New GR-Research Video - Audiophile Cable Truths

[Mnyb]

I thinks a better to debunk the actual bad ideas instead of reacting to any specific video about said bad idea all the time , there is always a next video with the same flaked idea ? and next ...

Like Amir did , with his wholesale debunking of all USB decrappifiers and all Audiophile Ethernet switches .

But if you say Danny and mr Guttenberg are "big names" in todays audio community ? which i don't know much about admittedly . And not the next random guy it can have merit to make an official flaying somewhere They are obviously living of this Bs

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

I can't tell if you're meaning to talk to pma or about pma, but if it was the latter, I'm pretty sure pma is not one of those people you are talking about. He's firmly grounded in reality and has deep engineering knowledge both in and out of audio from what I've read of his posts over the years.

I used to think it was a waste of time to care about misinformation or engage with those who spread it, but several recent events in the world have changed my mind. I guess this is only audio, though. It's not like PS Audio is going to cause real damage to society.

Sure, which is why the last little line in my comment is there.

I just disagree with his notion about why these threads exist.

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

I thinks a better to debunk the actual bad ideas instead of reacting to any specific video about said bad idea all the time , there is always a next video with the same flaked idea ? and next ...

I find that having a nice, fresh example of the myth in action is a great foundation for some debunking. Specific examples make things far more concrete. When you start a comment off with a statement such as "I hate it when they say this..." what you invariably get is "do you have any examples of them saying that?"

 

[aschen]

I liked watching his youtubes. I can look by some of the nonsense for some interesting tidbits. I suspect he makes some real improvements to some of the speakers, mostly from straightening out some Janky frequency responses.

However likening "cable skeptics" to flat earthers is a step too far, absurd, and unforgivable for me. Someone should ask him what type of power cables NASA uses for their computers.

 

[ta240]

I thinks a better to debunk the actual bad ideas instead of reacting to any specific video about said bad idea all the time , there is always a next video with the same flaked idea ? and next ...

Like Amir did , with his wholesale debunking of all USB decrappifiers and all Audiophile Ethernet switches .

But if you say Danny and mr Guttenberg are "big names" in todays audio community ? which i don't know much about admittedly . And not the next random guy it can have merit to make an official flaying somewhere They are obviously living of this Bs

I guess some of it comes down to debunking the idea or debunking the person saying the idea. Sometimes it seems off to go personal with the responses but at the same time someone like Guttenberg has 1.3 million video views in 30 days so he is reaching a lot of people with his infomercials. And Danny is already up to 200,000 views in 30 days; plus he throws "truths" in his title like what he is stating are somehow facts not opinion. He operates similar to McGowan in that he started out in his early videos very fact based and built a following that looked to him as knowledgeable based on the early videos; then he eased into the crazy. And still they both throw enough science or what sounds like science in their pitch to keep up the front of being an engineering type.

As most have said there is no chance of converting a hardcore fan of theirs. The only hope is informing the new people before the chug the capacitor oil.

Decades ago, after arguing with a person on the road I realized that it is impossible to convince an idiot that they are an idiot.

 

[Deleted member 2944]

He's just trolling everybody. You guys understand that, right?
Over 500 comments in just one day is just what he's looking for.

Dave.

 

[Chrispy]

He's just trolling everybody. You guys understand that, right?
Over 500 comments in just one day is just what he's looking for.

Dave.

If he weren't editing those comments.....

 

[GGroch]

........I'm pretty sure pma.....(is) firmly grounded in reality and has deep engineering knowledge.....I used to think it was a waste of time to care about misinformation or engage with those who spread it, but several recent events in the world have changed my mind.......

Yes! Danny & Paul have extensive electronics knowledge and decades of practical experience. Yet they actively spread misinformation and justify it with half-baked pseudo-science. Like you say, why they do it is worth considering because this same phenomenon impacts far more serious aspects of our lives.

The simplest explanation is to question their motives; they may be part of the expanding ranks of sociopathic shills. There might be more to it. Just as our hearing is impacted by bias, so is our reasoning. The "Human Beliefs Sure Are Weird" thread addresses some of this, including references to Kahneman and this study on how we are all hardwired to dismiss facts that do not align with our opinions. If it is correct, deep knowledge of controversial topics may have less correlation with scientific objectivity than we think. These smart guys may actually believe what they are saying.

 

[123456789]

The best cables are those that are used in industry. Heavy duty, thick and robust cables (all kinds). Not some fancy colored crap.

Capacitors, resistors, chokes, transistors, cables... There is stuff intended to be used in low cost equipment, stuff for industry, stuff for military and aerospace. Because military and aerospace is crazy expensive and not available - industry stuff is the best. Story about audiophile cables is pure snake oil. (Like story about audiophile capacitors. Good industrial Chemi Con, Rubycon, Panasonic or Vishay will wipe ass with any fancy overpriced "audiophile" capacitor. Especially in places where you need low esr or high temperature.)

 

[Maki]

The best cables are those that are used in industry. Heavy duty, thick and robust cables (all kinds). Not some fancy colored crap.

Capacitors, resistors, chokes, transistors, cables... There is stuff intended to be used in low cost equipment, stuff for industry, stuff for military and aerospace. Because military and aerospace is crazy expensive and not available - industry stuff is the best. Story about audiophile cables is pure snake oil. (Like story about audiophile capacitors. Good industrial Chemi Con, Rubycon, Panasonic or Vishay will wipe ass with any fancy overpriced "audiophile" capacitor. Especially in places where you need low esr or high temperature.)

What I thought Vishay/Dale and Nichicon were the audiophile brands? Have I been lied to all these years?

 

[amirm]

What I thought Vishay/Dale and Nichicon were the audiophile brands? Have I been lied to all these years?

No, they are high-end brands, period. Audio companies brag about them when they use them but it is not because they are made for audio industry.

 

[jtwrace]

If anyone has seen the Vishay factories you'd shit yourself. I've had the pleasure to visit them around the world and they're nothing short of amazing. As Amir said, audio is probably .0000001% of their business. Heck, it's probably less than that.

 

[GGroch]

No, they are high-end brands, period. Audio companies brag about them when they use them but it is not because they are made for audio industry.

A lot of what Danny sells involves crossover mods using more premium components. Certainly changing the value of crossover caps will change the measured specs of a speaker. Have there been objective tests showing that changing to high end or audiophile caps changes the speakers measurements?

 

[amirm]

A lot of what Danny sells involves crossover mods using more premium components. Certainly changing the value of crossover caps will change the measured specs of a speaker. Have there been objective tests showing that changing to high end or audiophile caps changes the speakers measurements?

Not yet but I do have one of his speakers with both types of crossover: the basic one and upgraded one. I plan to measure them both for transfer function (i.e. whether the crossovers are the same) and distortion.

 

[MZKM]

Not yet but I do have one of his speakers with both types of crossover: the basic one and upgraded one. I plan to measure them both for transfer function (i.e. whether the crossovers are the same) and distortion.

Another of course would be longevity and quality control (which you alone can‘t test).

Do any of these companies have any advertised life spans or stated levels of quality control?

 

[amirm]

The top, major brands do. Little companies making caps and such, I don't know.

 

[the_hamster 2]

Four-five years ago, couldn’t sense any bass coming out of my B&W CM4 speakers - both of them. Went onto an AudioGon forum and asked about cables and bass...all kinds of responses, most involving “trading up” speaker cables, or even ditching my amp. Then I decided to pull off the speaker covers, probed around with my fingers and found that the rubber surrounds of the bass cones had petrified! Zero resiliency! Went online, found a vendor who provided an entire rebuild kit...long story short, new surrounds “magically” restored full bass response, no cable -nor amp - changes necessary.
To complete the story, for a while also wasn’t getting what I believed was a “full” auditory experience during listening to all types of music as I was used to. Also, seemed to be having difficulty in hearing ordinary conversation as well. Went to audiologist, and an audiogram indicated substantial hearing loss between 3500Hz and 5000Hz, i.e., “mid-range” frequencies...Low-frequency and high-frequency responses were within normal. Was prescribed a pair of decent albeit expensive hearing appliances, and - wow! - new ears, old pleasures in music-listening. Take-away message is: as one advances in age, any subtleties and nuances in sound quality disappears, and mechanical/electronic hearing corrections can only go so far. No more searching for “better” sounds, as I am unlikely to hear any differences, tant pis.

 

[GGroch]

Can we stop these threads about obviously bad or fraudulent videos , there is an unlimited supply of them at YouTube it never ends ever......And instead promote good content that we should watch.

No offense meant...but this is the opposite of what I believe we should do. One of the biggest problems with determining truth today is that the vast majority of us live in information silos. People only see posts by people that they already agree with.
Danny's video and others like them can challenge ASR members to re-examine our beliefs, sharpen our arguments, and gain insight into what audio influencers are saying outside of ASR.
Even more important, comments by our members posted to Danny's YouTube channels, and others like him are often what sends their followers to ASR where they can find objective information that challenges Danny's claims. Frequently ASR threads challenging charlatans rank high in Google Searches of snake oil concepts. That's a good thing.

NOTE: Danny has posted a new video today that at the 3:00 references the "flat earth guys" who supposed inhabit places like this.

 

[Deleted member 2944]

Danny's video and others like them can challenge ASR members to re-examine our beliefs, sharpen our arguments, and gain insight into what audio influencers are saying outside of ASR.

Me thinks you need to recalibrate your definition of what an audio influencer is.

Amir has some quirks, but he's much more of an audio influencer than Danny Richie is.

Dave.

 

[GGroch]

......Amir......(is) much more of an audio influencer than Danny Richie is.

He certainly is...but not yet more of an influencer in the YouTube silo. Give Amir's new channel 30 days and I bet his subscriber base beats Dannie's by a lot.

A commenter in Dannie's Newest video refers to Amir's YouTube cable test and the comment is getting major thumbs up support.

Dannie responds to it: "They do no real science over there. They are just a propaganda machine for their belief system. They never answer the question do cables make an audible difference as they never listen to anything."