Neumann KH420 Review (Studio Monitor)

[beagleman]

Yeah, but in the States they don't really have corners!

Where I live we do!

 

[CtheArgie]

Where I live we do!

Same here, the Santa Monica mountains.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

So basically what material is this? View attachment 203821

In the end it doesn’t really matter. I consider this part more of a marketing statement (of which Neumann uses refreshingly little). The total design is important and the excellently measuring end result.

 

[amirm]

The reality is that this speaker is neither designed for nor marketed for consumer use.

Which matters not when goals of production of music should be the same as playing it as far a desired frequency response/dispersion. Objective Olive score of this speaker indicates that they followed the same goal as research into fidelity of consumer speakers.

Of course their market is pro applications where they have distribution channel and name recognition. But nothing stops you from buying and using them for consumer use. I know one of the top home theater designers -- think $500K to $1M -- almost exclusively uses Genelec speakers.

The only thing you have to worry about such pro speakers is whether the amplification is a bottleneck or not as unlike passives for consumer use, you can't change that. In that regard, the KH420 gets you 95% there. So it is a non-issue for just most people.

 

[FeddyLost]

I think you are using the word “design” for styling rather than engineering design.

Not only.
Home speakers with such bass capability most probably will have a tower design, either with vertical woofers array, either like ATC tower series.
I see no reasons to have such enclosure design at home unless you need a retro look. There are no consoles at home and "free" case volume is often good for LF, while classic 3-way requires heavy stands that are not free.

 

[mac]

I'm anxious to see the improved passive crossover version from GR-Research.

 

[FeddyLost]

I'm anxious to see the improved passive crossover version from GR-Research.

And valve amps of course?

 

[Sancus]

If you look at professional reviews online, they say this speaker requires a lot of room treatment, which makes it a poor choice for a typical consumer set-up were that is not possible.

What makes you believe this to be true? I mean in terms of the characteristics of the actual speaker, not quoted opinions of randos(professional or otherwise) on the internet.

As far as I can tell, this speaker's dispersion and frequency response is well within the profile typical of excellent domestic speakers. If anything, the dispersion is a little narrower -- and that would actually mean fewer reflections, so less room treatment required.

I don't see any other attribute of this speaker(ignoring aesthetics) that has any relevance to domestic vs professional use? Apart from the fact that it plays much louder than most people are going to need at 3-4m listening distances, lol.

 

[Somafunk]

The overwhelming weight of evidence is that speakers designed for consumer use do not look anything like these. If you honestly think these would be considered an attractive addition to a domestic environment, you’re not being honest with yourself.

I beg to differ, You appear to be applying your preference for shiny veneers over sound quality, personally I couldn’t give a toss how speakers look in my domestic environment as evidenced by my choice and setup, along with the 18 panels or so of GIK acoustic treatment in my living room.

Personally I love the styling of them, all the money spent on what matters and and an utter disregard for expensive bullshit veneers is something I can heartily applaud.

As an additional aside I was browsing through the online reviews of the recent Axpona hifi show and every single “supposedly high end” speaker/system I saw was absolutely gopping in their panderance to visible expenditure, all big n’ shiny extravagant trinkets with big ‘n shiny price tickets attached, it’s no wonder the subject of high end audiophool equipment deserves the derision it gets from those who who actually produce/engineer the music that is played back on such equipment.

 

[jhaider]

Not only.
Home speakers with such bass capability most probably will have a tower design, either with vertical woofers array, either like ATC tower series.

Cf. JBL 4349

 

[FeddyLost]

Cf. JBL 4349

It's a studio monitor as advertised on official site. Compare it with HDI series, for example.

 

[Robbo99999]

Same here, the Santa Monica mountains.

Well you really should try that Caterham then!

(OK, ok, there are some corners in the roads in the USA, I bet we've got more of them in the UK, hell we love our roundabouts.....now they're some serious fun when driving, especially if they lead directly onto a fast dual carriageway....putting your foot down as you exit the roundabout "on a bend" is a lotta fun....and we got a lotta roundabouts!).

 

[thewas]

You can still find some info via the web archive: https://web.archive.org/web/2018121...itoring_discontinued-monitors_studio-products

Yes, unfortunately though most linked PDF documents are not archived there.

 

[LTig]

Which matters not when goals of production of music should be the same as playing it as far a desired frequency response/dispersion. Objective Olive score of this speaker indicates that they followed the same goal as research into fidelity of consumer speakers.

Of course their market is pro applications where they have distribution channel and name recognition. But nothing stops you from buying and using them for consumer use. I know one of the top home theater designers -- think $500K to $1M -- almost exclusively uses Genelec speakers.

I own the O300D (predecessor of KH310) since 2004 and Genelec 8020s since 2006 and 6 people (relatives, friends, colleagues) switched to active monitors (Genelec 8020, KH420) after listening to my 2 systems. None of them are pros.

I'm sure if hifi shops would start demoing studio monitors they would sell better.

 

[thewas]

I'm sure if hifi shops would start demoing studio monitors they would sell better.

The problem is that margins are usually in the pro segment smaller (also due to hard online competition from huge shops like Thomann, Sweetwater etc) and the hifi shops won't be able to sell overpriced boutique/snakeoil electronics, cables etc which give them often the largest profits.

 

[AudioJester]

Audio retailers can make much more money with boutique brands.
Demoing Neumann/Genelec would be bad for business. Hence spread the myth that they are no good for domestic use.

 

[CtheArgie]

Well you really should try that Caterham then!

(OK, ok, there are some corners in the roads in the USA, I bet we've got more of them in the UK, hell we love our roundabouts.....now they're some serious fun when driving, especially if they lead directly onto a fast dual carriageway....putting your foot down as you exit the roundabout "on a bend" is a lotta fun....and we got a lotta roundabouts!).

I’ve seen them vehicles around. I live exactly in the are where all petrolheads get together. Where Lambos and McLarens cavort with early 911s, Morgans and others. Dangerous to ride on weekends.

search for YouTube’s of “the snake” or Mulholland.

anyway, at home we love the Neumann’. We replaced the “living room” into a music/reading room, with a baby grand, good lighting and a pretty good sound system.

By the way, you can get an entire Neumann ATMOS bundle for 18k pounds at KMR. This is less than a FR-30 or many fancy audiophool speakers!

Neumann Atmos (3x KH420, 4 x KH310, 4 x KH120, 1 x KH870)

The Neumann Atmos Bundle includes all the speakers necessary to set up an atmos system.

www.kmraudio.com

 

[DJBonoBobo]

Audio retailers can make much more money with boutique brands.
Demoing Neumann/Genelec would be bad for business. Hence spread the myth that they are no good for domestic use.

There are exceptions, but very rare. Like hoerzone.de in Munich - it has Neumann, Genelec, Adam, Grimm, Dutch & Dutch, GGNTKT, RME, Trinnov...

 

[F1308]

How do you mean? I was just asking if we've ever measured a speaker on here that has low enough distortion to compare to good measuring headphones re the distortion variable. I don't think we've measured a speaker on here that can compare in distortion terms....I'm not saying that's bad, I'm just curious re the comparison.

Neither do I.
I bet the earbuds do win by a large stretch.

 

[MediumRare]

I didn't listen to them in the same space. I think the KH420 has deeper bass. The Genelec a bit better overall tonality.

How would you compare to the Dutch & Dutch 8C? The 8C Studio is actually very slightly cheaper.