New Neumann stuff announcing Friday 9/12

[Tom C]

Well…
I am an ignoramous, but I’ll ask. At this point, what is there to improve? If it is not possible to introduce a speaker with lower distortion than current lineup (at reasonable cost…oh what wailing if the price goes up further!!!), or lower bass roll off, or more SPL, then there is no point in an “updated” product.

 

[boxerfan88]

Well…
I am an ignoramous, but I’ll ask. At this point, what is there to improve?

That’s actually a very good question. I think from driver, amplifier, crossover standpoint; what the current models have are already very very good. Whatever driver improvements would be marginal/small (as we saw with the recent subwoofer launch).

Most of the improvements were around adding DSP and AoIP support. (120 II, 810 II, 870 II.)

 

[dfuller]

That’s actually a very good question. I think from driver, amplifier, crossover standpoint; what the current models have are already very very good. Whatever driver improvements would be marginal/small (as we saw with the recent subwoofer launch).

Most of the improvements were around adding DSP and AoIP support. (120 II, 810 II, 870 II.)

The 310 is the only one in the current line up that really needs any improvement. Everything else is about as good as you'd ever need it to be.

 

[boxerfan88]

KH350 is intriguing. 3-way portrait format?

A-la “baby KH420” or “upsized KH150”?

 

[respice finem]

Well…
I am an ignoramous, but I’ll ask. At this point, what is there to improve? If it is not possible to introduce a speaker with lower distortion than current lineup (at reasonable cost…oh what wailing if the price goes up further!!!), or lower bass roll off, or more SPL, then there is no point in an “updated” product.

This is in line with their philosophy, make a near perfect product and stick to it.

That said, there were some minor changes "under the hood", different PSU etc.
And, there is always room for small but nice modernizations like adding digital-in and DSP, auto standby etc.
More SPL, well, at least I won't need it, sitting 1.3 m away it would "blast my head off".
And they'll probably not boost SPL, which would require BR, in this form factor.

 

[LTig]

For their standards, 10 years is not long
The "grandfather" is much older, and still strikingly similar.

Test: Klein+Hummel O300 - AMAZONA.de

Klein+Hummel ist ein deutsches Traditionsunternehmen und ist bisher vor allem im Bereich von Rundfunk-Regielautsprechern bekannt geworden. Im Jahr 2005

www.amazona.de

... and still going strong here, in their 25th year.

 

[respice finem]

... and still going strong here, in their 25th year.

My KH 310A are five years old now, if they will last 20 more, I'll be 78, so next step = SOTA hearing aids (if I'll live this long).

 

[zonk]

The permanent demand for updates of very well designed products is in my opinion total nonsense and contra-productive for longevity of a good product, environmental aspects and value retention included.

A new model like the KH350 could be a good addition to the lineup by filling the gap between the KH310 and KH420. The worst case could be that KH310 and KH420 will only get minor improvements and DSP integration. But even then they are great products.

 

[Tovarich007]

Honestly I don't know what takes them so long
The KH310 is about 10 Year old if I'm not wrong

Why change what's good enough for most users ? Couple them with a DSP/MA-1 equipped sub and you have a SOTA and future proof system.

A new DSP version of the 310, or other new monitors in their range, will add only a marginal improvement.
A contrario, those new subs can add important improvements.

 

[Tovarich007]

The 310 is the only one in the current line up that really needs any improvement. Everything else is about as good as you'd ever need it to be.

Why should they need improvement ? DSP ? maybe but in itself it doesn'at change much the sound and you can use them with DSP subs, or without subs with an external EQ/room correction software.
Even the 310 is pretty good as it is now. Many studios still use this with great satisfaction, that's what matters

 

[Pearljam5000]

Why should they need improvement ? DSP ? maybe but in itself it doesn'at change much the sound and you can use them with DSP subs, or without subs with an external EQ/room correction software.
Even the 310 is pretty good as it is now. Many studios still use this with great satisfaction, that's what matters

It could benefit from a better woofer like in the KH120 II and KH150

 

[Matias]

I was really surprised how deep these new subs are. Not bass extension, but actual physical size. Looks like the front is conventional 10" but then it extends a lot on the back.

 

[kharan]

I was really surprised how deep these new subs are. Not bass extension, but actual physical size. Looks like the front is conventional 10" but then it extends a lot on the back.

They are exactly the same depth as the old ones, down to the millimeter.

 

[Pearljam5000]

I was really surprised how deep these new subs are. Not bass extension, but actual physical size. Looks like the front is conventional 10" but then it extends a lot on the back.

It's not like the old ones were short

 

[kharan]

Yeah, that amount of volume probably allows them to be pretty efficient as subwoofers go.

200W of amplification for the old KH 810, 180W for the new KH810 II.

 

[Sokel]

No mains monitors still?
Next!

 

[ppierre]

Yeah, that amount of volume probably allows them to be pretty efficient as subwoofers go.

200W of amplification for the old KH 810, 180W for the new KH810 II.

Nearly 4000 € (incl. VAT) for 200 Watts ! It's very high efficiency!!!

 

[Curvature]

Well…
I am an ignoramous, but I’ll ask. At this point, what is there to improve? If it is not possible to introduce a speaker with lower distortion than current lineup (at reasonable cost…oh what wailing if the price goes up further!!!), or lower bass roll off, or more SPL, then there is no point in an “updated” product.

The horizontal radiation pattern control. As you move up in size it's pushed from 1.1kHz with the KH80 to 450Hz with the KH420, if following the -6dB contours. The difference in audible sound is found in these shapes. Newer models have improved smoothness as well.

Graphs and Measurements for Neumann KH 80

www.spinorama.org

Graphs and Measurements for Neumann KH 420G

www.spinorama.org

Cardioid speakers push pattern control much lower, usually in exchange for higher distortion.

Graphs and Measurements for Dutch Dutch 8C

www.spinorama.org

 

[SuicideSquid]

The U87Ai is transformer coupled. Plus, some of their transformerless mics (e.g. TLM102, TLM170, TLM107) are very well regarded.

That said, the KM184's problem isn't that it's a bad mic (it's fine, if nothing particularly special), it's that it sounds nothing like a KM84 - which it replaced in Neumann's catalog. It's way, way brighter.

You're right, it's the TLM102/103 that are transformerless. All have the reputation for being overly bright, though they are studio standards for vocals. The u87AI also has a reputation for brightness, and for not being as good all-around as the u87i which it replaced.

The KM184's are one of those products where, if they were priced competitively I'd call them decent, but because they cost 3-5x as much as mics that perform similarly, I could never recommend them.

 

[zonk]

Nearly 4000 € (incl. VAT) for 200 Watts ! It's very high efficiency!!!

It's more than a stereo sub.

The KH 810 II is a subwoofer for medium sized rooms, providing bass extension. It includes a unique and flexible Bass Manager for stereo, surround and immersive systems up to 7.1.4. Analog and digital outputs provide flexible connectivity to up to 11 studio monitors.