New Ortofon "Concorde Music" Cartridges

[Snoopy]

Why would someone use this cartridge over a regular one? Is the shape special?

 

[Emulator II]

The Concorde Elite has been around for a while, right? Retailers like Turntable Lab emphasize that it's an "audiophile listening model" and not really for DJing. It is certainly priced for the role at $400+ It's even porkier at 18.5g, of course, which is no help to you.

It may be that the Concorde Elite is touted by retailers as an “audiophile listening model”. But a recommended tracking force of 3g, just a naked elliptical stylus and the whole thing being offered for $/€400 are not necessarily specs that will make the hifi enthusiast squeal in delight.
Regarding the weight of the current Concords, there is of course always the option of flanging some weight onto the back of the tonearm as a workaround, but it remains - a workaround.

 

[mhardy6647]

Why would someone use this cartridge over a regular one? Is the shape special?

With the "universal" tonearm, they're plug and play (other than VTF and anti-skate, if one partakes).
The original "Concordes" were standard 1/2 inch mount cartridges with a "droop snoot" characteristic that was reminiscent of a certain supersonic aircraft.

Somewhat later, the all in one bayonet mount cartridge(s) came along, mostly for club use, but also (as I recall) as a "universal" competitor to the emerging (???) P-mount cartridge/arm design(s).

In the modern era (20-25 years ago), the Concorde(s) - and some imitators* were for DJ/scratch use.

Now they seem to be back and perhaps (???) now in some weird Schroediger-esque superposition of quantum eigenstates -- club or hifi/'audiophile' cartridge? Yes -- and no -- at the same time(?).

______________
* I realized while typing this very reply that the "Concorde" here is in fact a Stanton knockoff from the 1990s.

 

[J.M. Noble]

Now they seem to be back and perhaps (???) now in some weird Schroediger-esque superposition of quantum eigenstates -- club or hifi/'audiophile' cartridge? Yes -- and no -- at the same time(?).

That's a great line. But more practically, the specs seem a little better than the 2M parallels, they are less expensive, and they are fuss-free on the tonearms they're designed for. I'm annoyed that I found out about this while the 2M Blue stylus replacement for my SL-1500C is wending its way through UPS.

 

[Watire]

There is clear differences between the cartridge of the Concorde line. On this video the output levels and tonal variations are quite obvious.
Kudos to the Acoustic Shop channel.

 

[J.M. Noble]

There is clear differences between the cartridge of the Concorde line. On this video the output levels and tonal variations are quite obvious.
Kudos to the Acoustic Shop channel.

Yes, but this new line is clearly different from the previous Concordes so I don't think we can assume anything from those tests. They appear to be, and Ortofon certainly wants us to think they are, a repackaged 2M series with some minor tweaks to the business end.

 

[DSJR]

I remember the 'Concordes' as plug-in-'SME-type of old' types with an 'OM' version in traditional half-inch mount fixing - you need to go back forty years for their ancestry... Certainly the DJ fraternity kept the style alive but throughout, I believe the OM versions were available in one form or another. SME themselves had a version of their series III tonearm 'wand' with a Concorde head attached to the end and very good they were too as I remember.

In between, Ortofon had the chunky 500 and VM series which haven't lasted as long on sale and anyway, the 2M's replaced them pretty much (not sure the innards were hugely different though).

I was sad to see the old 'Super' OM range decimated to just a bottom range model after so many decades, but then the 2M range has also been around a heck of a long time now and arguably superceded it on the domestic scene. the 'Super body had slit poles offering slightly better hf performance where the standard ones didn't. I think the 2M range had this superior internals even in the basic lively Red version.

P.S. The 2M range has a slimmer version especially for Rega decks, or turntables with Rega arms where a slimmer profile cartridge would be preferred.

 

[Anton D]

Yes, interchangeable styli…

High End Munich 2024—Tracking Angle's Day Three Coverage

the day included a "future of analog reproduction" panel discussion

trackingangle.com

Ortofon introduced a new line of Concorde "plug in" cartridges modeled after the 2M series but with one big difference: here you can start with the "red" and by changing styli move all the way up to the LVB (Ludwig Van Beethoven) Shibata, which features a nude diamond mounted on a boron cantilever. None of these are meant for DJ scratching!

 

[tio Jimmy]

Looks like Ortofon announced a new "Concorde Music" series of cartridges last week. It parallels the 2M series with Red, Blue, Bronze, Black, and Black LVB models. Prices on Ortofon's website are the same as the bare 2M cartridges, which of course works out to be less than a 2M + headshell combo.

Info here:

Ortofon Concorde Music | Premium Moving Magnet cartridges

Concorde Music stands as an icon of design and musical dedication, inviting everyone to elevate their journey with the level of accuracy in sound which has become characteristic for every Ortofon cartridge.

ortofon.com

I don't see any information about replacement styli.

 

[tio Jimmy]

Looks like Ortofon announced a new "Concorde Music" series of cartridges last week. It parallels the 2M series with Red, Blue, Bronze, Black, and Black LVB models. Prices on Ortofon's website are the same as the bare 2M cartridges, which of course works out to be less than a 2M + headshell combo.

Info here:

Ortofon Concorde Music | Premium Moving Magnet cartridges

Concorde Music stands as an icon of design and musical dedication, inviting everyone to elevate their journey with the level of accuracy in sound which has become characteristic for every Ortofon cartridge.

ortofon.com

I don't see any information about replacement styli.

The new Ortofon Music BODIES are absolutely interchangeable... the styli/styluses match the 2M scheme in level of quality... no Red/Blue or Bronze/Black bodies... you can go from Red to Black LVB with the same body, don't even have to adjust stylus pressure (just maybe rake angle)... also, while the styli/styluses look similar to the OM/Concorde, they attach differently, a tiny metal clip as opposed to just friction fit... I hope this clears matters up.

 

[Verig]

I was very pleased when I read the announcement. To be honest, I've been wondering for a while why Ortofon doesn't offer its own "HiFi Concorde", since it wasn't originally a DJ system and many people simply use the appropriate Technics players just to listen to music.
Unfortunately, a look at the specs shows that these systems, at 18g, are once again too heavy for many vintage Technics HiFi decks, im my case a SL-Q3. Even on the classic 1200/1210, these new systems can only be used with the auxiliary weight. In the past, Ortofon offered the Concorde systems with a weight of 15g, for example, which would make much more sense on most vintage Technics players.

I've owned a hifi Concorde for two years now. These things haven't been advertised much.

My old Fisher (Marantz) deck is fine with it but then again my version is from the previous generation and has tracking force of 3g instead of 1,8g.

 

[Verig]

It may be that the Concorde Elite is touted by retailers as an “audiophile listening model”. But a recommended tracking force of 3g, just a naked elliptical stylus and the whole thing being offered for $/€400 are not necessarily specs that will make the hifi enthusiast squeal in delight.
Regarding the weight of the current Concords, there is of course always the option of flanging some weight onto the back of the tonearm as a workaround, but it remains - a workaround.

I'd guess more like Anniversary 40 model which is 300€ with elliptical nude and normal 1,8 tracking.

I have the low end brother of the 40. 150€ and it's pretty much like 2M Red but interestingly with 3g tracking.

Anyway, it's good to see Ortofon doing this. Great many new vinyl buyers and up with Audio Technicas if they are lucky or something more interesting. These carts offer plug and play hassle free experience and therefore in practise these will sound much better for people who can't or don't know how to adjust anything.

 

[petebone]

I had a Club Concorde CC pair and they ran super hot at 8mV with 3g tracking.. worked well for DJ stuff but they overloaded anything else I ran them through.

This new non-DJ one looks interesting though

Sorry that I am asking this basic question but what does it mean for a cartridge to run hot? You mean temperature-wise, correct? If so, is that damaging to the vinyl or is it affecting sound? Thanks.

 

[Verig]

Sorry that I am asking this basic question but what does it mean for a cartridge to run hot? You mean temperature-wise, correct? If so, is that damaging to the vinyl or is it affecting sound? Thanks.

Output voltage. 8mV is a lot. Normal for MM is around 4-5mV. For low output MC carts much lower around 0,3-0,5mV.

Edit: It will affect sound quality (extremely) if your preamp can't handle that much. But this is not something you need to consider with normal hifi carts. DJ stuff can be a bit different.

 

[Watire]

The great HiFisquarepants from youtube has posted audio as a blind test confronting the Ortofon Concorde Music Black with its brother the Ortofon 2M Black.

 

[J.M. Noble]

Youtube isn't ideal for this, but I thought B sounded a smidge more rolled-off on the top end.

 

[Watire]

Youtube isn't ideal for this, but I thought B sounded a smidge more rolled-off on the top end.

You can download the lossless original files from a link provided on the youtube page if i'm not mistaking. You can give it a try. HiFisquarepants is the real deal...

 

[knobtwiddler]

If your preamp can't handle a cart with a nominal o/p of 8mV then it's very poorly designed! I have tested relatively basic MM preamps that can handle tens of mV before they clip.

As an aside: a few weeks back, I tested a certain Swiss preamp ($$$) that runs on 9v batteries... It had particularly poor headroom (I tested 2 examples). It makes me wonder that the company is actually somewhat style-over-substance, with nice billet-machined parts - but mediocre electronics. I don't even think the lack of headroom was necessarily due to the 9V, but more down to the 'discrete' (read: nice marketing) circuitry, which couldn't swing near the rail limit. My experience with a lot of boutique discrete stuff is that it rarely swings near that which a modest IC such as a 5534 can achieve, let alone modern ICs that go really near the rails.

As they say up North in the UK: "you don't get owt for nowt". Hotter output has to come at the expense of a compromise between FR flatness and / or output impedance. I have *tried* to listen to the DJ concordes, but every modern one I've tried has exhibited a fierce peak in the high mid / treble (the green ones from the 80s have lower output and do not have the same vicious upper mid). No DJ that I know likes the newer Concordes. If you see them being used at clubs / festivals, check that they are actually playing music, not timecode records (many DJs use the decks for timecode vinyl, not music). I have seen that the OM30 cart measures around 4x the THD at 1KHz of my best hifi carts (about 1.8% vs 0.4% on the same test record). An associate reckons that one of his test records showed 3% THD with a modern DJ Concorde.

FWIW...

 

[petebone]

If your preamp can't handle a cart with a nominal o/p of 8mV then it's very poorly designed! I have tested relatively basic MM preamps that can handle tens of mV before they clip.

As an aside: a few weeks back, I tested a certain Swiss preamp ($$$) that runs on 9v batteries... It had particularly poor headroom (I tested 2 examples). It makes me wonder that the company is actually somewhat style-over-substance, with nice billet-machined parts - but mediocre electronics. I don't even think the lack of headroom was necessarily due to the 9V, but more down to the 'discrete' (read: nice marketing) circuitry, which couldn't swing near the rail limit. My experience with a lot of boutique discrete stuff is that it rarely swings near that which a modest IC such as a 5534 can achieve, let alone modern ICs that go really near the rails.

As they say up North in the UK: "you don't get owt for nowt". Hotter output has to come at the expense of a compromise between FR flatness and / or output impedance. I have *tried* to listen to the DJ concordes, but every modern one I've tried has exhibited a fierce peak in the high mid / treble (the green ones from the 80s have lower output and do not have the same vicious upper mid). No DJ that I know likes the newer Concordes. If you see them being used at clubs / festivals, check that they are actually playing music, not timecode records (many DJs use the decks for timecode vinyl, not music). I have seen that the OM30 cart measures around 4x the THD at 1KHz of my best hifi carts (about 1.8% vs 0.4% on the same test record). An associate reckons that one of his test records showed 3% THD with a modern DJ Concorde.

FWIW...

Would you recommend something else in the Concorde price range?

 

[knobtwiddler]

For DJ / slip-cueing (i.e. rugged) or Hifi listening?