New Collaboration with Ascilab!

[Pearljam5000]

As long as he continues to test Genelec

Would I still want Genelec after the active Asci is released?

 

[Audio Science Pal]

Prior to June 19, many interested forum members had questions about dealing with import fees and shipping costs. Now having Amirm and his brother WORK to import, warehouse and deliver for the American market makes it much easier for the American consumer to purchase the product. Good for us.

 

[Esprit]

Would I still want Genelec after the active Asci is released?

“Measurements” are NOT the only thing that matters.
There is more like local support, technology, resale value.
Among other things, active versions are more expensive...

 

[The French]

Argh, available in Europ with Audiophonics, right when I'm broke for couple of years, having to pay for my childs schools.

That partnership makes sense.

 

[Robbo99999]

Well, and there I see the problem. I believe you’re missing the core of the concern.

This isn’t about your personal integrity, your past contributions to ASR, or whether other reviewers are worse. It’s about structural independence and perceived impartiality, not your intentions.

You’ve stated that you’ve “done more than anyone else” to remain above bias. That may be true regarding ads, sponsorships, and affiliate links. But you’ve now entered a commercial partnership where you financially benefit from the success of a specific brand that is also reviewed, discussed, and promoted on a platform you founded and control. That inherently changes the playing field.

Yes, ASR has hosted reviews of products from your other company before. But those were limited, isolated cases that clearly remained incidental to the platform’s broader mission. This new venture is qualitatively different: you’re not just reviewing a product, you’re building a distribution business, using ASR to gauge demand, raise visibility, and ultimately drive commercial traction.

You’ve also said this is a financial risk. That’s fair, but it’s exactly why ASR’s role becomes problematic. Leveraging ASR’s reach to reduce that risk creates a powerful incentive to use the platform as a marketing engine, even if unintentionally. And that incentive conflicts directly with ASR’s role as a neutral review space.

This isn’t primarily about reviews. It’s about how ASR is being potentially used to launch and promote a commercial venture, which shifts its role from neutral platform to potential business amplifier. That change matters, and simply insisting it doesn’t won’t undo it.

You can’t mitigate this by pointing out flaws in other reviewers or reminding us of your past choices. Ethics isn’t a race to the bottom. Nor is it about whether you’re a good person or not. It’s about maintaining a clear separation between editorial authority and business interest, especially in a community built on data, transparency, and skepticism.

Even taking a few concrete steps, like establishing a clear boundary between ASR’s editorial space and commercial announcements, would go a long way toward showing that you take these concerns seriously.

The thing is, this site is a business amplifier for any good measuring speaker! The buzz in the Ascilab announcement threads along with the idea that Amir might get involved in the development process to a certain limited extent also creates a buzz and affirmation for the product subconsciously or consciously amoung readers, but the truth is that the measurements don't lie and that's the same for any speaker measured here, and for sure other companies get a buzz from ASR if their products measure well here - particularly if said companies have a number of products that consistently surprise and measure well with whatever price breakthroughs or features & performance they offer. Ascilab would get a buzz off ASR even if Amir wasn't indirectly associated with them, a slightly bigger buzz potentially now associated but I don't see that as a big deal. In fact it's a positive thing for folks in the USA that he is willing to do the distribution and at minimal margins, so it's a win win there - it's cost efficient (for consumer) distribution for a good measuring speaker, a consumer win.

 

[A Surfer]

Well Amir, you know what they say, no good deed ever goes unpunished. It seems like you and your family are just trying to add a source of revenue in a manner that will benefit members of this community. What do you get for the trouble, people accusing you of wrongdoing without any cause or evidence.

I would say to tune out the noise and focus on the signal. This could be a great venture.

 

[voodooless]

What do you get for the trouble, people accusing you of wrongdoing without any cause or evidence.

Nonsense, there are no accusations of wrongdoing.

 

[A Surfer]

Nonsense, there are no accusations of wrongdoing.

Suggestions of a possible wrongdoing. I was being equally ridiculous as some of the speculation that has been thrown about.

 

[Thighsofsteel]

I would say to tune out the noise and focus on the signal. This could be a great venture.

 

[prestigetone]

Suggestions of a possible wrongdoing. I was being equally ridiculous as some of the speculation that has been thrown about.

No not suggestions of even a possible wrongdoing. I think people just want to know there is a separation of the science side of ASR and the selling side of ASR since he basically said they will now be selling a product. Wanting everything to be above board is, I think, a reasonable ask from the community. The fact that everyone is taking offense to it, and Amir is getting so upset makes me question it more. All that he or anyone in his position need to do is say, here are the steps we are taking to reduce even the appearance impropriety. I haven't seen one person say that any wrongdoing has taken place or even will take place.

I'd take it as a compliment. Members of this community believe in the mission so much, and view it as a leader in scientific thought and practice around audio, that they want to make sure it maintains that as it grows and expands. It's a bit like people worrying about their favorite eatery adding new locations, hoping the quality doesn't go down.

 

[Robbo99999]

No not suggestions of even a possible wrongdoing. I think people just want to know there is a separation of the science side of ASR and the selling side of ASR since he basically said they will now be selling a product. Wanting everything to be above board is, I think, a reasonable ask from the community. The fact that everyone is taking offense to it, and Amir is getting so upset makes me question it more. All that he or anyone in his position need to do is say, here are the steps we are taking to reduce even the appearance impropriety. I haven't seen one person say that any wrongdoing has taken place or even will take place.

I'd take it as a compliment. Members of this community believe in the mission so much, and view it as a leader in scientific thought and practice around audio, that they want to make sure it maintains that as it grows and expands. It's a bit like people worrying about their favorite eatery adding new locations, hoping the quality doesn't go down.

(Don't make it something it's not - "everyone" is not taking offense to it, not by a long stretch.)

 

[prestigetone]

(Don't make it something it's not - "everyone" is not taking offense to it, not by a long stretch.)

You're taking what I am saying very literally. I didn't mean everyone, but a lot of people are. I think it's a fair question and request to make that he recuse himself with regards to certain reviews or aspects of reviews and let other's do it. This is very different than the Revel deal where his company is a dealer. This is a sole distribution deal. To say "It's my brother and not me," feels like a sidestep. I think it would be good to just say "Hey we hear everyone's concern and appreciate all the support. Here are the extra steps we are taking to make sure everyone feels good about this."

That's it. The discussion would and should be over after that.

 

[RickS]

Hi all!

Members have helped build this community and appreciate the support and understand that change can be difficult.

However, Amir has stated his intentions for ASR in the OP and reiterated in post #313.

Please try to keep any future posts focused on facts rather than speculation about ASR or other members. Amir has done his due diligence on this opportunity and is best if we allow him more time to focus on his testing and reviews.

 

[prestigetone]

Guess I will be getting Genelec.

 

[M.C. Logan]

Congratulations. I hope they are developing speakers for larger rooms than 200 Sqft.

That'd be almost exclusively a North American product line.

 

[M.C. Logan]

To show my continued appreciation (I purchased KEF R3 based on the ASR review), I have made another upgrade/donation to the Forum.

Now, a non secuitur; I appreciate the fact that “political” content is not allowed. There are a plethora of sites that not only allow, but foment political debate - to a wearying end! ASR simply does not need that conversation.

My interest in the debate concerning such esoterica as massless force field tweeters, dynamic versus electrostatic drivers etc, etc ad infititum provide endless entertainment and joy to my life, absent the consternation of political battles!

Keep the helm steady in the political gale - NO POLITICS!

Tillman

Every human act and every human texte is political. No PARTY politics.

 

[M.C. Logan]

Let's make a distinction between "cheap" and (relatively) inexpensive.

To the average wage slave >£1000 ain't relatively inexpensive.

 

[M.C. Logan]

How do you know the data isn’t biased? Data can be manipulated (this is not an insinuation, don’t take it that way, just making a point!). I do not understand why folks are pushing back for Amir to not review products where he has financial interest. I would think others would be requesting same given the situation. You must admit for an outsider looking in on ASR, this does not look good. Perception is reality.

If perception is reality then objective measurement is pointless, you may as well just listen to YouTube cretins and The Absolute Sound objectivist twaddle.

 

[MKR]

If perception is reality then objective measurement is pointless, you may as well just listen to YouTube cretins and The Absolute Sound objectivist twaddle.

That’s not what I meant with that comment

 

[M.C. Logan]

That’s not what I meant with that comment

That's what the English language says it means.