetics to increase pride of ownership or appreciation of craftmanship / build quality for the customer.

A manufacturer can succeed or fail at both of course, but these are at least two examples of (imo) legitimate reasons to create something beyond a painted square with drivers in it.

That being said, my designs are largely examples of form follows function. But I appreciate the fact that someone putting down tens of thousands of USD in a product expects a certain level of fit and finish as well, not necessarily just functional performance.

 

[Paul7777x]

One reason can be from the manufacturers perspective that you want something that can make the product identifiable and distinct from other products. McIntosh is a good example of this. Like the design or not, but everyone who has even a passing interest in hifi can immediately see that it's a McIntosh when they see one.

Another can be to add some visual aesthetics to increase pride of ownership or appreciation of craftmanship / build quality for the customer.

A manufacturer can succeed or fail at both of course, but these are at least two examples of (imo) legitimate reasons to create something beyond a painted square with drivers in it.

That being said, my designs are largely examples of form follows function. But I appreciate the fact that someone putting down tens of thousands of USD in a product expects a certain level of fit and finish as well, not necessarily just functional performance.

I edited my post a bit before your quote sir. My bad.

Ps, I’d still buy them, naturally.

I’d just have to strip the front and have it resprayed.

 

[Sigberg Audio]

I edited my post a bit before your quote sir. My bad.

Ps, I’d still buy them, naturally.

I’d just have to strip the front and have it resprayed.

No worries, and you may find it looks a bit different in real life. Also the stands are built so the plate the speakers are resting on is invisible in practical use, so some think the base is part of the stand instead of part of the speakers. Here's a pic where the speakers are white obviously so a bit different look again, but you see what I mean with the stands anyway.

And with this planned dark wood for the Manta Sentinel version, it will be very very dark, the same that's used on the Saranna. So it will more like a subtle shift in texture than a very distinct base. It looks even darker than in the picture in real life unless the room is very bright.

 

[Thighsofsteel]

No worries, and you may find it looks a bit different in real life. Also the stands are built so the plate the speakers are resting on is invisible in practical use, so some think the base is part of the stand instead of part of the speakers. Here's a pic where the speakers are white obviously so a bit different look again, but you see what I mean with the stands anyway.
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And with this planned dark wood for the Manta Sentinel version, it will be very very dark, the same that's used on the Saranna. So it will more like a subtle shift in texture than a very distinct base. It looks even darker than in the picture in real life unless the room is very bright.
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I assume that is an iPad in the middle? What is it sitting on? Is that a Lyngdorf to the left of the iPad?

 

[Paul7777x]

I assume that is an iPad in the middle? What is it sitting on? Is that a Lyngdorf to the left of the iPad?

Didn’t notice that. Looks like a 3400.

Wondering if Mr S is checking out RP?

 

[Thighsofsteel]

Didn’t notice that. Looks like a 3400.

Wondering if Mr S is checking out RP?

Would be a sensible move

 

[Paul7777x]

Would be a sensible move

It would imo. Certainly.

I really do wish Lyngdorf (or preferably Purifi) would build an RP enabled preamp/dac/streamer for those of us who prefer actives.

A 3400 without the power amp section would be bliss for me.