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New Buchardt S400 MKIII

As always, I’m honored to see this much speculation about our products. I’m happy that we can spark some interest in such an extremely crowded market! So let me try to clear up a few things here.


Firstly, the idea that this is a speaker we earn more money on is not true. We have had to cut into our margins to offer it at this price point compared to the Mk2. The Satori 7.5" woofer is multiple times more expensive than the SB17NRX2 we used in the Mk2. The tweeter in the Mk2 was a custom version of the SB19ST, and the new tweeter here is also a completely custom design made by SB for us. It’s around three times the cost of the old tweeter. While it does use the same dome as the 26ADC, it is otherwise a completely different design, featuring what the engineers at SB (who are located just 35 km from us, so we work very closely with them) call a “Matrix Neo motor structure.” It’s a really nice-sounding tweeter, with breakups around 25,000 Hz.


Now, I know this might not be the place to get into the objective vs. subjective discussion, but despite not measuring as well as the older, cheaper tweeter, it does sound significantly better ;-) The treble performance of the S400 has always been what most people gave negative feedback on, despite that being arguably the strongest objective aspect of the S400.


So just to clarify: the cost of building the Mk3 is significantly higher than the Mk2 because of this, and it’s not like parts have become cheaper since 2021, quite the opposite, sadly.


We had to find some savings in order to keep the price as close as possible to the Mk2, and moving from passive radiators to bass reflex is one place where we could save money. However, passive radiators were not really needed here, due to the larger cabinet, as we aimed for the same low-end extension as the Mk2, just with much more authority and headroom thanks to the new woofer. It’s quite crazy how much larger the Mk3 sounds in direct comparison, and how much louder and dynamically capable it plays.


With these new, better drivers, we were able to take advantage of a simpler crossover using a 1st-order design. After the extremely long development of the E50, this has become something we really love the sound of. It does hurt vertical measurements for sure, and it wouldn’t be a speaker I would recommend for nearfield listening. At 2 meters and beyond, however, we do not notice any shift in tonality when moving around, standing, or sitting it remains well-behaved still.


The crossover is also an area where we save some money due to its simplicity compared to the Mk2. That said, we are still nowhere near the budget-quality component choices of many competitors in this price range. We’re using Jantzen Cross Caps, SuperRes resistors (ceramic for notch filters), as well as even thicker air-core coils (1.6 mm) compared to the Mk2 (1.4 mm). No iron-core coils here.


In terms of sound, the tonal balance is very close to the S400 Mk2, so customers who like that sound should feel right at home, but they should also notice significant improvements across the board (bass, midrange, and treble), as well as the obvious increase in headroom.


It’s true that we are slowly moving in a different direction with our passive speakers, where measurements are not the sole factor dictating how a speaker is tuned. Of course, we still rely on measurements, it’s not like we are working blind, but we are making deliberate choices to achieve what we believe is better sound, even if that goes against theoretical standards. The E50 was a project where we had prototypes that measured much better than the final version, and we’ve documented this thoroughly on the product page for those interested in the development process and design decisions.


The S400 Mk3 still measures very respectably. It could have looked better with higher-order filters, of course, and with this tweeter, we could also have pushed the crossover point lower than in the Mk2 to further improve vertical performance. But who knows, if ASR users push us hard enough, we might do a batch fully optimized for objective performance ;D


We are not fully finished with measurements yet, but of course we will have them on the site once ready. For now, here is a draft of the prototype CEA plot from the NFS. We’ve made some small crossover adjustments since then. This measurement extends to 40,000 Hz on the Mk3 (not the Mk2), so you can clearly see the tweeter breakup as well.


I have attached both the S400 Mk2 and the S400 Mk3 CEA for comparison. Keep in mind that they tend to come out cleaner in Erin’s reviews (you can compare his Mk2 data to ours), so when he tests the Mk3, it will likely look a bit cleaner than what you see here. We do plan for Erin to be one of the first to receive it, if he has the time.

Hey Mads, I appreciate the detailed and thoughtful reply!

That said, I would HAPPILY pay a few hundred extra euros for a Mk3 Special Edition that's optimized for objective performance. That would be my perfect, end-game speaker.

Also wanted to say that from an aesthetics standpoint I love the cleaner design of the new speaker w/ the new wave guide.

The S400 Mk3 in black honestly might be my new fav speaker looks wise, at least in it's price range.
 
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As always, I’m honored to see this much speculation about our products. I’m happy that we can spark some interest in such an extremely crowded market! So let me try to clear up a few things here.


Firstly, the idea that this is a speaker we earn more money on is not true. We have had to cut into our margins to offer it at this price point compared to the Mk2. The Satori 7.5" woofer is multiple times more expensive than the SB17NRX2 we used in the Mk2. The tweeter in the Mk2 was a custom version of the SB19ST, and the new tweeter here is also a completely custom design made by SB for us. It’s around three times the cost of the old tweeter. While it does use the same dome as the 26ADC, it is otherwise a completely different design, featuring what the engineers at SB (who are located just 35 km from us, so we work very closely with them) call a “Matrix Neo motor structure.” It’s a really nice-sounding tweeter, with breakups around 25,000 Hz.


Now, I know this might not be the place to get into the objective vs. subjective discussion, but despite not measuring as well as the older, cheaper tweeter, it does sound significantly better ;-) The treble performance of the S400 has always been what most people gave negative feedback on, despite that being arguably the strongest objective aspect of the S400.


So just to clarify: the cost of building the Mk3 is significantly higher than the Mk2 because of this, and it’s not like parts have become cheaper since 2021, quite the opposite, sadly.


We had to find some savings in order to keep the price as close as possible to the Mk2, and moving from passive radiators to bass reflex is one place where we could save money. However, passive radiators were not really needed here, due to the larger cabinet, as we aimed for the same low-end extension as the Mk2, just with much more authority and headroom thanks to the new woofer. It’s quite crazy how much larger the Mk3 sounds in direct comparison, and how much louder and dynamically capable it plays.


With these new, better drivers, we were able to take advantage of a simpler crossover using a 1st-order design. After the extremely long development of the E50, this has become something we really love the sound of. It does hurt vertical measurements for sure, and it wouldn’t be a speaker I would recommend for nearfield listening. At 2 meters and beyond, however, we do not notice any shift in tonality when moving around, standing, or sitting it remains well-behaved still.


The crossover is also an area where we save some money due to its simplicity compared to the Mk2. That said, we are still nowhere near the budget-quality component choices of many competitors in this price range. We’re using Jantzen Cross Caps, SuperRes resistors (ceramic for notch filters), as well as even thicker air-core coils (1.6 mm) compared to the Mk2 (1.4 mm). No iron-core coils here.


In terms of sound, the tonal balance is very close to the S400 Mk2, so customers who like that sound should feel right at home, but they should also notice significant improvements across the board (bass, midrange, and treble), as well as the obvious increase in headroom.


It’s true that we are slowly moving in a different direction with our passive speakers, where measurements are not the sole factor dictating how a speaker is tuned. Of course, we still rely on measurements, it’s not like we are working blind, but we are making deliberate choices to achieve what we believe is better sound, even if that goes against theoretical standards. The E50 was a project where we had prototypes that measured much better than the final version, and we’ve documented this thoroughly on the product page for those interested in the development process and design decisions.


The S400 Mk3 still measures very respectably. It could have looked better with higher-order filters, of course, and with this tweeter, we could also have pushed the crossover point lower than in the Mk2 to further improve vertical performance. But who knows, if ASR users push us hard enough, we might do a batch fully optimized for objective performance ;D


We are not fully finished with measurements yet, but of course we will have them on the site once ready. For now, here is a draft of the prototype CEA plot from the NFS. We’ve made some small crossover adjustments since then. This measurement extends to 40,000 Hz on the Mk3 (not the Mk2), so you can clearly see the tweeter breakup as well.


I have attached both the S400 Mk2 and the S400 Mk3 CEA for comparison. Keep in mind that they tend to come out cleaner in Erin’s reviews (you can compare his Mk2 data to ours), so when he tests the Mk3, it will likely look a bit cleaner than what you see here. We do plan for Erin to be one of the first to receive it, if he has the time.
Hi Mads, a huge thank you from me for your detailed, and candit contribution to this thread. Hope you stay for more semi un-founded speculation!
 
Thanks, @Mads Buchardt.

I've been in contact with him since 2019/2020 when I first got my MK1's.

A few questions if you don't mind:
  1. Will these be packaged as singles so we can purchase 3 for LCR? Perhaps now you will consider it since the larger speaker would require a larger box as well.
  2. I know those are preliminary measurements, but overall, the tweeter and DI surprisingly look better on the MK3. I didn't expect that.
  3. Am I right that the MK3 is coming down a little bit between 200-400 Hz? It's that "meatiness" to the sound that is affected there.
 
Thanks, @Mads Buchardt.

I've been in contact with him since 2019/2020 when I first got my MK1's.

A few questions if you don't mind:
  1. Will these be packaged as singles so we can purchase 3 for LCR? Perhaps now you will consider it since the larger speaker would require a larger box as well.
  2. I know those are preliminary measurements, but overall, the tweeter and DI surprisingly look better on the MK3. I didn't expect that.
  3. Am I right that the MK3 is coming down a little bit between 200-400 Hz? It's that "meatiness" to the sound that is affected there.
I saw that too. It looks very promising.

I still want a passive, 3-way floor stander though. I'm considering to purchase the Ascilab C8T, but Buchard's speakers look so much better, I'd wait if something similar was in the pipeline from them.
 
I still want a passive, 3-way floor stander though. I'm considering to purchase the Ascilab C8T, but Buchard's speakers look so much better, I'd wait if something similar was in the pipeline from them.
Yeah I had the same thought, they really need to make a tower variant of the MK3.

That said, I will always prefer standmounts because they are a lot easier to pack and ship, and I don't benefit as much from towers as some people would.
 
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Yeah I had the same thought, they really need to make a tower variant of the MK3.

That said, I will always prefer standmounts because they are a lot easier to pack and ship, and I don't benefit as much from towers as some people would.
Everybody benefits from towers ;)
 
Everybody benefits from towers ;)
Of course but when you have subs like I do and the need for 3 identical LCR, towers don't make sense.

One thing I'm thinking though, in my testing with the MK2 as a center, it sounded a lot better with the woofer close to the screen. So the MK3 would need to be placed upside-down.
 
Troels Gravesen had great success in getting rid of the ~1khz surround resonance of Satori drivers via edge coating. Maybe this could be feasible in an asr crowd optimised batch?


Kudos to Mads for explaining the rationale behind the design decisions in such great detail!
 
Troels Gravesen had great success in getting rid of the ~1khz surround resonance of Satori drivers via edge coating. Maybe this could be feasible in an asr crowd optimised batch?

edge-coating
Interesting.

MR13P-8.png
 
True, but the tripod stand mounts from Buchardt are so sexy... o_O
I’m so love those stands to be fair.

Overall I love what Buchardt does.

Used to have S400mk2. Miss them incredibly.

Mads is fantastic too. A great communicator and always tries to help.
 
I’m so love those stands to be fair.

Overall I love what Buchardt does.

Used to have S400mk2. Miss them incredibly.

Mads is fantastic too. A great communicator and always tries to help.

Same, I've been following Buchardt for awhile and they've always been on my short-list.

The balance of not only technical capability at their price range but also the level of finish and design is absolutely insane to me, so impressive.

And I really don't get involved with communities too often so it speaks volumes that I was inspired to create an account to post here hahaha.
 
Straying OT but a Buchardt “copy” of the Ascilab C8T would be perfect for me. And if they insist on 1st order crossovers they could use a 5” Satori mid-range to reduce beaming. Add in a couple of side-mounted 8” woofers and you’re done. I’d even forgive a plastic reflex port!

I love the idea of “ASR” optional crossovers. The marketing could be easily differentiated because the two camps (objective vs subjective) are enticed by very different things. For me this would put Buchardt in quite a unique position for a hifi brand of really understanding and respecting different customer needs and offering the best possible product for different preferences.

What do you say @Mads Buchardt ?
 
Straying OT but a Buchardt “copy” of the Ascilab C8T would be perfect for me. And if they insist on 1st order crossovers they could use a 5” Satori mid-range to reduce beaming. Add in a couple of side-mounted 8” woofers and you’re done. I’d even forgive a plastic reflex port!

I love the idea of “ASR” optional crossovers. The marketing could be easily differentiated because the two camps (objective vs subjective) are enticed by very different things. For me this would put Buchardt in quite a unique position for a hifi brand of really understanding and respecting different customer needs and offering the best possible product for different preferences.

What do you say @Mads Buchardt ?

I already said it once but I'll say it again, @Mads Buchardt you could 100% count me in for a S400 Mk3 ASR Edition. :D
 
Straying OT but a Buchardt “copy” of the Ascilab C8T would be perfect for me. And if they insist on 1st order crossovers they could use a 5” Satori mid-range to reduce beaming and a couple of side-mounted 8” woofers.

I love the idea of “ASR” optional crossover. The marketing could be easily differentiated because the two camps (objective vs subjective) are enticed by very different things. For me this would put Buchardt in quite a unique position of really understanding and respecting different customer needs.

What do you say @Mads Buchardt ?
 
Thanks, @Mads Buchardt.

I've been in contact with him since 2019/2020 when I first got my MK1's.

A few questions if you don't mind:
  1. Will these be packaged as singles so we can purchase 3 for LCR? Perhaps now you will consider it since the larger speaker would require a larger box as well.
  2. I know those are preliminary measurements, but overall, the tweeter and DI surprisingly look better on the MK3. I didn't expect that.
  3. Am I right that the MK3 is coming down a little bit between 200-400 Hz? It's that "meatiness" to the sound that is affected there.
We have always been able to sell singles, here we simply charge half the price so no problem. They are boxed in pairs still.

Yeah when you look really close you can see that between 2-400. Its not something I notice in quick tonal test which is having one of each speakers side by side and instantly swapping between them with a mono signal. One of the changes was to slightly lower the crossover frequency by increasing the coil value a little on the woofer. This brings it a hair down from about 400-2300hz to make it more tonal match the Mk2.
 
I saw that too. It looks very promising.

I still want a passive, 3-way floor stander though. I'm considering to purchase the Ascilab C8T, but Buchard's speakers look so much better, I'd wait if something similar was in the pipeline from them.
We are working on the 3 way passive yes. Currently we are working on prototypes where you do have the same setup as the Mk3, and then 4 x 8" under in Isobaric bas system (so only 2 of the 8" is visible). This would make an insanely impressive floorstander for the size ! Really hope this works out as we hope :) But we have done so many drafts of floorstanders that have never seen the light of day, so no promise yet :)
 
Troels Gravesen had great success in getting rid of the ~1khz surround resonance of Satori drivers via edge coating. Maybe this could be feasible in an asr crowd optimised batch?


Kudos to Mads for explaining the rationale behind the design decisions in such great detail!
Yeah we did talk about this as well, actually to get more information on this subject (i'm no expert!) I had a phone call with the woofer designer just now. The dip is there on these woofers yes, they can remove it if we want with simply swapping to a different rubber type, it would fix this but dramatically destroy the detail and dynamic sound of this woofer (he called it a very smooth english sounding woofer sound) ;)
You could also do the Troels approche which again fixes the problem but would make the stroke less linear and introduce distortion. Another solution is the textreme which due to its cone does not have this either (we are also working with this driver by the way for a different project).

This issue does not exist in far field, so if you take the Mk3 or any other speaker with this driver and measure it at 1.5 meters, you do not have this dip anymore. He did however wonder why the NFS keep this for its far field processed measurements which is something he have seen before from other speakers measured in the same NFS as we use. I do wonder if Erin's outcomes would be different, might be that it process the data differently? Speculations here but let's see about that. I just tried with our Clio here to see, and sure enough when you go really close you do see this, but as you pull just out to about 50cm it was gone.
 
Straying OT but a Buchardt “copy” of the Ascilab C8T would be perfect for me. And if they insist on 1st order crossovers they could use a 5” Satori mid-range to reduce beaming. Add in a couple of side-mounted 8” woofers and you’re done. I’d even forgive a plastic reflex port!

I love the idea of “ASR” optional crossovers. The marketing could be easily differentiated because the two camps (objective vs subjective) are enticed by very different things. For me this would put Buchardt in quite a unique position for a hifi brand of really understanding and respecting different customer needs and offering the best possible product for different preferences.

What do you say @Mads Buchardt ?
I already said it once but I'll say it again, @Mads Buchardt you could 100% count me in for a S400 Mk3 ASR Edition. :D
Haha S400 Mk3 ASR Edition could be funny!
 
We are working on the 3 way passive yes. Currently we are working on prototypes where you do have the same setup as the Mk3, and then 4 x 8" under in Isobaric bas system (so only 2 of the 8" is visible). This would make an insanely impressive floorstander for the size ! Really hope this works out as we hope :) But we have done so many drafts of floorstanders that have never seen the light of day, so no promise yet :)
Do it!!! Sounds expensive though with all those drivers. Plus the ASR crossover of course ;)
 
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