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New Neumann KH 310 II and KH 350 Rumors: Leaked Pricing & Info

DJBonoBobo said:
They seem to also have (or at least use) a Klippel NFS. Markus Wolff talks in the video from around 1:20:10 about their anechoic chamber and how they are compensating for it´s lack of precision below 100 Hz. He mentions three things: 1. outdoor ground plane measurements, 2. simulations and 3. "there is a technology from another german company with that you can measure down to very low frequencies under even anechoic conditions" (with the disadvantage of being very slow compared to the anechoic chambers). I guess number 3 is the NFS.
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Yes, from what I had heard they used to send their more recent designs to a measurements provider with a NFS, possibly even Klippel themselves.
 
pedrojoaquimborges said:
Bit of a high standard when you consider the context for this. "For whoever is familiar with speaker design" - I guess you could say this to minimize any discussion whose content isn't at the very frontier of its field. For whoever's familiar with the newest mechanic engineering research, any "lower" discussion about cars will be very ordinary.

I might be wrong, but I'd never seen an audio brand with reputable, widespread and well measuring products speak so directly of R&D issues, especially when they connect to legacy product limitations. The whole woofer redesign segment directly addresses the 310's greatest limitation and even points at the spider being a big cause for it, for example. I actually remember thinking it was odd for them to be saying that much at multiple points through the video.

But I do agree it'd be extremely interesting to watch them discuss the issues yiu mentioned.
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I mean, it's a lot of general speaker design and not a lot of things specific to Neumann and their speakers. It's not a bad video, it's just disappointing to me specifically because I was more interested in Neumann speakers, and already knew they were designed sensibly.

Karmacoma said:
He implied they did their best to make it play as low as possible.

For practical reasons. They tuned everything around it differently: cabinet, port, damping, filtering, excursion, and of course dsp. This conventional wisdom doesn't apply to dsp speakers.
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Not sure about as low as possible. Both the KH420 and the KH310 mk1 play they midrange dome lower than the 310 mk2 and the 350.

Even with DSP, you can optimise more with different T/S parameter, whether it's worth managing another model of driver is another question.

thewas said:
Yes, from what I had heard they used to send their more recent designs to a measurements provider with a NFS, possibly even Klippel themselves.
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It might be why he said it was time consuming. An NFS scan at your own facilities is fast, especially if you run it overnight.
 
kharan said:
Not sure about as low as possible. Both the KH420 and the KH310 mk1 play they midrange dome lower than the 310 mk2 and the 350.

Even with DSP, you can optimise more with different T/S parameter, whether it's worth managing another model of driver is another question.
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I guess they don't know what they're doing.
 
Karmacoma said:
I guess they don't know what they're doing.
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That's not what I said.

Like if you gain 0.5 dB Max SPL at 50 Hz with a fully optimal driver for the sealed enclosure, and it costs you 200k€, is it really worth pursing?
 
kharan said:
That's not what I said.

Like if you gain 0.5 dB Max SPL at 50 Hz with a fully optimal driver for the sealed enclosure, and it costs you 200k€, is it really worth pursing?
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If the premature estimates we did here turn out to be correct, they gained 10-15 dB max spl at 40hz with the new driver + dsp on the 310. If they, on top, managed to integrate that woofer in the 350 and have it perform to the lineup's standard, that sounds like two birds with one stone. And quite a significant spec improvement.
 
pedrojoaquimborges said:
If the premature estimates we did here turn out to be correct, they gained 10-15 dB max spl at 40hz with the new driver + dsp on the 310. If they, on top, managed to integrate that woofer in the 350 and have it perform to the lineup's standard, that sounds like two birds with one stone. And quite a significant spec improvement.
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We don't know any of that, comparison between the 310 and 310 II are inconclusive or show the 310 to be better than the 310 II. We certainly have no reliable data at 40 Hz to compare both.
 
kharan said:
We don't know any of that, comparison between the 310 and 310 II are inconclusive or show the 310 to be better than the 310 II. We certainly have no reliable data at 40 Hz to compare both.
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So your assumption is that Amir's NFS mk1 distortion measurements + Neumann's mk2 distortion measurements are not reliable data?

I'd get it if you were arguing about Neumann's measurements from 20 years ago, since they even mentioned their limitations in the video.
 
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pedrojoaquimborges said:
View attachment 558231View attachment 558232
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pedrojoaquimborges said:
So your assumption is that Amir's NFS mk1 distortion measurements + Neumann's mk2 distortion measurements are not reliable data?

I'd get it if you were arguing about Neumann's measurements from 20 years ago, since they even mentioned their limitations in the video.
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Amir has recently warned that comparing his distortion figures against other distortion figures might lead to inaccurate conclusions and that the measurement results greatly depend in the measurement conditions. Neumann said it was improved, and by 5 dB in some of the bass range, beyond that, it's difficult to know more.
 
kharan said:
Amir has recently warned that comparing his distortion figures against other distortion figures might lead to inaccurate conclusions and that the measurement results greatly depend in the measurement conditions.
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Fair enough. I guess at some point we'll get Amir's measurements on these new models and have the means to compare.
 
Hello everyone, first time posting on this amazing forum, long time reader though. I had a chance to listen to KH 350 in a showroom a few days before its official release. The room speaker was placed in, was far form ideal, the positioning of the speaker was also in the middle of the room. I can say that I was still really impressed by the speaker, even tho I was hearing some of harsher semblance on very well mixed tracks in couple occasions, but I think it was more of a room issue.Directivity felt very good, stereo image was amazing, I could hear details of the familiar songs what I never heard before, like quiet rim shot click on far right side etc.. I was originally in market for 420s for my upcoming project of setting up mixing mastering studio, after hearing these speakers I think I will wait for independent measurements first then I might grab this over bigger 420s, which probably will need much bigger room. I am thinking 350s + dual 805s, but I've also red on neumanns website that 750s can also be paired with them, my question is which one you think is better sub pair for 350s? Do you consider 350s + dual 805s or 750s proper mastering grade system if its placed in a good room and calibrated with ma1, or you would go for something like D&D 8c for the similar price?
 
T.Worker said:
Hello everyone, first time posting on this amazing forum, long time reader though. I had a chance to listen to KH 350 in a showroom a few days before its official release. The room speaker was placed in, was far form ideal, the positioning of the speaker was also in the middle of the room. I can say that I was still really impressed by the speaker, even tho I was hearing some of harsher semblance on very well mixed tracks in couple occasions, but I think it was more of a room issue.Directivity felt very good, stereo image was amazing, I could hear details of the familiar songs what I never heard before, like quiet rim shot click on far right side etc.. I was originally in market for 420s for my upcoming project of setting up mixing mastering studio, after hearing these speakers I think I will wait for independent measurements first then I might grab this over bigger 420s, which probably will need much bigger room. I am thinking 350s + dual 805s, but I've also red on neumanns website that 750s can also be paired with them, my question is which one you think is better sub pair for 350s? Do you consider 350s + dual 805s or 750s proper mastering grade system if its placed in a good room and calibrated with ma1, or you would go for something like D&D 8c for the similar price?
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A nice problem to have. Your in the age and realm of near perfect measuring monitoring systems. Consider Genelec and Ascilab as well. I own speakers from all these brands and i can not say any is particularly better than the other. It will probably come down to personal preference or festure set or even aesthetics and roomfit
 
So basically the KH350 is the KH310 II in a bigger cabinet? Is it worth the extra $$$?
 
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