Neumann KH 310A Review (Powered Monitor)

[oivavoi]

Interesting, thanks

You'd actually expect the steep filters to give them better vertical dispersion than the 8C. Was there something specific that was wrong with the vertical dispersion, if you recall?

No, and I don't think the vertical dispersion is worse than the 8C actually. It's more that it's a two-way on a flat baffle, and there's really only so much one can do with that when it comes to vertical dispersion, compared to well thought-out flat baffle three-ways, coaxials or omnis.

 

[Pritaudio]

i have the DM10’s and feel as though the cabinet and port is a let down while hearing some occasional distortion. I’m not too sure what it is technically, but cabinet design needs lots of r and d. I’m looking to replace my DM10’s with purifi amps and a choice of standmount passives. Work with distortion free amps and choose your speaker around them.
which is often the wrong way round to what people usually do.
but that way room interaction can be tailored too.

 

[oivavoi]

i have the DM10’s and feel as though the cabinet and port is a let down while hearing some occasional distortion. I’m not too sure what it is technically, but cabinet design needs lots of r and d. I’m looking to replace my DM10’s with purifi amps and a choice of standmount passives. Work with distortion free amps and choose your speaker around them.
which is often the wrong way round to what people usually do.
but that way room interaction can be tailored too.

Interesting! Looks like there's an avi gang her at asr Yeah, the DM10 are certainly not perfect speakers, but they are subjectively very enjoyable for me at least. I have made three attempts at upgrades, in my ongoing search for the perfect speaker, but every time returned to the DM10s after a while. I do expect that there will arrive an upgrade for me at some point though.

And you are right that "build system around amp" is not what most people here at ASR would recommend... but the purifi amp is excellent, and hopefully you'll find speakers that work great for you!

 

[Pritaudio]

Interesting! Looks like there's an avi gang her at asr Yeah, the DM10 are certainly not perfect speakers, but they are subjectively very enjoyable for me at least. I have made three attempts at upgrades, in my ongoing search for the perfect speaker, but every time returned to the DM10s after a while. I do expect that there will arrive an upgrade at some point though.

And you are right that "build system around amp" is not what most people here at ASR would recommend... but the purifi amp is excellent, and hopefully you'll find speakers that work great for you!

either that or Neumann kh120 with kh750 sub gives some dsp other than a mic for room correction.

 

[Bruce Morgen]

Can anyone briefly summarize what was changed/improved between the earlier KH 310 and the KH 310A?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Χ Ξ Σ]

Can anyone briefly summarize what was changed/improved between the earlier KH 310 and the KH 310A?

Thanks in advance!

KH310 = KH310A. A as in analog. Later came the KH310D, D as in digital, with an AES input, built-in DAC, and higher price.

 

[Bruce Morgen]

KH310 = KH310A. A as in analog. Later came the KH310D, D as in digital, with an AES input, built-in DAC, and higher price.

I appreciate the clarification -- there's a used pair on offer locally, so that's very good to know!

 

[Mawclaw]

One additional thing is that I have owned both an "A" and a "D". I confirmed over the phone with Neumann that the pair matching still stands between them and that sonically they are identical. I ended up swapping one of them but this is helpful if seeking them on the used market as often just one side will be available.

 

[BYRTT]

Thank you very much for the explanation! I understand the graphs show some asymmetries and i see why the right side of the left speaker seems a bit worse. Just to clarify: Suggesting i am always sitting centered in the sweet spot and have the monitors angled towards me - if the left speaker is on the left side this would mean that early reflections from the left wall would be a bit more controlled? So this would argue for placing the left speaker on the left side? Or did you mean something else?

.. print out KH 310 list of data below and place the papers on the desk to help map acoustics (right click and save to disk)..

Spinorama & detailed normalized listening window..

Spinorama & detailed Early flections..

Animated Polars..

Radars..

 

[DJBonoBobo]

.. print out KH 310 list of data below and place the papers on the desk to help map acoustics (right click and save to disk)..

Spinorama & detailed normalized listening window..

View attachment 95422

Spinorama & detailed Early flections..

View attachment 95432

Animated Polars..

View attachment 95424

Radars..

View attachment 95425
View attachment 95426

These are very nice diagrams that make the directivity characteristics very clear. But I was actually looking for an answer to the question of what conclusions can be drawn from them, whether or why there are advantages if the woofer points inwards. I don't know if you don't know the answer yourself or if you don't write it for didactic reasons .

But anyway, in my case this is not important anymore. I've done some experiments with the woofer outside the last days, but in my room it didn't work well. For me it's even better if the screen covers a part of the woofer than if the woofer is facing outside. But you probably can't generalize that.

 

[ehabheikal]

But we can still sort them by use case anyway the KH80 is clearly for nearfield suppose the KH310 could also go in a medium sized room for example . I could probably use them in my living room I have 2,4 meters to my current speakers .

But I do think we can consider the use case first then use preference rating for the speakers left in the contests ? If a forum member wants advice on speakers in a large room . He could naturally ignore a lot of the speakers tested here on ASR and focus on the ones suitable for larger spaces and long listening distances like the large revel’s and jbl’s that’s been tested and then consider the preference ratings.
Maybe there are more factors to consider, preferred dispersion, dead or very reverberant room ?
I think if one narrow down the field based on the application , the preference score could then become somewhat useful again ?

I used kh 80 dsp in a medium room and for me it works well in such a setting especially with sub

 

[yourmando]

I used kh 80 dsp in a medium room and for me it works well in such a setting especially with sub

If you could choose between the kh 80dsp vs kh 120a in the following application, which would you choose? (paired w/ kh 310, crossed over to sub array, expernal DSP via Dirac Live w/ Bass Control).

This speaker is amazing and I’m going to buy one as a center channel, along with the kh 120 or kh 80d as front heights to complete my front sound stage.

KH 310A will be in the far field at ~15 ft mounted above my large screen, but I think it should work fine in that application because I’m crossing over to a 3 subwoofer bass managed array, giving me about 7db more SPL capability.

I’m debating the kh 80d vs kh 120a to use as front heights to complement the 310a center.

What would you guys advise?

The kh 80 has a slightly more perfect frequency response and and is linear phase, while the 120 has more output capability.

These will again be used farther field than intended at about 9ft (35 degrees elevation from MLP), but with the subwoofers I’ll have ~7db more headroom for both. So the question is mainly whether I’d be pushing the kh 80 to too much distortion too often.

The heights would be used most of the time as I’m enjoying Auro 3d up mixing on almost everything these days. But the levels of the heights would always be lower than the mains with upmixing. They would also be used for Atmos content, but that is a less frequent treat and high levels would be occasional and content dependent.

Thoughts on complementing with the kh 80d vs 120a for this application? Thanks!
View attachment 95405

 

[Pearljam5000]

It's hard for me to swallow any speaker with a 4 inch woofer , it's just too tiny

 

[Sprint]

I used kh 80 dsp in a medium room and for me it works well in such a setting especially with sub

What are the dimensions of the room and what is your listening distance? Just curious and want to compare with mine

 

[ctrl]

But I was actually looking for an answer to the question of what conclusions can be drawn from them, whether or why there are advantages if the woofer points inwards.

The sound radiation is simply slightly different. The "short side" (short path to the next cabinet edge) radiates somewhat more evenly and broadly than the path over the "long side" with the woofer.

In Neumann's measurement the positive angles should represent the "short side".

 

[thefsb]

I'm not so sure. It all depends on how much direct sound vs reflections you like in your soup, kind of. Most people tend to like a fair bit of reflections, as it makes the sound feel more enveloping. For this reason, near-field speakers often benefit from broader dispersion. And given that the direct sound dominates, one can often get away with a dispersion pattern which is not perfect. On the other hand it's usually important that drivers are not too far away from each other, so they integrate on a short distance.

For the far-field, however, one will in any case get more reflections. Hence it becomes more important with even dispersion. And when listening far away, it may sound good with narrower dispersion, as this will give you more direct sound relative to reflections. It's also less of a problem with drivers placed apart.

A personal example: I purchased the D&D 8Cs speakers, and expected to really love them. To my great surprise, however, I found that I preferred my old AVI DM10 actives, which are inferior on paper on most accounts. Why? After much experimentation I found out that it was about my listening distance. I mainly listen in the nearfield, and given that the 8Cs have a narrower dispersion than the AVIs, they became too "dry" for my taste. In the mid/farfield, however, it was no contest at all. The 8Cs had a homerun and then some. Their stereo image was much superior when listening at a distance, because their dispersion pattern is more even and narrow.

This is very helpful, thank you.

 

[thefsb]

??? I was making an absolute statement. Not everyone wants to spend $4,400 on speakers+amps.

Yeah. In subsequent conversation we concluded as much.

[JK]However, that being the case you could have saved yourself one word : P

Yes, $4,400 for a pair of these speakers is a lot of money

[/JK]

 

[ehabheikal]

I bought the kh 80 because it was measured and the leap of faith in projecting the "quality" of the 120 from the two reviews of neumann speakers was not something i was interested in. Still the 80 has more powerful amps and digs too deep for its size and if you have an ipad you can dsp it. you are also limited to its internal 48K/24bit processing so higher bitrates will be lost.

But now after asking around i might have taken the plung for a bigger one.

Also if you go up to a 410 D you might not even need a sub for music

Anyway honestly this to me is one of the best purchases i have ever done my only gripe is having to decide to keep using them with a yamaha hs8s sub or get the neumann 750 dsp sub

ig you go with dsp sub then tou can get the analog kh 120 or above and the sub can act as dac ( optical or coax digital) to the kh and do the dsp room correction too for the room

One really offensive thing about neumann to guys like me is that the app is only avaiable for ipad is no android or even iphone or pc!

Waiting to burrow ipad

 

[ehabheikal]

I would actually appreciate if anyone has heard the yamaha hs8s subwoofer and the neumann kh 750 and can tell me if the upgrade is good enough for the price difference

 

[ehabheikal]

It's hard for me to swallow any speaker with a 4 inch woofer , it's just too tiny

Ds

What are the dimensions of the room and what is your listening distance? Just curious and want to compare with mine

4x5.5 meters was good on its own but amazing with a 8 inch yamaha studio sub