Networked NAS and Qobuz/Tidal connectivity via Enet to Mid/Higher Pre-Pro/AVR

[Fritzjr]

Please excuse my inexperience in this arena. I am learning!

I moved into a new (to me) house and hope build a HT downstairs in the daylight basement. I have wired the entire house with a Ubiquity based 10Gb Cat 8 Lan (there are 2 AP's as well but I'd rather not use them for music delivery) and have pulled 4 drops to the HT wall and new 20a dedicated circuits. I was hoping to add a 6Tb Synology NAS to this network (NIB) and be able to play hi-res FLAC and maybe AAIF audio files from it to my new system. I also was hoping to access Qobuz or maybe Tidal audio files the same way. I have been considering getting the Anthem MRX1140(or AVM70) to act as the Pre-pro for this new system using (if the 1140) a Buckeye 3 Channel amp for the LCR and using the 1140 amps for the surrounds/height channels. Anthem does not have Qobuz natively installed on any of their units so I would then possibly need to buy a separate streaming device (Eversolo DMP A6 Mstr Ed Gen 2/Cambridge CNX100SE/Arcam ST25/?) and then connect that to the 1140/70, but then I am told the Anthem units would basically reconvert the bitstream with their own internal DAC negating any added benefit of the external streaming device's better DACs - so basically money for nothing! Am I missing something? Marantz and Denon higher end processors evidently do have the Qobuz app on board, so in theory I could just plug say the Marantz Cinema AVRs or AV20 into my network and then be able to play Qobuz files without Wifi or Bluetooth, and no need for a separate streamer unit?? But I cannot do this with the Anthem units??

I also seem to be hearing that any multichannel music on the NAS will be converted to stereo at the HT system is that also true?

Thank you for your patience and hopefully helpful input!

 

[linuxfan]

I would then possibly need to buy a separate streaming device (Eversolo DMP A6 Mstr Ed Gen 2/Cambridge CNX100SE/Arcam ST25/?) and then connect that to the 1140/70, but then I am told the Anthem units would basically reconvert the bitstream with their own internal DAC

Yes, like most AVR's the MRX 1140 processes all inputs digitally - thus an analogue signal from an exteral DAC will go through an additional A-D/D-A conversion process.
And although some AVR's have an analogue bypass mode, Google tells me the MRX 1140 does not.

No problem - just use the streamer's coaxial S/PDIF output or optical S/PDIF output, into the MRX 1140's corresponding S/PDIF input.
In this configuration the DAC performance of your streamer is now irrelevant - it's being bypassed - so the WiiM Mini or Pro will give you just as good sound quality as the Eversolo/Cambridge/Arcam.

 

[Fritzjr]

No problem - just use the streamer's coaxial S/PDIF output or optical S/PDIF output, into the MRX 1140's corresponding S/PDIF input.
In this configuration the DAC performance of your streamer is now irrelevant - it's being bypassed - so the WiiM Mini or Pro will give you just as good sound quality as the Eversolo/Cambridge/Arcam.

Thanks Linuxfan! Let me see if I can fully unpack that quote and derive it's full meaning. So if I understand your statement correctly - if I buy any external DAC - priced anywhere from $250 to $2,500+ and use their coaxial S/PDIF output or S/PDIF optical output into the AVR or Pre-pro's corresponding S/PDIF input "the performance of the streamer is irrelevant - it's being bypassed". Meaning that the analog bitstream has been converted in the streamer to digital and sent via the S/PDIF connectivity thereby nullifying the entire usefulness of the external streamer? Is that what you are saying? If so, why have any external DAC of any price? Why not just use the potentially less optimum DAC in the Pre-pro? And how does that help with the fact that the Anthem units do not have Qobuz installed natively? Is my only choice of utilizing a direct Qobuz datastream over Ethernet directly into an AVR/Pre-pro eliminate using any Anthem product and I must go to either Denon or Marantz (or other?) to do so? I must be really confusing things.

I apologize in advance for all my confusion on this topic and really do appreciate anyone's and everyone's input to straighten me out in the basest language you can lol!

Thank you!!!

 

[linuxfan]

So if I understand your statement correctly - if I buy any external DAC - priced anywhere from $250 to $2,500+ and use their coaxial S/PDIF output or S/PDIF optical output into the AVR or Pre-pro's corresponding S/PDIF input "the performance of the streamer is irrelevant - it's being bypassed". Meaning that the analog bitstream has been converted in the streamer to digital and sent via the S/PDIF connectivity thereby nullifying the entire usefulness of the external streamer?

Oh dear. No.
A streamer decodes a digital signal carried over some form of network protocol into a standard digital audio signal - I2S PCM, to be precise. This digital signal can be output directly from the streamer - as coaxial S/PDIF, optical S/PDIF, or USB-audio, depending on streamer model. I'm recommending you take one of these, the coaxial S/PDIF, and feed it to the Anthem MRX 1140's coaxial S/PDIF input.
Of course the streamer can, and will, also convert this digital audio signal to an analogue audio signal via its inbuilt DAC ... but in the configuration I just explained the streamer's internal DAC is not necessary, and not being used. We are using a digital-to-digital connection.
Of course the audio signal will eventually be converted to analogue, courtesy of the Anthem's inbuilt DAC, before this signal is fed to your Buckeye amplifier.
There is no external DAC involved!

Here is the coaxial S/PDIF output of the WiiM Pro -

And here is coaxial S/PDIF input of the Anthem MRX 1140 -

 

[john61ct]

TL;DR

> why have any external DAC of any price?

Why indeed? Given your setup it would be throwing money away.

However that is not the case for the HPamp output from Wiim.

If you have fine phones, especially IEMs or hard to drive over-ears, and want to pay a little more for better SQ, then spend say $100-300 on a good quality combo DAC+HPamp.

I would feed it from USB myself but that depends...

 

[Fritzjr]

Oh dear. No.
A streamer decodes a digital signal carried over some form of network protocol into a standard digital audio signal - I2S PCM, to be precise. This digital signal can be output directly from the streamer - as coaxial S/PDIF, optical S/PDIF, or USB-audio, depending on streamer model. I'm recommending you take one of these, the coaxial S/PDIF, and feed it to the Anthem MRX 1140's coaxial S/PDIF input.
Of course the streamer can, and will, also convert this digital audio signal to an analogue audio signal via its inbuilt DAC ... but in the configuration I just explained the streamer's internal DAC is not necessary, and not being used. We are using a digital-to-digital connection.
Of course the audio signal will eventually be converted to analogue, courtesy of the Anthem's inbuilt DAC, before this signal is fed to your Buckeye amplifier.
There is no external DAC involved!

Here is the coaxial S/PDIF output of the WiiM Pro -
View attachment 554385

And here is coaxial S/PDIF input of the Anthem MRX 1140 -
View attachment 554386

Thanks for the great reply Linuxfan, but I am still a bit confused.

You are absolutely right in correcting that I said "Meaning that the analog bitstream has been converted in the streamer to digital and sent via the S/PDIF connectivity thereby nullifying the entire usefulness of the external streamer?" when I guess I should have said digital instead of analog,

But I'm still confused when in the next sentence you say: "Of course the streamer can, and will, also convert this digital audio signal to an analogue audio signal via its inbuilt DAC" I'm guessing you mean the external streamer can and will also do the D\A conversion at other times when not using the config you are showing?

Then finally, you say: "Of course the audio signal will eventually be converted to analogue, courtesy of the Anthem's inbuilt DAC, before this signal is fed to your Buckeye amplifier. There is no external DAC involved!"

So then if in the end the Anthem's DAC will do the final conversion anyway, then what is the value of the external DAC in this equation??

Sorry for my confusion on this topic!!

 

[voodooless]

So then if in the end the Anthem's DAC will do the final conversion anyway, then what is the value of the external DAC in this equation??

There is none (in your case), it’s just that most streamers come with one for free. You can choose to use it, or not.

Just get a cheap WiiM streamer, hook it up via SPDIF and be done with it. Anything except the WiiM mini has LAN. WiFi should work just fine as well.

Another simple option: go for a Denon or Marantz AVR/P. They support Qobuz natively.

 

[Timcognito]

No mention of GUI, streamers have them. Its nice to have an all music device and storage dashboard/remote.

 

[Redacted]

I'm just impressed with your 10G network! You can watch 100 8K videos all at the same time (guessing here)!

 

[voodooless]

I'm just impressed with your 10G network! You can watch 100 8K videos all at the same time (guessing here)!

And there is an upgrade path to 40G

 

[Fritzjr]

There is none (in your case), it’s just that most streamers come with one for free. You can choose to use it, or not.

Just get a cheap WiiM streamer, hook it up via SPDIF and be done with it. Anything except the WiiM mini has LAN. WiFi should work just fine as well.

Another simple option: go for a Denon or Marantz AVR/P. They support Qobuz natively.

Thanks Voodooless! I think I get it better now. I could use the streamers DAC or not, but no benefit if the less superior(?) Anthem DAC is going to override it anyway. I would rather not use Wifi except for some occasional use - not for most, and yes, although I really liked the AVM70 and the ARC-G laptop based config option, I may have to go with Denon or Marantz. What's up with Anthem and Qobuz anyway??

 

[Fritzjr]

I'm just impressed with your 10G network! You can watch 100 8K videos all at the same time (guessing here)!

Lol! It's based on the UBI 10G Cloud Gateway Fiber with matching Pro XG 10 switches and 2 U7 10G Pro XGs 8 stream Wifi 7 AP's all wiring, punchdown blocks and keystones CAT 8 compliant. But it's only internal!! Can't get faster Fiber to the house yet, so huge bottleneck there. Rats!!

 

[Timcognito]

Can't get faster Fiber to the house yet, so huge bottleneck there. Rats!!

I'm using Starlink on my ancient 2005 structured wired system $60/mo for guaranteed 200 mbs in my rural area and higher rates are offered depending where you live. They have a map that shows speeds anywhere in the world.

 

[Fritzjr]

I'm using Starlink on my ancient 2005 structured wired system $60/mo for guaranteed 200 mbs in my rural area and higher rates are offered depending where you live. They have a map that shows speeds anywhere in the world.

That's great, I'm glad it works for you. I won't give any of my $ to EM.

 

[voodooless]

I really liked the AVM70 and the ARC-G laptop based config option

Both Audyssey as well as DIRAC (ART) have laptop based config options as well. And most other options are available via a web interface or various apps.

This years models will measure significantly better than the Anthems as well, but it is unlikely to be very audible. The quality of the room correction is the biggest factor. All of these systems have certain pro and cons. All of them will need some experience to get most out of it. But ART is arguably the most advanced and should theoretically yield the best performance.

 

[Timcognito]

That's great, I'm glad it works for you. I won't give any of my $ to EM.

Yes my $120/mo 6mbs DSL was too hard to take. I feel the same way but as an engineer, I had to separate tech from the politics. Bezos and ATT will have a system soon.

 

[Redacted]

And there is an upgrade path to 40G

Don't go cheap and retro vintage on me here...

 

[Redacted]

I'm using Starlink on my ancient 2005 structured wired system $60/mo for guaranteed 200 mbs in my rural area and higher rates are offered depending where you live. They have a map that shows speeds anywhere in the world.

I recently upgraded to 1G up/1G down on fibre for £25 a month. I opted not to spend the extra on the 2Gbs they offered. I live on the very edge of the known world, so I guess 10Gbs is some way off from an ISP where I live for any reasonable cost.

 

[Timcognito]

I recently upgraded to 1G up/1G down on fibre for £25 a month. I opted not to spend the extra on the 2Gbs they offered. I live on the very edge of the known world, so I guess 10Gbs is some way off from an ISP where I live for any reasonable cost.

Europe has standards, we have the wild west where service is low, profit is high, and the measure of success. Also low population, with the ocean to 100 yards west, mountains 3 miles to east and north, and farms to the south I'll have left the planet before we get fiber, even with San Francisco just 20 miles North. We just got our Highway 1 repaved after 40 years and with my EV its really quiet and smooth when listening to music

 

[fatoldgit]

Europe has standards, we have the wild west where service is low, profit is high, and the measure of success. Also low population, with the ocean to 100 yards west, mountains 3 miles to east and north, and farms to the south I'll have left the planet before we get fiber, even with San Francisco just 20 miles North. We just got our Highway 1 repaved after 40 years and with my EV its really quiet and smooth when listening to music

I'm livin' the dream here in rural New Zealand... VDSL with Download Mbps of 23 and Upload Mbps of 6

All for $US 45 p/m.

It would appear that copper will be removed in 2028 and I will be stuck with wireless internet from a single provider...it's around twice as fast but when I tried it (with direct sight of the tower) it sucked... drop outs galore.

Now the kicker is my road is 1.2KM long and two years ago they laid 1GB fibre to the bottom half of the road... when queried why not the whole street.. it was a budget issue and the top half has just as many households as the bottom.

Still, with just me and the wife in residence ***, we don't stream aside from my Qobuz sub and a few Rugby games a year so VDSL is fine.

Peter

**** Ruby the Ridgeback occasionally looks at Lion videos on Youtube, just to imagine what a real hunt would be like