Neumann KH120 II Monitor Review

[rolltide]

Not sure if this is the best place to ask: I did the room correction of my KH120ii today, and this is the result:

View attachment 436009

I’m wondering whether I should further tweak this curve using the EQ in the Neumann software or leave it as is. I’m not entirely sure what is considered ‘good’ in terms of Hi-Fi—could this curve be very neutral and more suited for studio work?

What mic did you use for your room correction?

 

[mj30250]

Not sure if this is the best place to ask: I did the room correction of my KH120ii today, and this is the result:

View attachment 436009

I’m wondering whether I should further tweak this curve using the EQ in the Neumann software or leave it as is. I’m not entirely sure what is considered ‘good’ in terms of Hi-Fi—could this curve be very neutral and more suited for studio work?

That depends on what you're aiming for. For me, this response would be too bass shy. I'd add a low shelf boost personally, but how do you like the sound? Are you actually doing studio work or just listening for enjoyment?

 

[andlum]

What mic did you use for your room correction?

The Neumann MA1 Mic, the original one.

That depends on what you're aiming for. For me, this response would be too bass shy. I'd add a low shelf boost personally, but how do you like the sound? Are you actually doing studio work or just listening for enjoyment?

I am listening for home entertainment and pure joy. I thought its a bit bass-shy, but I blamed my ears, that are used to the past boom-y sound. So low shelf boost by 1db?

 

[mj30250]

The Neumann MA1 Mic, the original one.



I am listening for home entertainment and pure joy. I thought its a bit bass-shy, but I blamed my ears, that are used to the past boom-y sound. So low shelf boost by 1db?

Start with +3dB and tweak from there if it's too much/not enough. You aren't going to hurt the speakers.

 

[jhaider]

Not sure if this is the best place to ask: I did the room correction of my KH120ii today, and this is the result:

View attachment 436009

I’m wondering whether I should further tweak this curve using the EQ in the Neumann software or leave it as is. I’m not entirely sure what is considered ‘good’ in terms of Hi-Fi—could this curve be very neutral and more suited for studio work?

I would start by broadly following the room’s bass gain trend from maybe 150-200 Hz. Eyeball a reasonable curve through the peaks and dips and adjust to taste from there.

 

[DJBonoBobo]

Not sure if this is the best place to ask: I did the room correction of my KH120ii today, and this is the result:

View attachment 436009

I’m wondering whether I should further tweak this curve using the EQ in the Neumann software or leave it as is. I’m not entirely sure what is considered ‘good’ in terms of Hi-Fi—could this curve be very neutral and more suited for studio work?

It is as good as it gets for studio and hifi. The scale is zoomed in a lot and the deviations from the target are tiny.
I recommend trying this for some time. You can always adjust bass to taste, of course, but maybe you'll get used to a more neutral sound quickly, if you give it a chance. Just try for yourself.

 

[rolltide]

I think the Wiim Pro is the only game in town for an affordable device that can output digital coax with a volume control (in the digital domain).

Thank you so much for this awesome post - very helpful.

Would you recommend any of these interfaces with volume control and coax output?

1. Focusrite Scarlett 16i16
2. PreSonus Studio 1810c
3. SMSL DP5 (or SMSL DP5 SE)
4. SMSL SD-9

 

[staticV3]

I think the Wiim Pro is the only game in town for an affordable device that can output digital coax with a volume control (in the digital domain).

Thank you so much for this awesome post - very helpful.

Would you recommend any of these interfaces with volume control and coax output?

1. PreSonus Studio 1810c
2. Focusrite Scarlett 16i16
3. SMSL DP5 (or SMSL DP5 SE)
4. SMSL SD-9

Just FYI, the SMSL PO100 2024 supports SPDIF output with volume control and costs a fraction of any of these.

 

[rolltide]

Just FYI, the SMSL PO100 2024 supports SPDIF output with volume control and costs a fraction of any of these.

How can volume be controlled on the SMSL PO100 2024? I don't see a volume knob.

 

[staticV3]

How can volume be controlled on the SMSL PO100 2024?

Via the default OS volume controls in iOS, macOS, Windows and Linux.

Doing so will send UAC2 Hardware volume commands to the PO100 which then attenuates the signal using its Xmos processor.

 

[teashea]

Thank you so much for this awesome post - very helpful.

Would you recommend any of these interfaces with volume control and coax output?

1. Focusrite Scarlett 16i16
2. PreSonus Studio 1810c
3. SMSL DP5 (or SMSL DP5 SE)
4. SMSL SD-9

no

 

[rolltide]

Via the default OS volume controls in iOS, macOS, Windows and Linux.

Doing so will send UAC2 Hardware volume commands to the PO100 which then attenuates the signal using its Xmos processor.

I'm looking for hardware volume control like on the Focusrite Scarlett 16i16.

 

[staticV3]

I'm looking for hardware volume control like on the Focusrite Scarlett 16i16.

You mean a physical volume knob?

You could always add a USB volume knob to your computer and that plus the PO100 would serve the same purpose.

 

[TA21]

I think the Wiim Pro is the only game in town for an affordable device that can output digital coax with a volume control (in the digital domain).

Thank you so much for this awesome post - very helpful.

Would you recommend any of these interfaces with volume control and coax output?

1. PreSonus Studio 1810c
2. Focusrite Scarlett 16i16
3. SMSL DP5 (or SMSL DP5 SE)
4. SMSL SD-9

The PreSonus and Focusrite devices are audio interfaces. Just because an audio interface has a volume knob and a digital output, that does not mean the device controls volume of the digital output. The volume knob is usually just for its analog outputs.

I looked at the online manuals for these two units. The volume knob controls volume on the analog outputs of these devices, but not their digital output. As I mentioned in my earlier post, I have not seen an audio interface under $2000 that can control volume on its digital output.

An "audio interface" is not a home audio device. It is a recording studio device that converts microphone and instrument signals into a format your computer can take. On your computer, you use a digital audio workstation (a DAW), like Pro Tools, to record, edit and mix the music you are recording. On an audio interface, the analog outputs are meant to go to studio monitors (so you can monitor what is being fed into your audio interface) or other studio devices to add effects (like a compressor) that eventually go to your computer DAW later in the chain. The digital output is meant to go to your computer DAW, or other studio devices.

The audio interface's job is to bridge devices so they can communicate with each other. The audio interface just sends out a fixed digital signal; your computer deals with playback and volume later in the chain. Although on more expensive audio interfaces, they can allow you to adjust volume on the digital output. (Just like in your home stereo, your record player or typical Blu-ray player just sends out a fixed output; your receiver or preamp deals with volume later in the chain. But some expensive Blu-ray players will allow you to adjust volume on the digital signal they send out.) The digital inputs on an audio interface are usually meant for plugging in digital instruments, like a synth, without doing AD or DA conversion on its way to your computer DAW: it wouldn't make sense to convert your synth's digital output to analog, plug into the analog input for mics, then have the audio interface convert that right back to digital to feed into your computer DAW.

Home audio and pro audio gear live in separate worlds. It is often hard to mix things from both worlds. The Neumann KH120 II is pro audio gear, designed to interface with other studio gear. As an example, the Neumanns only takes XLR inputs, and audio interfaces often only have TRS or XLR connectors -- these are the typical connectors in pro audio gear. Whereas mass consumer home audio gear typically uses RCA connectors. For people wanting to use the Neumanns in a home audio system, the obstacle is that the Neumanns assume a studio environment where you can and do control volume earlier in the chain (like a computer DAW), while the home audio gear assumes a home entertainment environment where you can and do control volume later in the chain (like a receiver or stereo preamp). If you try to bridge the two worlds, there's a gap.

==

For the SMSL devices, you would need to check the manuals to see if the volume knob works on the digital output. But these devices are often not designed to do that. With home entertainment source components, the digital outputs are meant for feeding into an external, separate DAC you may prefer to use. In a home audio environment, it would be uncommon for someone to control volume before the DAC: you typically deal with volume after the DAC has converted the digital signal into analog, like in a receiver or stereo preamp later in the chain.

==

Some people commented on my original post that you can control volume on the Neuman KH120 II through the network interface. I should have been more clear that I was trying to have a physical volume knob to control volume, when feeding digital signal into the Neumanns. @staticV3 makes a good suggestion of using a USB volume knob on your computer source.

 

[boxerfan88]

I should have been more clear that I was trying to have a physical volume knob to control volume, when feeding digital signal into the Neumanns. @staticV3 makes a good suggestion of using a USB volume knob on your computer source.

Something like that might be what you are looking for:

I use it to control foobar digital volume on my computer source.

 

[rolltide]

You mean a physical volume knob?

You could always add a USB volume knob to your computer and that plus the PO100 would serve the same purpose.

Got it - I appreciate the recommendation. Thanks.

 

[rolltide]

The PreSonus and Focusrite devices are audio interfaces. Just because an audio interface has a volume knob and a digital output, that does not mean the device controls volume of the digital output. The volume knob is usually just for its analog outputs.

I looked at the online manuals for these two units. The volume knob controls volume on the analog outputs of these devices, but not their digital output. As I mentioned in my earlier post, I have not seen an audio interface under $2000 that can control volume on its digital output.

An "audio interface" is not a home audio device. It is a recording studio device that converts microphone and instrument signals into a format your computer can take. On your computer, you use a digital audio workstation (a DAW), like Pro Tools, to record, edit and mix the music you are recording. On an audio interface, the analog outputs are meant to go to studio monitors (so you can monitor what is being fed into your audio interface) or other studio devices to add effects (like a compressor) that eventually go to your computer DAW later in the chain. The digital output is meant to go to your computer DAW, or other studio devices.

The audio interface's job is to bridge devices so they can communicate with each other. The audio interface just sends out a fixed digital signal; your computer deals with playback and volume later in the chain. Although on more expensive audio interfaces, they can allow you to adjust volume on the digital output. (Just like in your home stereo, your record player or typical Blu-ray player just sends out a fixed output; your receiver or preamp deals with volume later in the chain. But some expensive Blu-ray players will allow you to adjust volume on the digital signal they send out.) The digital inputs on an audio interface are usually meant for plugging in digital instruments, like a synth, without doing AD or DA conversion on its way to your computer DAW: it wouldn't make sense to convert your synth's digital output to analog, plug into the analog input for mics, then have the audio interface convert that right back to digital to feed into your computer DAW.

Home audio and pro audio gear live in separate worlds. It is often hard to mix things from both worlds. The Neumann KH120 II is pro audio gear, designed to interface with other studio gear. As an example, the Neumanns only takes XLR inputs, and audio interfaces often only have TRS or XLR connectors -- these are the typical connectors in pro audio gear. Whereas mass consumer home audio gear typically uses RCA connectors. For people wanting to use the Neumanns in a home audio system, the obstacle is that the Neumanns assume a studio environment where you can and do control volume earlier in the chain (like a computer DAW), while the home audio gear assumes a home entertainment environment where you can and do control volume later in the chain (like a receiver or stereo preamp). If you try to bridge the two worlds, there's a gap.

==

For the SMSL devices, you would need to check the manuals to see if the volume knob works on the digital output. But these devices are often not designed to do that. With home entertainment source components, the digital outputs are meant for feeding into an external, separate DAC you may prefer to use. In a home audio environment, it would be uncommon for someone to control volume before the DAC: you typically deal with volume after the DAC has converted the digital signal into analog, like in a receiver or stereo preamp later in the chain.

==

Some people commented on my original post that you can control volume on the Neuman KH120 II through the network interface. I should have been more clear that I was trying to have a physical volume knob to control volume, when feeding digital signal into the Neumanns. @staticV3 makes a good suggestion of using a USB volume knob on your computer source.

TIL - thank you!

 

[rolltide]

Something like that might be what you are looking for:

View attachment 436175

I use it to control foobar digital volume on my computer source.

Thanks. Do you have a link to that product? I can't find it on https://www.fiio.com/category

 

[boxerfan88]

Thanks. Do you have a link to that product? I can't find it on https://www.fiio.com/category

Here you go, I bought mine from them.

https://a.aliexpress.com/_oB820CZ

 

[Miguelón]

Not sure if this is the best place to ask: I did the room correction of my KH120ii today, and this is the result:

View attachment 436009

I’m wondering whether I should further tweak this curve using the EQ in the Neumann software or leave it as is. I’m not entirely sure what is considered ‘good’ in terms of Hi-Fi—could this curve be very neutral and more suited for studio work?

In terms of Hi-Fi the curves are ‘preferences’, this one is how Neumann have chosen to a studio.

I personally prefer less prominent <150 Hz region, question of just 2 dB, I’m not sure but you can perhaps use presets in MA 1 software and switch between one and the other.

I don’t remember well, but time ago I red someone from the company saying that the curves are made to preserve the room character without forcing too much EQ and producing an excessive difference from what your brain is listening around you and the sound is emitted by speakers. That means if you’re in a really optimal treated room the curve will tend to be flattened.