New receiver for my setup.

[Slaviola]

Hello there (im new).
Im from Poland, so first im sorry for my not best English...

Ok, so what i have now:

Anthem MRX 520
5x Dali Rubicon LCR on Walls
1x SVS SB-4000

Some time ago, i just prepare my living room for bether audio experience.
The entire ceiling is covered with acoustic panels.
Several acoustic panels on the walls.

Now I am thinking of a new receiver.
Why?
My is only 5.1 - in the future, I would like to install ceiling speakers under Dolby Atmos.
My is ARC - i wan't to have eARC.
My don't support DSD - in the future i want to buy some good SACD player.

I think the Anthem is not the best companion for Dali speakers. Recently I was listening to a friend's set: Marantz SR8012 + Dali Oberon speakers, and it sounded better, especially in stereo.

When buying a new receiver, I would like it to be optimal both in the cinema and in stereo. The maximum amount I would like to spend is 3000$.

I've read reviews and opinions about the new Anthems, and they're not very positive. Maybe something from the Marantz stable?

Maybe you can recommend something else?

Best regards.
Slawek.

 

[FrantzM]

Denon AVR X3700 , reviewed here and one of the best performance of all AVR reviewed here ... As for DSD, I believe the Denon supports it.. For some odd reasons although coming from the same stable stable (D&M Holdings) Denon seems to consistently outperform Marantz on the reviews here.
But I would not just rule out the Anthem just because you thought your friend system's sounded better: Different room, speakers, setup, configuration, settings ..etc.. thus not a good comparison. I would also point that, Electronics past a certain level of measurable level of performance-related parameters do not make that much of a difference , you will soon realize...
Peace

 

[Slaviola]

Denon AVR X3700 , reviewed here and one of the best performance of all AVR reviewed here ... As for DSD, I believe the Denon supports it.. For some odd reasons although coming from the same stable stable (D&M Holdings) Denon seems to consistently outperform Marantz on the reviews here.
But I would not just rule out the Anthem just because you thought your friend system's sounded better: Different room, speakers, setup, configuration, settings ..etc.. thus not a good comparison. I would also point that, Electronics past a certain level of measurable level of performance-related parameters do not make that much of a difference , you will soon realize...
Peace

THX for reply.

So you are telling me, that maybe a new Denon receiver will be better than my Anthem?

I see some reviews, that Denon have better sinad to dB than a Anthem or Marantz. So it means that the sound from Denons have more quality than others?

Denon receivers have a high quality DACs like AK or ESS Sabre? I think, some receivers have a very good built in DACs, like Marantz Sr8012, Yamaha A3080. So when that receivers have a good quality DAC, it can make better output of the speakers?

 

[Golfx]

the SINAD measurements you read about on this website are also an indication of what Amir calls good engineering hygiene for the entire machine. Denon outperforms mathematically their Marantz partners who stubbornly add unnecessary distortion to create a “warmer” sound. The concept of desiring better (higher) SINAD numbers is to find AVRs that do not alter the sound but just present it as it was originally recorded and then amplify it. The sound you hear will be most decidedly changed by your choice of speakers and then room EQ correction. Denons have a reputation of bug free reliability and good engineering hygiene. I too would recommend Denon.

 

[abdo123]

i think people are focusing too much on SINAD and are forgetting the big animal in the room. Both Marantz and Denon have mediocre room correction.

I would buy personally one of the new Onykio or Pioneer AVRs just for the Dirac Live room correction and Dirac live bass control.

 

[Golfx]

Audyssey multEQ xt32 with app got a very favorable review on this website.

 

[peng]

THX for reply.

So you are telling me, that maybe a new Denon receiver will be better than my Anthem?

I see some reviews, that Denon have better sinad to dB than a Anthem or Marantz. So it means that the sound from Denons have more quality than others?

Denon receivers have a high quality DACs like AK or ESS Sabre? I think, some receivers have a very good built in DACs, like Marantz Sr8012, Yamaha A3080. So when that receivers have a good quality DAC, it can make better output of the speakers?

Points to consider:

On Denon receivers vs your MRX-520:

- Whether "Denon receivers" is better than your Anthem would depend, yes even the AVR-X3700H measured much better than the MRX-520, and is a little more powerful, but depending on you application, you may or may not hear a difference, let alone "better" in terms of sound quality as perceived sound quality is a subjective thing. That being said, the MRX-520 did show a lot higher distortions especially at lower output level, it currently rank last among all AVR measured by ASR. Some people may not (but many do, I assume) prefer accuracy, transparency, neutrality anyway and those will then have to go and listen for themselves, and all I can say to them is good luck trying.. Obviously it also depends on which "Denon receiver" you will be comparing to. Note: Do you think you can tell a difference between 0.1% THD and 0.05%, assuming both contain mostly lower order harmonics such as the 2nd, 3rd, 5th.., just an example.. If better than 0.1% THD is critical for you then you probably should replace the MRX-520.

To me, I would always go with specs and measurements first and my ears after.. that's settled but that's just me. Also, what you perceived as "sounding better" between two AVR may disappear if you compare them in a tightly controlled blind listening test.

On comparing Denon and Marantz:

- Denon and Marantz use the same parts (example: volume control, DAC, opamps etc.. for their audio and video sections, there may be some slight differences between their corresponding models but I doubt there is anything that would result in audible differences.

- Both (again, for comparable models, such as between the AVR-X6400H and the SR8012) have almost identical circuitry in the preamp/DAC section, the main difference is that Marantz models have what they call HDAMs, that I think are there mostly for marketing reasons, that you need people to believe it has a "signature sound". If you read some of their service manuals you will see that the HDAMs are placed right at the end of the preamp/DAC signal chain so logically no matter how good they perform, they will be limited by the weakest part upstream, all they can do it to provide another buffer just before it passes the signal to the power amp section.

- If you compare the schematic diagrams of a couple of their corresponding models you will see that they look identical.

- Not sure about Europe, here in North America, all else being equal, Marantz would cost significant more most of the time though I have seen when on sales, Marantz sometime could cost less (have only seen that happened in Canada though).

Based on available information, one may conclude the following:

- Denon's measured significantly better in SINAD of the preamp/DAC section.
- Denon's measured a little better in IMD.
- SNR/DR tended to be similar in most cases.
- For digital inputs and at 44.1 kHz sampling frequency, Marantz models (seem to be only since 2016 or 2017) have a slight roll off from about 10 kHz, due to their use of a slow roll off DAC reconstruction filer.
- Their comparable models will have almost the same power amp output and distortions, though the SR6000 and SR8000 series have slightly larger power supplies than the Denon AVR-X3000H and AVR-X6000H series models. The X4000H and SR7000 series seem to have the same size power supplies.

So if you like Marantz look, go for it, but if measurements are important to you, go with Denon's. The SR8015, the newest Marantz model, appears to be the only Marantz model that measured as good as Denon's.

 

[Chrispy]

Denon & Marantz being sister companies, they share a lot more than they are different. Here in the US seems they market the Marantz at a bit higher price for the same feature set, but then some of the Denons have measured a bit better, but doubt that's an audible difference. My Denons do support dsd, surprised the Anthem doesn't; Marantz seems to also. I think Anthem is overpriced myself

 

[Slaviola]

So... where is the sweat spot?

Where i shout go?

Denon?

Marantz?

Or maybe some other brand?

Some my friend have a used Marantz Sr8012 in black version (this colour is best for my setup), and it can sell my for about 2000$.

What do You think Guy's, and Girls?

 

[Chrispy]

Denon, Marantz and Yamaha would be where I'd look these days. Be nice if Onkyo/Integra/Pioneer shows they can be stable as a company and compete for the long run, certainly their new avrs featuring Dirac REQ are very interesting. Pick by the price and features/connectivity primarily; for details about a unit diving into the unit's manual is a good idea (like how to find if it can handle a dsd stream). Amp sections in avrs simply aren't going vary a whole lot, nor be as powerful/capable as what separate amplification might do. If you really need more capable amps, get an avr with a full set of pre-outs so you can have amp flexibility.

You might play around with an spl calculator to help out with estimating amp needs for your particular listening levels and distances from speakers.

 

[Golfx]

Seems like you have an opportunity to purchase the Marantz 8012 used in the color you want. I owned the 8012. It provided flawless operation. So ?

 

[Slaviola]

Seems like you have an opportunity to purchase the Marantz 8012 used in the color you want. I owned the 8012. It provided flawless operation. So ?

You are owner of SR8012.

How is good in stereo?

 

[Golfx]

You are owner of SR8012.

How is good in stereo?

I sold it and upgraded to a Denon AVR A-110. The 8012 was the well reviewed top of the line for Marantz at the time. It sounded fine. It was trouble free.

 

[Chrispy]

You are owner of SR8012.

How is good in stereo?

Why would 2ch stereo be particularly difficult?

 

[Slaviola]

How about the new Anthems?

There is no serious reviews of its.

Oh, is there any differents with MRX 740 vs 1140? There is difference in amplifying channels, but is there more?

 

[Golfx]

the anthems have had a hard fall/winter/summer Covid season with lots of buggy software in their new launches.

 

[Slaviola]

Oh, I forgot.

How about new Arcam AVR5?

It's entry level, but have some good futures like:

- Dirac Live

- 2x ES9026Pro DACs (like AVR30)

I don't know why, but bigger brothers like AVR10 and 20 don't have this DACs.

I don't have in the pass the products from Arcam. How its sounds, compare to Anthems AVR's? The sound signature is warm/cold, bright/dark?
It will be a good partner with my Dali speakers and SVS sub?