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New Dutch&Dutch,Dutch review

Dialectic

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It's the cabinet that gets me.

It looks a bit like someone took a PC tower case and slapped some drivers on the front and some plywood on the sides.

I have to wonder about how resonance proof it is.

A large contrast to the curved bullet shapes that seem the consensus amongst high end 2-ways these days.


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Stunning-BW-805-D3-Standmount-Speakers-Stands.jpg


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Also, while I appreciate the desire of the 8C to address room nodes via its built-in DSP and extra woofers, I wonder if it's really a better architecture than a really, really good 2-way plus 2 subs with 12"+ woofers (which can often be had for similar price)?
I have both types of system, and there is no question which is better. The 8Cs look nicer in person.
 
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digicidal

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I'd much rather have the 8C's with a little fan than run the risk of premature failure due to thermals. That's one of the things that always scared me about the Kii's... so many amps (no matter how efficient they may be) in a sealed enclosure is scary IMO. Maybe if they came with a Bryston-like warranty I'd have fewer reservations.
 

watchnerd

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I have both types of system, and there is no question which is better. The 8Cs look nicer in person, and my wife and I both think they look better than the Kii Threes, which have a distinct Audi/BMW aesthetic that was not for us.

That makes sense. It depends a lot on what the rest of your decor is like.
 

JJB70

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JBL L3 series active monitors get away with looking and feeling a bit low rent because they're cheap and perform well. You can buy speakers costing a tenth of the price of these D&D's which look a lot more polished. Does it matter? Maybe not, but speakers are effectively a piece of furniture so you may as well as well have something that looks nice. For £9-10k (whatever these go for now) there is no shortage of beautifully finished speakers which sound splendid (including passive plus amp if you go that way).
 

Dialectic

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I'd much rather have the 8C's with a little fan than run the risk of premature failure due to thermals. That's one of the things that always scared me about the Kii's... so many amps (no matter how efficient they may be) in a sealed enclosure is scary IMO. Maybe if they came with a Bryston-like warranty I'd have fewer reservations.
I went to see @Purité Audio a couple of years ago, fully expecting to buy the Kii Threes.

The Kiis and the 8Cs sounded extremely similar, much more similar than any other two pairs of speakers that I have ever compared side-by-side, but the 8Cs had deeper bass.

So that was that.

With respect to aesthetics, the 8Cs are a pro audio product, not a luxury market-oriented product like a lot of other high end speakers. I rather like the understated, professional look of them.
 
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watchnerd

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The Kiis and the 8Cs sounded extremely similar, much more similar than any other two pairs of speakers that I have ever compared side-by-side,

This in and of itself is fairly interesting.

I didn't think they used the same drivers, so I'm curious what you think accounts for that?
 

watchnerd

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For £9-10k (whatever these go for now) there is no shortage of beautifully finished speakers which sound splendid (including passive plus amp if you go that way).

Their sound isn't quite my thing, but Sonus Faber have to be the kings of fancy looking 2 ways.
 

JJB70

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I recently had a look and listen to a pair of Yamaha NS-B951 speakers, they weren't quite for me but they were beautifully finished in piano black lacquer and with immaculate cabinet work. I'm more into the retro look of Harbeth, OK I know they look dated and aren't exactly for the hipsters but they're well finished and I just like them.
 

Thomas savage

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For a small outfit like D&D you can't really expect true expertise in material and aesthetics. The guys a speaker designer , there's a whole other science to the design regarding aesthetics, materials and how they are perceived by us and our assumptions of quality etc.

What we have in the 8C is a realised design goal with no other departments with possibly competing priorities getting in the way of performance.
 
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Purité Audio

Purité Audio

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The speakers form follows function Thomas, they are that shape because they have to be, I appreciate smart furniture but from a loudspeaker I am looking for the very finest sound quality, and that is what the 8Cs deliver.
Keith
 
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Purité Audio

Purité Audio

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Why don’t you ask the designer why the wave guide has to be that shape, or how the cardioid response of the 8Cs is created.
Keith
 

Absolute

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This in and of itself is fairly interesting.

I didn't think they used the same drivers, so I'm curious what you think accounts for that?
Frequency response and similar dispersion would account for that. I'm not sure if it's considered good conduct, but I'll take the chance and post @mitchco 's comparison between the two in his room;

Kii THREE Red Green D&D 8c Blue Mauve.jpg


This is so similar that it's no wonder it sounds very much alike. Regarding enclosure, both Kii and Dutch are square with no curves. Could be related to the cardioide dispersion or it could be related to manufacturing costs, which wouldn't be surprising for new companies starting up.
I believe the curvature of all those two-ways to be a fashion thing and not a performance thing, but could of course be wrong.

The downside of small active speakers like Dutch and Kii is that there's no space for effective internal dampening. Not that you would want that, Kii's are failing left and right as it is already.
 
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Purité Audio

Purité Audio

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We haven’t had any Kiis ‘failing’ in the what 40 odd pairs we have sold since their introduction.
Keith
 

mi-fu

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Actually I think the D&D looks much better than many other speakers. Its aesthetics is never a problem to me.

I just wish it has a remote control.
 
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Purité Audio

Purité Audio

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Actually I think the D&D looks much better than many other speakers. Its aesthetics is never a problem to me.

I just wish it has a remote control.
! Well wishes sometimes do come true.
Keih
 

Absolute

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I had both of mine failing within a week of each other. Then a bunch over on gearslutz had the same happening to them. Some folks spread over different forums also experienced the same.
Most cases were related to some amplifier relay malfunctioning, but in every case you need to send them back to Holland. From what I was told, the problem was some manufacturing fault in a series of Hypex Ncore amplifiers, which could of course be true.
 
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Purité Audio

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